chetlexus

I decided to purchase a set of ADR M sport hyper silver wheels for my 1995 SC 400 from Dragon Wheels.com. My initial plan was to go with the 18x8.5 front & 18x9.5 rear. After talking to the salesman he somehow convinced me to go with the 18x8.5 rear and 17x7 front to save money. I purchase the tire package that inclued 265/35/18 & 235/45/17. Upon receiving these wheels I noticed a distinct difference in the lip size. The 18x8.5 measures about 2 1/2 " and the 17X7 about 1/2". This makes it look like two different wheels. Was i wrong to think that because the front and rear were different sizes the lip size would be relatively the same? Every website I visited while pricing these wheels show the wheel with the deep lip and many sites offer them in sizes ranging from 17 to 19". Never have I seen a picture of an ADR M Sport that look like the 17" I have in my garage. I saw a set of 17" on e-bay and the picture being used to advertise the auction shows it with the deep lip. I can tell you the seller in that auction is being deceptive. It obvious many of the sellers of these wheels got the picture from the ADRwheels.com website and use it in their advertising.

I talked to the saleman about returning the wheels and there is a 15% fee on the sale price plus the cost of shipping. In my mind this was deceptive advertising and I don't feel I should have to pay a penalty for a product sent to me that don't look life the product being advertised. Am I being to critical here? Was this truly my fault? Comments please!

aliga

iTrader: (147)

your fault for letting hime dupe you. when he said to get an inch smaller in the front, you should have hung up on him.

2jzsc3

yea.. i do alot of sales online also, but i don't do business that way. Yesterday, some guy was telling me about the same exact scam.. sell stuff.. and when the customers complain, tell them to send it back with a 25% restocking fee and shipping.. he says most ppl just keep it, if not, you make the 25%.. its a big scam out there.. becareful!!!!!!!!

Fred Smith

It's your fault. Of course if you have a skinnier wheel on the front, with the same offset, the lip will be smaller. I have 8s on the front and 9s on the back, and the front lip is an inch shallower. It's just geometry. I don't blame him for wanting a restocking fee, who wants to buy wheels that have already been on the road? If you want the same size lip front and back, you have to buy the same width wheels, or a lesser offset, which will foul the guards. If you didn't notice the lips, or tell him "they have to have the same depth lips", how the hell is he supposed to know? He sold you perfectly normal wheels, that are exactly as to be expected. Wider wheel = wider lip. Duh.

The advertising is not deceptive. Different width and offset wheels will of course deviate from the photo. He can't show you a picture of every single size and offset of the wheel, now, can he? Buyer beware, and buyer be more educated about what you are buying.

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

Did you put the wheels on the car? If so why if you didn't like the look? SHopping over the phone or the net calls for extreme caution and research. Next time you'll be wiser.

chetlexus

No I have not mounted the wheels. I know that would make sending them back impossible.
I did some research and here are the offsets for each wheel

17x7 - 40mm offset

18x7.5 43 - 48 offset

18x8.5 - 35mm offset

18x9.5 - 35mm offset

19x9.5 - 35mm offset

19x9.5 - 35mm offset

Fred Smith - Are you saying the individual on e-bay, or any of the other websites selling the17" ADR M sport with an obvious photo of a wheel that has a 35mm offset is not being deceptive? I guess my definition of deception and your obviously differ.

aliga

iTrader: (147)

if you bought the rims on your cc, dispute the charges, give that a shot.

good luck.

Fred Smith

Anyone who knows anything about wheels knows that different models of the same wheel, in different widths and offsets, have different lip sizes. It's in the very definition of a wheel. Just because you didn't do your homework on the product you are buying - that is - you didn't take the time to learn about wheels - it is not the vendor's problem. It is the nature of the product that lip sizes will vary when you ask for different width wheels (and you did)! What is he supposed to do, magically make the rules of physics change? YOU ASKED FOR DIFFERENT SIZED WHEELS AND YOU GOT THEM!

If you try a charge back on your credit card, 99% chance you will eventually be told to stick it where it fits, and be charged a lot of fees for wasting their time. I know, I used to work for credit card companies. The merchant will be told to show that he delivered a suitable product for the order on time and at the price agreed, and to your address. He will be able to do that. You ordered that product, and you got exactly that. He has done nothing wrong. He can reject the charge back, the card issuer can go to arbitration with him (but they probably even will reject it up front), and he will win. He can meet his burden of proof, and then all the expenses will fall to the issuer, and guess what they will do with them.

