Volkswagen diesel scandal
#1
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Volkswagen diesel scandal
Feds allege widespread Volkswagen cheating on clean-air rules
Source: Autoblog.com
The reader comments following this type of article are always interesting. One reader wonders how VW could sell so many Diesel models while other automaker have not, because they (the reader mentioned Honda and Mazda) failed to meet the EPA's emission regulations. He believes that this could be the reason: VW cheated while Honda and Mazda followed the rules but could not legitimately develop Diesel engines clean enough (without urea SCR).
Volkswagen intentionally installed software in nearly a half-million diesel vehicles that helped the cars evade substandard results on emissions tests, the federal government charged Friday.
The Environmental Protection Agency issued a notice of violation to the German automaker, saying the company's software broke the law by violating two provisions in the Clean Air Act. Circumventing the standards meant affected cars emitted as much as 40 times the allowable level of certain pollutants. [Ouch!]
Both the EPA and California Air Resources Board have launched investigations. In its notice of violations, the EPA said Volkswagen officials admitted to installing and concealing what they call a "defeat device," which was designed to detect when the cars were undergoing official emissions tests – and only turn on emissions controls during that time.
"Our goal now is to ensure that the affected cars are brought into compliance, to dig more deeply into the extent and implications of Volkswagen's efforts to cheat on clean air rules, and to take appropriate further action," said Richard Corey, executive officer of CARB.
The allegations cover approximately 482,000 vehicles sold in the United States over the past seven years. Cars involved include diesel versions of the Jetta, Beetle, Audi A3 and Golf manufactured between the 2009 and 2015 model years. Passats manufactured for the 2014 and 2015 model years are also included. Federal officials note there is no safety danger to motorists, but the cars will be recalled for repairs.
If true, Volkswagen faces a fine that could run in the hundreds of millions of dollars -- likely higher than the $300 million charge the EPA levied last November at Hyundai and Kia for exaggerating the fuel-economy in several models. The charges also put a tremendous dent into the company's plans to increase sales of its "Clean Diesel" vehicles in North America. In a written statement, Volkswagen Group of America acknowledged it had received the notices from the EPA and CARB. "VW is cooperating with the investigation; we are unable to comment further at this time," it said.
Federal officials said the defeat-device software was uncovered during an independent analysis by researchers at West Virginia University, who in working with the International Council on Clean Transportation, a non-governmental organization, raised questions about emissions levels.
Earlier this month, EPA and CARB say they demanded explanations for the identified problem, and Volkswagen admitted the cars contained the defeat devices. In its Notice Of Violation, EPA officials described the software as a "sophisticated algorithm" that could detect when a car was undergoing official emissions testing, but would then "greatly reduce" the effectiveness of pollution-control devices during other normal driving situations.
"Using a defeat device in cars to evade clean air standards is illegal and a threat to public health," said Cynthia Giles, assistant administrator for the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance. "Working closely with the California Air Resources Board, EPA is committed to making sure that all automakers play by the same rules."
The Environmental Protection Agency issued a notice of violation to the German automaker, saying the company's software broke the law by violating two provisions in the Clean Air Act. Circumventing the standards meant affected cars emitted as much as 40 times the allowable level of certain pollutants. [Ouch!]
Both the EPA and California Air Resources Board have launched investigations. In its notice of violations, the EPA said Volkswagen officials admitted to installing and concealing what they call a "defeat device," which was designed to detect when the cars were undergoing official emissions tests – and only turn on emissions controls during that time.
"Our goal now is to ensure that the affected cars are brought into compliance, to dig more deeply into the extent and implications of Volkswagen's efforts to cheat on clean air rules, and to take appropriate further action," said Richard Corey, executive officer of CARB.
The allegations cover approximately 482,000 vehicles sold in the United States over the past seven years. Cars involved include diesel versions of the Jetta, Beetle, Audi A3 and Golf manufactured between the 2009 and 2015 model years. Passats manufactured for the 2014 and 2015 model years are also included. Federal officials note there is no safety danger to motorists, but the cars will be recalled for repairs.
If true, Volkswagen faces a fine that could run in the hundreds of millions of dollars -- likely higher than the $300 million charge the EPA levied last November at Hyundai and Kia for exaggerating the fuel-economy in several models. The charges also put a tremendous dent into the company's plans to increase sales of its "Clean Diesel" vehicles in North America. In a written statement, Volkswagen Group of America acknowledged it had received the notices from the EPA and CARB. "VW is cooperating with the investigation; we are unable to comment further at this time," it said.
Federal officials said the defeat-device software was uncovered during an independent analysis by researchers at West Virginia University, who in working with the International Council on Clean Transportation, a non-governmental organization, raised questions about emissions levels.
Earlier this month, EPA and CARB say they demanded explanations for the identified problem, and Volkswagen admitted the cars contained the defeat devices. In its Notice Of Violation, EPA officials described the software as a "sophisticated algorithm" that could detect when a car was undergoing official emissions testing, but would then "greatly reduce" the effectiveness of pollution-control devices during other normal driving situations.
"Using a defeat device in cars to evade clean air standards is illegal and a threat to public health," said Cynthia Giles, assistant administrator for the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance. "Working closely with the California Air Resources Board, EPA is committed to making sure that all automakers play by the same rules."
The reader comments following this type of article are always interesting. One reader wonders how VW could sell so many Diesel models while other automaker have not, because they (the reader mentioned Honda and Mazda) failed to meet the EPA's emission regulations. He believes that this could be the reason: VW cheated while Honda and Mazda followed the rules but could not legitimately develop Diesel engines clean enough (without urea SCR).
#3
Lexus Fanatic
How's that any different from private car owners who install aftermarket chips, then take them out once every two years to pass any EPA-required tests in their area?
