akhi2003

Guys, I read in couple of places that Lexus is bringing a new model based on RAV4
If it is true it will be dilution of the brand image. Lexus never had a I4 engine in USA like Acura and Infiniti. What is the need to have a vehicle that costs less than RX350 and have 400K sales per year which dilutes the lexus brand image. I feel Lexus should not launch that vehicle in USA.

Grumpa72

It sounds as if you are more worried about the "snob appeal" (don't get offended until you finish my post!) or image than you are about choices, including a low cost SUV. For instance, is a Honda Pilot the same vehicle as an Acura MDX? They share some commonality and heritage but they are as different as apples and oranges. Why can't Lexus take the RAV4 upscale and give us a lower cost, more fuel efficient SUV for our daily around town driving?

There is more to being one up on your friends with the car you drive.

Just my two cents worth.

Gary

Lexmex

Although true about the I4 in the USA, this is not the first time that an SUV will sport a 4 cylinder among Toyota/Lexus. TheRX300 in Asia known as the Harrier had two engine sizes, the 1MZFE we all know, the 2AZFE (a 4 cylinder version found on Harriers from 11/2000 until 2/2003 with 160 hp I think a 2.4 L) and a 5SFE (a 4 cylinder version found on Harriers from 12/1997 until 11/2000 with 140 hp I think a 2.2L).

I will withold judgment until I see more about what Lexus is planning, however I share your concern.

In Mexico, there was a model called the A160/190 from Mercedes (now the B200) and it was a small vehicle never sold in the U.S. (a little smaller than a SMART), but I have no doubt that had it come to the U.S. it would have diluted MB's brand image. The A2 Audi is another one, but we do not have that here in Mexico.

rxdriver

I haven't heard about anything smaller than the RX - just bigger.

Rumor has it that the Lexus JX 470 will appear for 2007. This will be a new SUV based on the Toyota Sequoia.

A model called VX might appear in 2008. I believe that one is based on a concept car. It is supposed to be a sport wagon, a little larger than the RX, with a 6- or 8-cylinder engine.

I agree that nothing with a Lexus badge should have only 4 cylinders, not because of brand image but out of practicality. I just can't see people paying the Lexus premium for something smaller. There have been plenty of postings here about whether the RX is too small and the GX would be more suitable for some people. The RAV4 comes with 6 as an option now, so I don't think a Lexus version of the RAV4 would be all that bad, but I can't see it selling very well.

akhi2003

Autospies has the article regarding new Lexus base on RAV4. I am not talking about snob value here. When Lexus broke 300K sales mark in 2005 many people are concerned that Brand image will be diluted. In other forms people are talking about increasing Lexus prices so that they compete head to head with MB and BMW. And Lexus is introducing a smaller vehicle to compete with the upcoming Acura RDX. That is my concern. I am a huge lexus fan and I have owned only Lexus Vehicles in my entire life.

rxdriver

I feel that the luxury brand image comes from quality, service, innovation, and luxury features - not artificially low sales levels or higher prices.

Based on that definition, the 2004 RX330 was one of the worst things for Lexus' brand image, as it had way too many first-model-year bugs and rattles for a luxury brand. People thought that it would be a Canada vs. Japan thing, as the RX330 would be the first Lexus made for North America outside the Japan homeland. Well, it wasn't - both plants made 2004's with too many annoyances. As time has gone on, the bugs have been ironed out, and the country of manufacture really isn't an issue. Dealers have been able to fix the problems, but it's been a hassle to keep taking the car back to the dealer. I have to say, though, that the service is there. My Lexus dealer has been very good about taking care of problems quickly, and it's a much more pleasant experience going to a Lexus service shop as opposed to the Toyota dealer. (I say that somewhat biased by the fact that I haven't had to spend any serious money at the Lexus dealer!)

One thing that is interesting is how many of the luxury amenities found on the Lexus products are making their way into mainstream Toyota models. I remember when the first Highlander came out, which was the "Toyota version" of the RX300, there was night and day difference between the number of options available on the two cars. Today, I'm surprised how many Lexus-like features are available on the Limited version of the Highlander. And navigation systems, once a luxury-brand-only feature, are now showing up on several Toyota models. In an accident, I'd be suffocated by all of the airbags in the RX330, but now side and side curtain airbags are available on just about everything. Honestly, I'm inclined to seriously consider Toyota's the next time I buy a car, because they've "caught up" to Lexus with a lot of features I've come to rely on from my RX's.

