Another German guy leaves for Hyundai
#31
Lexus Test Driver
Hows i8 or GT high volume and RC-F low?
And how is Lexus not backing F, when they are fully backing F and they completely changed their priorities that push such cars.
You are simply incorrect.
At the same time you are expecting that Hyundai is changing their company around hiring one engineer.
Pretty much confirms what I said.
And how is Lexus not backing F, when they are fully backing F and they completely changed their priorities that push such cars.
You are simply incorrect.
At the same time you are expecting that Hyundai is changing their company around hiring one engineer.
Pretty much confirms what I said.
For reasons completely unknown to me, you are intent on emotionally defending Lexus to the point that you are not only claiming I said things I never did, but doing so in a context completely irrelevant to both the OP and my posts. If you want to change the context of my posts into a discussion about Lexus' direction, create a new thread for it - don't do it here. And give me at least the most basic modicum of respect and actually read my posts instead of accusing me of saying things I didn't.
Last edited by gengar; 12-24-14 at 04:42 AM.
#32
You will note that 1) I did not say anything about the i8 or GT being high volume; 2) I did not say anything about Lexus not backing the F marque; and 3) I did not say that Hyundai will change their entire company because of one engineer - in fact, I said the exact opposite is quite possible.
For reasons completely unknown to me, you are intent on emotionally defending Lexus to the point that you are not only claiming I said things I never did, but doing so in a context completely irrelevant to both the OP and my posts. If you want to change the context of my posts into a discussion about Lexus' direction, create a new thread for it - don't do it here. And give me at least the most basic modicum of respect and actually read my posts instead of accusing me of saying things I didn't.
For reasons completely unknown to me, you are intent on emotionally defending Lexus to the point that you are not only claiming I said things I never did, but doing so in a context completely irrelevant to both the OP and my posts. If you want to change the context of my posts into a discussion about Lexus' direction, create a new thread for it - don't do it here. And give me at least the most basic modicum of respect and actually read my posts instead of accusing me of saying things I didn't.
Just look at Lexus - even with engineers capable of making great cars via skunk works / pet projects like the IS-F and LFA, what has come since or is even in the pipeline? Nothing.
it's still only playing catchup with the Germans. Plus, the low production volume of the RC-F is a farce, so if they do the same thing with the GS-F
Meanwhile, BMW and MB took huge steps forward with the i8 and GT. I think Lexus had a lot of chances to capitalize here and is failing to do so,
Well, it sure looks to me like you did say all those things. But if you did not, or you meant something different than what you wrote, then I apologize... thats how it reads like though.
In any case, not worth arguing about.... Merry Christmas!
#34
There's no need to try again-I was right. I specifically said "helped" and not "tuned". One only needs to look at the just released Kia Sedona to see that they still don't get it across model lines.
About the Genesis- As Car and Driver pointed out below, the car was significantly improved after Lotus was brought in. Talent doesn't just encompass the physical ability to make changes, but the ability to take the whole picture into perspective.
That's no small contribution. It was Lotus who told them how to put the pieces together. Hyundai carried out the recommendations.
http://blog.caranddriver.com/2015-hy...oit-auto-show/
About the Genesis- As Car and Driver pointed out below, the car was significantly improved after Lotus was brought in. Talent doesn't just encompass the physical ability to make changes, but the ability to take the whole picture into perspective.
That's no small contribution. It was Lotus who told them how to put the pieces together. Hyundai carried out the recommendations.
http://blog.caranddriver.com/2015-hy...oit-auto-show/
#35
Lead Lap
Whatever learning they gleaned from Lotus will certainly be helpful, but bringing in someone in the last year of development for ONE vehicle does not make a bunch of experts. This does not mean Kia/Hyundai is all the sudden going to know how to tune sports suspensions, economy cars, or even vehicles with different suspension setups for that matter. I would imagine the Sedona wouldn't have emerged with classic Kia suspension tuning if the entire engineering department in both companies suddenly became virtuosos.
They're going to need a leader who is skilled in this department and can bring consistency across models and leadership to address the one major gap I think Hyundai/Kia has. Hopefully Albert Biermann is the guy.
