Continuing SCaga or should I sue NTB=bad brakes?
12-23-17, 04:31 PM
#1
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
Continuing SCaga or should I sue NTB=bad brakes?
This is a long one, so I'm pasting my complaint for a chargeback to my citi/NTB card which went in yesterday. YOu can scroll to the bottom for my chief question, and happy new year:
On 13 October 2015, NATIONAL TIRE AND BATTERY OF NATICK MA 01760
did the following work for me:
-Replaced my brake pads/rotors and r/r calipers/clips and tie rod and alignment on my 2002 Lexus SC430 passenger car). The goods supplied as part of this contract are inferior in quality, performance and installation to the car as it was before bringing it there.
I have had to take it to a factory authorized repair shop because of NTB's failure to admit these parts were making horrendous noise and excessive wear and tear-apparently b/c the front calipers (pad parts) were misaligned, and the brake pads/rotors were inferior, causing loud judder or rubbing/excess noise and other tin can noises when car started from a standstill or driving downhill.
The brake caliper ***’y was observed (yesterday on a lift at Lexus) as so bad that it kept the brakes partially engaged, even without my foot on pedal-likely adding wear and noise because of the poor installation. The techs at Lexus demonstrated by showing me how the front wheels wouldn’t even spin by hand when in the air because of the faulty brake replacement/reinstallation. Other connections for the parts were observed by factory atech as not to OEM standards, including poor bolt connections covered by excessive grease gun rather than proper, OEM connectors, causing other creaks and groans.
Back in October, a few days after the first NTB ‘service, the shop staff disagreed with its own manager (after I came in to complain)who’d put non-full ceramic pads on. Although he put on FULL ceramic aftermarket pads, he drove the car again, and denied noises still present. Of his putting on lesser than factory quality grade parts, others in his shop said “we don’t know why..he put a different part code than is called for”, replacing the pads without charges, (though they had initially threatened that I’d have to pay “pro-rated” amount for what was on my pad’s remaining life). The noises continued, unabated, despite my driving the car gently as an egg truck for several hundred miles.
I emailed the BIG O/NTB/MERCHANTS tire group and complained the Natick store was not tending to this car properly and had seriously degraded it with its insistence on inferior aftermarket parts. I posted this complaint around Thanksgiving and did not hear back except by auto reply for three weeks!
I went to the Natick store, where I asked the manager for their store manager to replace with Toyota/Lexus brake pads/rotors and tie rods, and he nded me a business card, and NO ONE called me at all to discuss (I had even offered, per my knowledge of their policies, to' pay for the “pro-rated portion” of my pads/rotors).
I then emailed NTB and was given a phone call several days later by the “district area manager”, who set up a 3rd appointment at another shop in Newton, Mass, knowing I’d expected him to replace all parts with Toyota/Lexus originals. The Natick shop had apparently balked at working with me on the car to rectify the complaints!
The Newton shop DID NOT REPLACE my parts with effective and adequate OEM parts-lying to me about what NTB corporate said they WOULD do!
Moreover the technician drove the car after he did his “work” on it, admittedd it was “noisy”, and kept me there another hour while he was making some further “adjustments”. When I drove the car on their hilly street, the noises were actually worse (I have a video of the sounds while driving!). The Newton store told me they would only look again if “I left the car a whole day”, which was incredibly inflexible given my increased distance, work and time impediments, when it was clear the shop lied to me about replacing parts to factory norms.
I would like you to refund my Citi card for the cost of the so called ‘repairs and parts’. Please note I am providing a total which does not include their tire purchase/install, as that appears to be about all they could have done correctly!
My understanding is you can take up to six weeks to complete this request. Please let me know you are processing. If you can be of no help, I will have no option but to consider taking the matter further against the merchant.
Now, having spent at least $1400 at Lexus Northborough MA to correct the caliper, brake pads/rotors etc back to stock, the CAR IS FINALLY FREAKING QUIET AS IT WAS ORIGINALLY AND SHOULD BE!! In my chargeback request, I didn't include the new Michelins and install, since that is apparently the only thing NTB can do right. I told Citi I'm asking "only" $710 for brakes rotors align, etc. What I have been wondering about is, since I spent a total of $2200 at Lexus, who wrote a fact pattern of the poor equipment and install by aftermarket shop (NTB), it occured to me ....why am I paying for the calipers which Lex did parts/labor on=over $300? I didn't put their payment on a c. card, and I'm not talking about complaining to them...they did great work...but since I put it on a different card, although I don't believe I could have kept driving the car the way it was without further damage (see under siezed calipers meaning brakes were on ALL THE TIME in rotation!!).
To fight for the caliper replacement costs, does that leave me only small claims court? I'm confused as to whether the Lexus saving-grace work is something I just need to absorb with my wallet-going to court about calipers alone isn't much worth when it costs over $100 to file!!!
My answer thus far is to wait and see if the credit card accounting/dispute dep't sees in my favor in the next couple of months. IF they are sidestepping, usually being stiffs about whether there's some other rocket scientist to prove 1.1correspondence bet. the bad work and sounds, brakes wearing down, etc, etc. IF they don't find me in favor, then yes, I will be hopping on my local court for about 2K, rather than giving up on the Lexus rehab work being worth fighting for reimbursement over.
Glad you solved that for me..take care, happy 2018!
On 13 October 2015, NATIONAL TIRE AND BATTERY OF NATICK MA 01760
did the following work for me:
-Replaced my brake pads/rotors and r/r calipers/clips and tie rod and alignment on my 2002 Lexus SC430 passenger car). The goods supplied as part of this contract are inferior in quality, performance and installation to the car as it was before bringing it there.
