rickm430

I'm a newbie to this board, please be patient with a long question. I need some advice from the experts out there in Tire Land!

The car is an '02 GS430 with stock 17" rims and Bridgestone RE 030's. The climate in Vancouver is not exactly snowy, but it happens a couple of times a winter......and it rains the rest of the time. I found the stock tires to be positively dangerous when the temperature started to drop below 40 oF last year, even when it wasn't raining hard. On even 1" of snow, I could barely move the car. Did I mention that Vancouver is a hilly town? The way I see it, there are three options:

1) Retire the RE 030's early, and put on a really good set of all seasons like a Michelin Pilot A/S (Others?). They won't perform as well at the limit in the sunshine as a summer tire, but well enough, and I can at least get home to the garage when the snow starts. How much performance will I give up by going to an all season?

2) Buy a set of winter wheels and tires. If I lived in Montreal, this would be a No Brainer. I'm leaning this way, but don't want to layout $2K for a set of OEM wheels and tires that I will use for 10 weeks a year. If I look at aftermarket 16" rims, which ones do I go for? Tirerack.com calls the cheapos on their site "Silver Painted", which I assume means steel. Will a steel rim have unsprung weight issues that screw up something? Given that performance isn't an issue for the ten weeks when it rains every day, what tire size/wheels make sense?

3) For the same money I could wax the GS, put it in the garage, and buy an '87 Dodge pickup to drive in December and January. Just kidding really.


All suggestions and advice gratefully accepted!

Rickm430

shftup

I live in Regina, Sask., I ride on 19" this summer, and recently purchased the Yoko AVS winter tire, we have no snow yet, but all of the reviews look great. I purchased 235/45/17 for the factory chrome wheels. The tire looks very solid, and should wear excellent. Van. weather, during your mild winters, the tires will hold true, going up or downhill. From my own digging around, the AVS winters are more of a slush, rainy, light frost, light snow tire, which is most probably want you want. Not only this, but they should last 2 or 3 good winter seasons, unlike the other softer winter tires. I don't think you need to go to a 16' rim, the tires can be bought from Kaltire, and should run about 950.00 CAD, with everything said and done.

Good luck and Happy Hunting....
Kam
PS, I tried the Pilots, they suck, no traction what so ever, even in snow mode!

rickm430

Kam:

Thanks for the insight. If the Pilots are useless, then separate winter tires seem like the way to go. Surely new rims are a good idea? You can't reliably swap rubber on and off an alloy rim three times without breaking something can you?

Rickm430

PS: I grew up in Winterpeg......you've got cold out your way that the folks elsewhere woudn't believe!

shftup

Hey Rick;

Actually last winter was the mildest that i have every seen......and u r totally right, central Canada has some of the worst winters around.

Which respect to changing rubber, yah it takes longer 2 do, and yah u run more risk of wheels damage, but on the other hand, you still have the original lexus wheels on the GS, no potential risk of having a cheap(not as worthy) set of wheels on, and maintain the lexus ride and quality.

Just be totally **** about the rubber changed, tell them that u will, pay the extra money for the change over, and u shouldn't have any issues. For example most tire shops charge a surcharge for taking extra time, patience, and care when doing a rubber changeover. Kaltire does this, and it even carries an added issurance should anything go wrong with the process.

What I usually do, it go right to the top dog, at the store, tell them straight out that, I am totally ****, anything stupid that happens it absolutely unacceptable, then ask them if there are still confidence in your potential business and if they say, YES, u r good 2 go.

As well, I usually ask to oversee the changeover, upfront to ensure that nothing goofy is going on.

One thing u will notice if you go to a 16" rim, that the car will drop substaintially, and be quite a bit lower 2 the ground. If u like the existing ride hieght, comfort, ride quality, THEN THE 16" RIMS ARE OUT. The car will bounce around alot more, and lose alot of the wayvey fell. U will feel more of the road as well.

Hope this helps.
kam
PS. if money isnt really a big deal, trade in your old tires, buy some really good all season tires, then for the summer, buy some 18's or 19's, and get the l-tuned suspension.....hehehe

rickm430

I know what you mean about the ride change with 16's. I drove a GS3 with factory 16's and it was a MUCH softer ride. OK, I'll bite...Why will the car be lower with 16's??? Smaller wheel + More sidewall = same Outside diameter, right? The thing with 16's is that in heavy rain or snow, Skinny tire = good thing. I'm thinking 16 x 6.5 will allow a 215/60 to work out. Not pretty, but very functional when the rain starts.

Rick M

shftup

Sorry for the delay in response.

The reason is that, the actual wheels sit lower on the car, right...


It just works out that way, the whole geometer of the car, is adjusted that way.

I hope that answer the question...so what r u going 2 do?

later
Kam

rickm430

Kam:

I'm gonna go the 16's route I think. I'm confused about the geometry thing. Seems to me that the size of a 235/45R17 (stock) is about the same as a 225/55R16 (GS300 stock) or a planned 215/60R16 from a diameter viewpoint. How can the car tell if its sitting on rubber or aluminum if the total outside diameter is the same? Maybe I just don't get it!? Found a decent deal on some Mille Meglia 16x7's locally, now gotta find the rubber...

Rickm430

shftup

Well, this is sorta what happens, i think.....

The overall diameter is exactly the same or very close anyways, this point is agreed. What happens is that the center of the wheel is adjusted, let me explain.

What happens is because less of the rim is there....and more of the tire is apparent, the center of the wheel, will sit lower on the hub.
Hence, when u move to a larger wheel, the car actually sits higher, because more rim is there vs. the tire. And vice versa. So when u move to a smaller rim, and more tire is there, the car will sit lower becuase the actual 'center' of the rim is now in a new location with respect to the hub, which is where the rim is mounted to the car itself. So this is how the geometery of the car is adjusted, per say.

You see, my previous car(honda accord), had 17" summer rims, and 15" winters.....I had coil overs for a suspension set up, and when ever i put the 15" wheels on, i had to raise the car back up, because is sat much lower to the ground then the ride height setup with the 17 summer wheels on.

To prove this, what u can do, is take any set of wheels, which have a similar overall diameter, and put them together, and guarenteed the center of each rim will not match, as they will be in different locations which respect to one another.( if they were the same, all the holes on the wheels will match exactly, right?)

Not sure how much of a different, but expect at least 1" lower from my experience(from an accord).

As well, what u can do, it go to the pics forum, and look at DrewGS4, he has the l-tuned drop, with original 17" wheels, then compare it to someone who has the l-tuned drop with 18' or 19' wheels, and u will c the difference.

Happy hunting for rubber.
Kam

shftup

Any luck......did u stick with the 16's....?

rickm430

Kam:

Sorry, been on the road for a couple days. I decided to stick with the 16's. I know you hot rod/tuner types won't approve, but in the end, in the winter I just need to get around. NTW had to order the Pirelli W-210's which look like a decent compromise. They'll only see snow a few times, and I get to keep some handling performance at least. Rims are CSA 16x7 five spoke, a lot like the OEM rims. These are light and solid, if not exactly awe inspiring.

On the other hand, I found myself drooling over the 18" wheels on the Mille Meglia and BBS racks. Lets see....17's go back on in March.......the stock tires will be toast by about June......anybody want to buy some 17" OEM rims?

Rickm430

shftup

Have a PM, hit me back.......