Last edited by TangoRed; 12-25-14 at 07:08 PM.
#36
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by nipponbird
By the way I'm not Japanese, but from European descent.
Dutch (Boer), I'd assume?....... since you're in South Africa.
Nobody thought it would ever happen, but today the Japanese make a much more "charactered" car than the Europeans and very reliable as well.
Last edited by mmarshall; 12-25-14 at 07:16 PM.
#37
This may help the brand, but I doubt it will make any changes in the sales department. Just look at Lexus, to this day, many people cannot accept Lexus as performance / sport oriented brand. Even after the release of the LFA. What other asian brand ever released a car like that?
#38
The hiring of overseas talent is by no means a new thing by Hyundai. Back in the late 60s when they wanted to start making their own cars the first thing they did was go out and recruit the MD of British Leyland and five of his top engineers. The more recent recruitment of German stylists and engineers continues that.
#39
Lexus Fanatic
The hiring of overseas talent is by no means a new thing by Hyundai. Back in the late 60s when they wanted to start making their own cars the first thing they did was go out and recruit the MD of British Leyland and five of his top engineers. The more recent recruitment of German stylists and engineers continues that.
No offense, Big Andy, and don't take this the wrong way (I know you live in Britain). But you probably know how unreliable British-designed vehicles were back then. If THAT's where Hyundai was getting much of their assistance and direction from, no wonder they their own vehicles, back then, were equally unreliable.
#40
Lead Lap
Thanks. Interesting. I wasn't aware of that.....but it DOES help explain something.
No offense, Big Andy, and don't take this the wrong way (I know you live in Britain). But you probably know how unreliable British-designed vehicles were back then. If THAT's where Hyundai was getting much of their assistance and direction from, no wonder they their own vehicles, back then, were equally unreliable.
No offense, Big Andy, and don't take this the wrong way (I know you live in Britain). But you probably know how unreliable British-designed vehicles were back then. If THAT's where Hyundai was getting much of their assistance and direction from, no wonder they their own vehicles, back then, were equally unreliable.
#41
Lexus Fanatic
There must however, be something to the British car, otherwise the Germans wont try to save some of them from extinction.
#42
The hiring of overseas talent is by no means a new thing by Hyundai. Back in the late 60s when they wanted to start making their own cars the first thing they did was go out and recruit the MD of British Leyland and five of his top engineers. The more recent recruitment of German stylists and engineers continues that.
#43
Haha. Don't oversimplify things. It's a good start.
Whatever learning they gleaned from Lotus will certainly be helpful, but bringing in someone in the last year of development for ONE vehicle does not make a bunch of experts. This does not mean Kia/Hyundai is all the sudden going to know how to tune sports suspensions, economy cars, or even vehicles with different suspension setups for that matter. I would imagine the Sedona wouldn't have emerged with classic Kia suspension tuning if the entire engineering department in both companies suddenly became virtuosos.
They're going to need a leader who is skilled in this department and can bring consistency across models and leadership to address the one major gap I think Hyundai/Kia has. Hopefully Albert Biermann is the guy.
Whatever learning they gleaned from Lotus will certainly be helpful, but bringing in someone in the last year of development for ONE vehicle does not make a bunch of experts. This does not mean Kia/Hyundai is all the sudden going to know how to tune sports suspensions, economy cars, or even vehicles with different suspension setups for that matter. I would imagine the Sedona wouldn't have emerged with classic Kia suspension tuning if the entire engineering department in both companies suddenly became virtuosos.
They're going to need a leader who is skilled in this department and can bring consistency across models and leadership to address the one major gap I think Hyundai/Kia has. Hopefully Albert Biermann is the guy.
Unlike Japanese manufacturers, Koreans are willing to hire outside talent to work for them.. Japanese prefer to do it in-house.
This is actually good for Koreans, but they do need to actually become serious about their Luxury brand.. and if they do, it will take them at least 10 years to develop several model lineup, and 15-20 to compete with everyone.
I think they should do it, and do it right now.
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