To keep up the level of distinction, Lexus needs to keep introducing new features. For example, whatever happened to night vision? GM tried it a long time ago, and more recently Lexus offered it on the LX. In another thread, someone said they were surprised the RX doesn't have power folding outside mirrors. I agree, even though the RX should fit nicely in just about any garage. It's one of the many new convenience toys that the Lexus brand should have. Sure, it doesn't apply to my garage, but how about the car wash? Or on-street parking, to make them that much less of a target? Other cars, including other Lexus models, have heated and cooled seats - where are the cooled seats in the RX350? And why, oh why, is the audio system so far behind? Very inexpensive cars and some new Toyota's now have an 1/8" stereo input jack for an MP3 player. The RX350 will finally play MP3's on CD's, but what took so long? Answering these questions are kind of thing that sets Lexus apart from Toyota.

Lexus has the service, and if you discount 2004, the quality. I think innovation is where Lexus needs to spend their resources now. We're hearing about the other models coming up, but they need to be more than high-end Toyota's - they also need features that make the premium price worthwhile. Lexus features make their way into Toyota's after a few years, so the entire company actually depends on the Lexus brand to keep raising the bar.

TunedRX300

RX is a market following model. It is no longer a market leader as in 1999, when it was the only SUV that drives like a sedan. This means Lexus does not put cutting edge technological feature by design. For example, IS/GS 350 get the state-of-the-art 2gr-fse, RX350 gets only the 2gr-fe, same engine that is in Avalon for 2 years. No push button start/wireless key sensing as in the IS. You will also never going to find forged OEM rims (Subaru WRX STI) , massive 13.5" brake w/ 4 piston monobloc calipers (Porche Cayenne). All we get are features that everyone else have for 2-3 years.
If you check other threads, there are plenty of owners that could not wait and extremely excited about RX350.

JZA80MHU38

If it's RAV4 based, it can still be V6 equipped. RAV4 in Japan is loaded with nice features... CVT with 7-speed sequential shifter, shift logic linked with GPS (downshift if sees a tight curve coming up) are couple example.

But I won't buy a car without rear bumper/impact absorber

I predict that the Acura RDX will have some impressive sales figure. With a turbocharged inline-4 it's focused on performance. Customer in this sector (small SUV) are more likely to concern about cargo space to put their activity gears in than passenger space and comfort. If Lexus can come up with something that fit the demand, why not?

But Lexus, please, PLEASE, capture the moment and be the market leader to get us a luxurious AWD minivan. Get us the Toyota Alphard or Estima here.

Lexmex

The B200 Mercedes sold down here in Mexico (successor to the A160/A190) is 190 hp turbo and is getting good sales now. I finally got to drive one at neigborhood dealership and this thing flies. Hopefully, the RDX comes down here to the Acura dealership for me to get a try.

TunedRX300

Lexmex, you must read my mind. Acura RDX's 2.3 turbo V4 cranks out peak 240 hp and 260 ft-lbs torque, SH-AWD, 19" alloy rims, perforated leather, 5 speed Sequential Sport Shift tranny, and a front 4 piston caliper brake. Having a V4 in the lineup does not dilute brand equity. RDX will put many V6 SUVs in shame and would enhance Acura's brand.

Lexmex

I agree. I think in the case of Mercedes, their A-Series was way underpowered (unless you went with a post-dealer Brabus modification) and did dilute. The B200 looks and drives like a Mercedes should. The RDX should help Acura a bunch.

Interesting to note, I have an Acura dealership that I can literally hit with a stone from my apartment building. I know the guys over there and I always asked why they don't have the RSX, just the MDX, TL and RL. A decision was made by Honda Mexico to introduce those models first and not the RSX as they felt the RSX would have diluted the image of Acura in Mexico(they want to be seen as a BMW or Mercedes here since that is the main luxury competition), but it will come in the following year A lot of track buddies with VTEC Civics are just waiting until they can get one of them to start modding.

I will still withhold judgment on Lexus putting out this 4 cylinder vehicle, as I want to see what the finished product is.

JZA80MHU38

The RDX's engine is an inline-4, not a V4, just FYI.

19" for that car is a little overkill though, and too much unsprung weight.

Lexmex

I don't know if 19" is too much unsprung weight. Depends on how fat those tires are.

TunedRX300

I stand to be corrected. I4 turbo it is. But my point is that RDX's 4 cylinder engine is not ordinary. It is not 4 little hampsters treading the wheel, these are 4 hampsters on steriod that kick V6's butt including 3mzfe, which full 1 Liter bigger in displacement

Lexmex

The I4 powered SUVs at my track are my biggest competition and come very close to me. Keep the weight down in these things and you have one fast little vehicle.