Though I don't condone cheating, I actually have some sympathy for VW on this one. EPA has become absurdly overbearing in the last several years, and IMO is making unreasonable demands on the auto industry. They have already all but dried up the V8 markets....now V6s as we knew them are also gradually being phased out. If VW (or any other automaker) is, in effect, giving them the Bronx Salute, it is probably deserved.
Though I don't condone cheating, I actually have some sympathy for VW on this one. EPA has become absurdly overbearing in the last several years, and IMO is making unreasonable demands on the auto industry. They have already all but dried up the V8 markets....now V6s as we knew them are also gradually being phased out. If VW (or any other automaker) is, in effect, giving them the Bronx Salute, it is probably deserved.
Last edited by mmarshall; 09-18-15 at 02:34 PM.
#4
not only that, but to make these engines compliant with EPA rules, VW will have to add urea devices which will cost them billions... Autonews estimated possible 18 billion in warranty costs for VW in the USA.
#6
Lexus Champion
I would think they'd also have to do something as a goodwill gesture to effected owners adding to the cost.
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#9
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
Ouch. As far as I know, VW was the only manufacturer that made a diesel engine that complied with modern emissions requirements without using urea injection. If they so blatantly cheated, they are going to be in the world of trouble. And this is just in US, I can only imagine what happens in European markets where they sell a lot more diesels. I don't know if Euro requirements are as strict as EPA, but if they cheated on those as well, then they pretty much dug a grave for themselves.
#10
Ouch. As far as I know, VW was the only manufacturer that made a diesel engine that complied with modern emissions requirements without using urea injection. If they so blatantly cheated, they are going to be in the world of trouble. And this is just in US, I can only imagine what happens in European markets where they sell a lot more diesels. I don't know if Euro requirements are as strict as EPA, but if they cheated on those as well, then they pretty much dug a grave for themselves.
However, rest assured that they are certainly cheating there as well. There was big article in Autobild this year on research from large German university on how NOx emissions are 10x bigger in real life testing than minimum allowed by EuroVI (while fuel consumption is 30% bigger - so they are not directly related) and nobody cared because nobody dares to touch car industry in Europe. Very fragile for most part and millions of people employed.
And big thing of EuroVI was especially NOx treatment and lowering output by 3x. It turns out that in real life, they are as bad as diesels from 10 years ago (not all cars, but many).
They also found out that turbo petrols from German manufacturers now polute more than diesels, due to lack of DPF and EU keeps extending the rule where petrols are not tested on particles, to give more time to manufacturers. Apparently turbo petrols with high pressure direct injection produce ultra fine particles that cant be seen but are as bad for health as diesel ones.
#11
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
they are not as strict in Europe, so all manufacturers can do smaller engines without urea systems.
However, rest assured that they are certainly cheating there as well. There was big article in Autobild this year on research from large German university on how NOx emissions are 10x bigger in real life testing than minimum allowed by EuroVI (while fuel consumption is 30% bigger - so they are not directly related) and nobody cared because nobody dares to touch car industry in Europe. Very fragile for most part and millions of people employed.
And big thing of EuroVI was especially NOx treatment and lowering output by 3x. It turns out that in real life, they are as bad as diesels from 10 years ago (not all cars, but many).
They also found out that turbo petrols from German manufacturers now polute more than diesels, due to lack of DPF and EU keeps extending the rule where petrols are not tested on particles, to give more time to manufacturers. Apparently turbo petrols with high pressure direct injection produce ultra fine particles that cant be seen but are as bad for health as diesel ones.
However, rest assured that they are certainly cheating there as well. There was big article in Autobild this year on research from large German university on how NOx emissions are 10x bigger in real life testing than minimum allowed by EuroVI (while fuel consumption is 30% bigger - so they are not directly related) and nobody cared because nobody dares to touch car industry in Europe. Very fragile for most part and millions of people employed.
And big thing of EuroVI was especially NOx treatment and lowering output by 3x. It turns out that in real life, they are as bad as diesels from 10 years ago (not all cars, but many).
They also found out that turbo petrols from German manufacturers now polute more than diesels, due to lack of DPF and EU keeps extending the rule where petrols are not tested on particles, to give more time to manufacturers. Apparently turbo petrols with high pressure direct injection produce ultra fine particles that cant be seen but are as bad for health as diesel ones.
Good information. Only reaffirms my opinion that 3uz-fe is the best engine ever created.
#12
Lexus Test Driver
Got to love it when so called "law and order" pundits get conflicted with their "big business" can do no wrong agenda. If VW cheated, they deserve everything that comes their way as far as consequences.
#13
Lexus Fanatic
Simply cutting VW here a little slack doesn't necessarily mean they can do no wrong. Actually, I myself have been critical of VW of America in the past for sticking American customers with unreliable electronics/hardware, a rather low quality of dealer-service, and what is IMO some unnecessarily restrictive marketing, especially with the unavailability of 4Motion AWD on many vehicles that should offer it here. But, at the same time, EPA has become unreasonable in the demands they are placing on automakers, and we live in a country that is supposed to have at least some restrictions on government. That's not saying that big business can do no wrong......and, as far as the "big" is concerned, VW's arm in the U.S. is not that big at all. In other parts of the world, it is much larger.
#14
Lexus Fanatic
It's VASTLY different, only a small percentage of people install aftermarket tuner chips, every single car VW rolls off the assembly line has the cheat built it. On having sympathy, hell no every auto maker has to adhere to the same standards. VW is cheating to gain a market advantage, similar to what Hyundai did when they lied about their mileage ratings.
#15
Lexus Fanatic
On having sympathy, hell no every auto maker has to adhere to the same standards. VW is cheating to gain a market advantage, similar to what Hyundai did when they lied about their mileage ratings.