Originally Posted by Sulu

When we try to rate Toyota on innovation, again, we are at a slight disadvantage here in North America. As has been said, it seems to come in spurts from Toyota.

The 6-speed automatic on the 2007 Camry V6 was considered innovative at the time (very compact and lightweight). The 8-speed automatic on the 2007 LS was a world's first. The GR, ZR and AR engines, when first introduced, were ahead of their game. VVTi was innovative also, when first introduced. And, of course, the Toyota Hybrid System, which was a complete re-think and re-design of a hybrid drivetrain (rather than just substituting an electric motor for the torque converter in an automatic transmission), was ahead of its game.

But then, as we see other manufacturers catching up while Toyota has seemingly stayed stagnant (although Toyota's technology is still competitive), we complain that Toyota is not innovative.

But again, here in price-conscious North America, we get what we pay for, and Toyota, as a company that knows how to do business (and make money), will give us what they can afford to give us at the prices we are willing to pay. So Toyota will introduce new technology to us here in North America when it needs to, in order to remain competitive (and charge for it so that they continue to make money). As an example, updating engines seemingly every year (as the Germans seem to be doing) is expensive, and because Toyota's GR and AR engines are still competitive, they will not introduce new technology. They are now introducing new technology, though, with the direct-injected, on-demand Atkinson and Otto cycle engines, and turbocharging, which is technology that no other auto manufacturer offers. But keeping the same engine family code of GR and AR does not help, giving people the impression that they are not new engines.

What we have not seen -- because we were not willing to pay for it -- is what has been available on Toyotas in the rest-of-the-world. Toyota had direct injection on the AZ engine (now obsolete large 4-cylinder engine family) some years ago. Toyota has had the Valvematic continuously variable valve-timing and lift valvetrain for some years, and only now being introduced on the North American Corolla and Scion iM's 2ZR engine. Toyota has had a CVT available for years but only available now on the Corolla. Toyota has had an automated manual 5-speed transmission (a 5-speed manual with an automatic clutch release and shifting mechanism added to it) that we have not seen here.

So who says that Toyota is not innovative?

Why does Toyota not have a true, sequential-shift double clutch automatic transmission? Perhaps they are secretly working on one (and refining the hell out of it). I think it may have to do with patents. Various companies hold patents on the double clutch mechanism. Toyota does not buy technology from outside companies (thus avoiding having to pay licensing fees), but rather prefers to develop its technology with its own family of companies (such as the various Aisin companies for transmissions) so that it owns the technology itself.

Originally Posted by Maikerusan

Not sure I agree at all with this statement. I have been to a number of Toyota showrooms in Japan and find their prices comparable to at least Canadian prices. A lot depends on the state of the dollar vs yen, but still.

Heading to the Tokyo Auto Show in early November so will check out prices more closely then.