KahnBB6

iTrader: (5)

The honest truth is that those compliments you have read about the 1997-2001 Prelude Type SH are very accurate. The Active Torque Transfer System (aka a late 90's version of a yaw-sensor based torque vectoring system using the equivalent of tiny little versions of auto transmission clutch packs in an externally mounted differential on the side of the transmission) does actually make the car handle in a very neutral manner unlike an open diff FWD car and also unlike a mechanical limited slip diff FWD car.

It's not the same thing as the car being RWD but imagine if you still had a little bit of FWD torque steer but not a lot... and also imagine that when your average FWD car might understeer through a turn the Prelude SH will kind of muscle its way through that turn like a bulldozer shoving your outside wheel with something like up to 70% or so of available torque. The torque distribution through the ATTS differential is linear, variable and smooth so how much torque gets shoved to one wheel or the other totally depends on where you're pointing the car via the steering wheel and how much engine power is being applied. Of course it's not a lot of torque at a max of 156 ft-lbs from a 200hp engine but that H22A engine is an addictive thing to rev and it works well with Honda's unique active differential. Everyday drive-ability with that engine was very good.

Any FWD car with an LSD is going to be very good also -- and some Prelude owners did prefer an aftermarket Quaife LSD to the Type SH's ATTS -- but it truly is a unique differential system and since I can speak from years of experience with one of them... yes it's very good. It does not make the Prelude into a RWD car. Only having drive wheels in the rear can do that. However it does make the car handle in a very neutral way. The secondary VTEC lobes engage at 5200rpm and redline is 7200rpm meaning you have some very good revs to work with from 2.2L to use that chassis in the curves.

I became a much better driver with that car. I eventually really wished it weren't FWD and turbocharging or supercharging it given the work required to make either form of FI reliable wasn't affordable to me. But the longer I owned it and drove it the more I realized that, no it wasn't RWD and no it wasn't fast. But it was quick and for the 3050lbs and low 156ft-lbs of torque it moved decently and handled REALLY well.

Once I had it set up on a Koni Yellow + Ground Ground Control coilover suspension with aftermarket Suspension Techniques front and rear sway bars and good high performance summer tires (you MUST use a reasonably good high performance tire on that car-- and never wait until they're bald to change them) it did amazing things on all the mountain roads I took it on from New Mexico to Nevada to southern and northern California mountain roads. It was a dream to drive in those environments and the ATTS system did have a lot to do with it.

The reason I gave you some caution with buying an ATTS car is because I am not sure that everyone took good care of them. There is ATTS diff oil that needs periodic changes (IIRC it was some blend of auto transmission fluid but I don't remember well offhand) and not everyone actually did the fluid changes. Caring owners did. Some neglectful ones did not do it ever which in some cases led to problems.

I did have my Prelude from brand new until 140k miles (when someone crashed into the rear and totaled it for me) and I was very strict about the maintenance schedule and checking the oil, ATTS fluid etc. and I had no issues with mine except when I went over a bad bump once and the diff system got an error. I pulled over, shut the car off, turned it over again and no problems ever more after that. In my own experience it was super reliable.

However when I went to replace my Prelude I first started looking for another Type SH. At the time (2010) I wasn't finding good examples in the same shape I'd kept my car and the very last one I looked at was advertised in glowing condition cosmetically and mechanically but once I saw it in person it had hail damage and once I got in to drive it it was running rough and the ATTS error light was on. I drove it maybe 200 feet from her driveway and that was enough to tell the car felt terrible and abused compared to the one I'd just lost. I turned right around and parked it back in the owner's driveway. She wanted $6k or maybe even $7k for it and I looked her in the eye and explained to her that having owned one since new for 10 years I knew exactly what a $7k Prelude Type SH should look and feel like and that she would be wise to lower her price considerably if she wanted to make a sale. I explained part by part what was wrong with it and she had... nothing much to say in response except, "So I take it you aren't interested then?". I looked at her blankly.... blinked once and replied, "No... I'm afraid not."

That car had something like 75k-85k miles on it at the time I went to look at it. A 1997 I think. It had far less mileage than my deceased Prelude had but the owner/seller had managed to just trash it in comparison. Moral of the story: if you're looking for one, find one that was taken care of well and given its proper maintenance. It is a car that you don't really need to modify engine-wise in order to get the best out of it so condition matters. Oh yeah, and the front lower control arms do usually need to be replaced due to age and wear... just the same as with SC's that haven't had theirs ever replaced.

Sometimes things happen for a reason. After that bad shopping experience the next car I looked at was my SC300 which was only 1/3rd of my purchasing budget at the time. It needed a lot of work at first but I knew what it was and was happy with it.