It's like if you order a pair of 235/45s for the front, and 295/45s for the back, and then complain that the sidewalls are different heights and look stupid. It's cos you didn't stop and think and learn about what you bought before you bought it. What is a tyre vendor supposed to do, put photos of every single size of tyres in their advertisements. No. People are meant to learn about what they order, before they buy it. If you can't do that, next time go to a wheel store and look at them and make sure you like them before you buy. This is why mail order is cheaper than going to a store.

NEXT TIME ASK AND LEARN

Fred Smith

You hit the nail right on the head there.

Look, I'm sorry you screwed up, but it was your "Major Mistake", not the wheel store's.

legendary

Fred,

Thanks for your assistance. You have a PM.

ChetLexus, for future reference, before making any investment, especially one of this nature, be sure to do some homework. This information is posted ALL over this forum. If you have any questions, check the TireRack Forum or www.intellexual.net.

Lots of info there...

Secondly, this is a good thread as well:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...threadid=62341

mikeloc24

And that's all that needs to be said. Sorry dude but you did make a huge blunder. Live and learn I guess

Try and see if you can just send back the fronts, that will save you on shipping and restocking. You'll most likely just have to absorb the cost of the return shipping and the bigger rims. That's the best you can hope for really. Good luck.

greenspan

I understand the initial blunder but the salesman should have known the setup would look like *** and have made a better suggestion. To do a correct staggered setup, you need 1-pc wheels built with that in mind or three pieces.

agapepaga

haha oh man that is classic

mkorsu

Yo man, I think you are being WAY too harsh bro!!!. Yes, the rule is always buyer beware, and you should ALWAYS do your homework before purchasing anything. But, you're making it sound like ChetLexus is some kind of moron!! Maybe he just F'd up one time!?! Bro, we all make mistakes and I know we all like to jump on deals regarding our cars. Maybe just cut him some slack and advise that he needs to do some more research before buying. Don't assault him like he's a Civic owner!!!

Fred Smith

Did I not repeatedly say he needed to learn more next time? Did I call him names and laugh at him like a Civic owner? No. My exact point is NOT that he is a moron, it IS that he F'd up one time. After his initial response, I feel he did not understand my point that this was his fault. I am not trying to say he is a moron, I am trying to say that this one time IS his fault. That is all I am debating here.

If you care to read the whole thread, you will notice my first post is quit concise and not heated at all. Yes, I did say "duh". I apologise if that hurt anyone's feelings - I don't think "duh" is the harshest word (well, kind of a word) in the English language though. Then he replied and re-accused the vendor of deception. Yes, I do feel strongly about this, as I am a businessman myself. This was not deception, this was a case of the buyer not knowing enough about the product. That vendor's reputation is being tarnished here with words like "deceptive". That is why my second post was a lot more verbose, and spelled out my feelings a lot more clearly.

There are still some facts about wheel lips that people are not quite understanding. I think you guys need a definition of offset.

greenspan: 1 piece, 3 piece, custom, does not make any difference. If you have 2 different width wheels with the same offset, as is needed by the SC/Soarer/Supra, one MUST have a shallower lip. This is because the hub surface, by definition, is closer to the outside of the car on the narrower wheel. No getting around that. This is the very nature of the product.

chet: "with an obvious photo of a wheel that has a 35mm offset". I don't think you are understanding this quite correctly yet, so I am going to try and help out by giving you the info. You cannot judge offset by just seeing a photo of a wheel. Offset does not refer to lip size. I think this is where you are going wrong? If you have an 8 inch wheel with 35 offset, and a 12 inch wheel with 35 offset, the 8 is going to have about 1/2" of lip and the 12 is going to have like 2.5 to 3 inches of lip. This is because offset is the distance that the hub is placed, from the centre of the width of the wheel. That is, an 8 inch wheel with zero offset will have the hub surface 4 inches from the outside of the wheel, and 4 inches from the inside of the wheel. A +35 offset moves the hub surface 35mm towards the viewer (ie less lip). Thus, an 8 inch wheel with +35 will have the hub surface 4 inches - 35mm from the outboard side of the wheel. Take off the thickness of the hub, and you've got almost no lip left. A 10 inch wheel will have 5" - 35mm. Therefore, another inch of lip.