I have had to take it to a factory authorized repair shop because of NTB's failure to admit these parts were making horrendous noise and excessive wear and tear-apparently b/c the front calipers (pad parts) were misaligned, and the brake pads/rotors were inferior, causing loud judder or rubbing/excess noise and other tin can noises when car started from a standstill or driving downhill.
The brake caliper ***’y was observed (yesterday on a lift at Lexus) as so bad that it kept the brakes partially engaged, even without my foot on pedal-likely adding wear and noise because of the poor installation. The techs at Lexus demonstrated by showing me how the front wheels wouldn’t even spin by hand when in the air because of the faulty brake replacement/reinstallation. Other connections for the parts were observed by factory atech as not to OEM standards, including poor bolt connections covered by excessive grease gun rather than proper, OEM connectors, causing other creaks and groans.
Back in October, a few days after the first NTB ‘service, the shop staff disagreed with its own manager (after I came in to complain)who’d put non-full ceramic pads on. Although he put on FULL ceramic aftermarket pads, he drove the car again, and denied noises still present. Of his putting on lesser than factory quality grade parts, others in his shop said “we don’t know why..he put a different part code than is called for”, replacing the pads without charges, (though they had initially threatened that I’d have to pay “pro-rated” amount for what was on my pad’s remaining life). The noises continued, unabated, despite my driving the car gently as an egg truck for several hundred miles.
I emailed the BIG O/NTB/MERCHANTS tire group and complained the Natick store was not tending to this car properly and had seriously degraded it with its insistence on inferior aftermarket parts. I posted this complaint around Thanksgiving and did not hear back except by auto reply for three weeks!
I went to the Natick store, where I asked the manager for their store manager to replace with Toyota/Lexus brake pads/rotors and tie rods, and he nded me a business card, and NO ONE called me at all to discuss (I had even offered, per my knowledge of their policies, to' pay for the “pro-rated portion” of my pads/rotors).
I then emailed NTB and was given a phone call several days later by the “district area manager”, who set up a 3rd appointment at another shop in Newton, Mass, knowing I’d expected him to replace all parts with Toyota/Lexus originals. The Natick shop had apparently balked at working with me on the car to rectify the complaints!
The Newton shop DID NOT REPLACE my parts with effective and adequate OEM parts-lying to me about what NTB corporate said they WOULD do!
Moreover the technician drove the car after he did his “work” on it, admittedd it was “noisy”, and kept me there another hour while he was making some further “adjustments”. When I drove the car on their hilly street, the noises were actually worse (I have a video of the sounds while driving!). The Newton store told me they would only look again if “I left the car a whole day”, which was incredibly inflexible given my increased distance, work and time impediments, when it was clear the shop lied to me about replacing parts to factory norms.
I would like you to refund my Citi card for the cost of the so called ‘repairs and parts’. Please note I am providing a total which does not include their tire purchase/install, as that appears to be about all they could have done correctly!
My understanding is you can take up to six weeks to complete this request. Please let me know you are processing. If you can be of no help, I will have no option but to consider taking the matter further against the merchant.
Now, having spent at least $1400 at Lexus Northborough MA to correct the caliper, brake pads/rotors etc back to stock, the CAR IS FINALLY FREAKING QUIET AS IT WAS ORIGINALLY AND SHOULD BE!! In my chargeback request, I didn't include the new Michelins and install, since that is apparently the only thing NTB can do right. I told Citi I'm asking "only" $710 for brakes rotors align, etc. What I have been wondering about is, since I spent a total of $2200 at Lexus, who wrote a fact pattern of the poor equipment and install by aftermarket shop (NTB), it occured to me ....why am I paying for the calipers which Lex did parts/labor on=over $300? I didn't put their payment on a c. card, and I'm not talking about complaining to them...they did great work...but since I put it on a different card, although I don't believe I could have kept driving the car the way it was without further damage (see under siezed calipers meaning brakes were on ALL THE TIME in rotation!!).
To fight for the caliper replacement costs, does that leave me only small claims court? I'm confused as to whether the Lexus saving-grace work is something I just need to absorb with my wallet-going to court about calipers alone isn't much worth when it costs over $100 to file!!!
My answer thus far is to wait and see if the credit card accounting/dispute dep't sees in my favor in the next couple of months. IF they are sidestepping, usually being stiffs about whether there's some other rocket scientist to prove 1.1correspondence bet. the bad work and sounds, brakes wearing down, etc, etc. IF they don't find me in favor, then yes, I will be hopping on my local court for about 2K, rather than giving up on the Lexus rehab work being worth fighting for reimbursement over.
Glad you solved that for me..take care, happy 2018!
12-24-17, 01:20 PM
#2
Moderator
All I can say based on my previous experience with them is to stay away from NTBs.
12-24-17, 02:26 PM
#3
12-24-17, 07:07 PM
#4
Lexus Test Driver
Hope you succeed in the refund of your money...that will make it a late but Merry Christmas for you...
Last edited by Bgw70; 12-25-17 at 01:31 AM.
12-25-17, 11:18 AM
#5
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
thanks
Yes, happy driving free and clear of unscrupulous persons under your car (i.e poor quality mechanics/parts)..although I am crossing fingers, I think I have a pretty strong case-of course, you get what you pay for, and Lexus in Northborough MA cared enough to repair the very best=no brake NOISES now!
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