Anyway the the 97-01 Prelude SH is nearly as unique as you have heard. It was one of the best FWD cars I've ever driven and owned.

Styling wise I can't argue with you there as it's all down to individual taste. Personally I loved the styling once I added the OEM optional front lower lip. It had the wing stock on the SH. I never changed the exterior other than that. At the time I was really in love with the Nissan Skyline R34 GT-R's and their styling (well... I still am but I'm not rich either, haha) and the conservative boxy looks of the Prelude BB6 I felt were pretty cool once I added that lower front lip and lowered the car about 1.5".

But the looks are what they are. Definitely unique but if they don't appeal then that's that. You have to love something or many things about the car you'll get.

Like you I also love the look of the SC's too. Also exceptionally unique.

The MR2's are going to be more expensive for sure, especially the 1990-1996 models. Realistically I think it's the Turbo versions and especially 90-92 Turbos that have the issues with the snap oversteer. The sway bars should be more tame on the non-turbo models but I could be wrong. The 2.2L 138hp 5S-FE in the non-turbo is the same engine used in the 1992-1996 Camrys of the same era. Peppy engines in the MR2 despite what you'd think but definitely not on the same level as the 3SGTE's in the turbos.

Check out a website/parts service for MR2s called PrimeDriven and do some research on what the upkeep will cost you before you start looking for one. At the end of the day they are still mid engine so owning one, if affordable and insurable, you'd just want to get very good at understanding how the weight transfer on those cars is totally different from a FWD, RWD or an AWD front engined car.

On the financial side, to be fair, an SC300 isn't exactly cheap to maintain either but it is easier to master at the wheel and when you do have little issues that pop up, as long as you fix them right they stay fixed for another 25+ years. MR2's being 90's Toyotas are also going to be quality and reliable cars. They just have a lot of unique parts, especially the cosmetic bits.

Hmm. It's odd that he'd pull it and relist higher but maybe he's thinking few people saw the ad? Or maybe what he's doing is listing it at $4200 with no "firm" this time because he's fully expecting people to want to talk down any price he lists (pretty common to encounter when selling an SC I'm sad to say) so likely if you approach him he's still going to take no less than $3500 anyway. Which, considering the market and what it takes to maintain, restore and modify these cars in the first place, is pretty reasonable assuming the body is clear of any accident history.

KahnBB6

iTrader: (5)

^^ Thanks for mentioning this too rentaro! I guess I'd assumed it had already been covered but...

Definitely consider the fuel economy of an SC300 too. They take premium 91-93 octane gas. The fuel tanks are all 20.6 gallons. With my 5-speed I usually got around 15-16mpg in the city. Average 21-22mpg highway.

^^ That factory stereo aux-in mod is great. Rentaro, did you add your USB port(s) in the space under the center arm rest lid?

The power steering... I just gave my SC a new PS rack and new PS pump last month myself. But both were original from 1993. Some advice, OP: if you ever do have to replace the steering rack on an SC, buy a reman rack from Lexus. They rebuild them right. DO NOT buy a reman PS rack from anywhere else. New polyurethane power steering rack bushings for an SC you can buy from Figs Engineering.

KahnBB6

iTrader: (5)

ChezC,

This video below is an excellent example of what the 1997-2001 Prelude Type SH (the ATTS version) is capable of. Everything they discuss factually and in terms of the owner and reviewer impression are all 100% accurate. As is their mutual agreement that the car may not be truly fast but is so addictive and fun to drive. It really is.

Also, the way this owner has his car set up is totally the right way to do it. It looks nearly stock inside and out and even the wheels are stock to the SH. The factory seats are perfect and have excellent bolstering for control while cornering.

I agree with the owner that he would opt for a lighter weight flywheel. I did this also but one made in chromoly steel that was 13.5lbs. This was down from the 21-22 lbs factory Honda flywheel. Aluminum lightweight flywheels aren't worth it. (also just to mention: SC300 W58 5-speeds in contrast don't need a lightweight flywheel-- an OEM steel flywheel are ideal in an SC manual).

I don't agree with the SH owner's use of cheapo no-name tires (especially since the directional treads were installed backwards and they're driving in the rain!) and strongly recommend good name brand high performance summer tires with good rain traction.

But other than that everything else that he has done is exactly how I would do it.... and did. He is missing the dealer optional OEM body color front lower bumper lip though. The car looks incomplete without one.

Testament to a great and affordable 2+2 sports coupe that is actually the real deal.

Now that said, we are on an SC forum so maybe I should post a couple of videos how how a stock engine SC300 set up well but simply can do things that a Prelude cannot