2JZGE Na-T TT Ecu Mod
05-07-14, 01:29 PM
#1683
***UPDATE***
So just to update you guys. Originally I installed my JDM supra ecu with the factory injectors and it was running very lean and didn't want to idle properly, and drove sluggish, very poorly.
Today I did two things:
Replaced the spark plugs with fresh BKR7EIX's, kept the stock gap at .31-.32
Installed my osidetiger 550cc injectors.
These were the only two things replaced and I pulled the battery to reset the ecu.
Cold started the car, fired first try idling low in the 3-400 range. The fuel was at 16.XX ish and then richened up to a flat "10.0". This was expected as the injectors are 110cc larger than stock. The question that everyone has is if the GTE ecu is able to compensate / learn with the larger injector and lean out by itself.
After 10 miles of driving I now have a solid 14.8-15.2 A/F mixture at idle. It warm starts perfectly without any issues and idle is now solid at 700-800rpm. Cruising the A/F fluctuates now between 14.5-15.5. The only part that is noticeably rich is say the transition from throttle to pulling out of gear coasting to a stop, the car will go rich to 11.0 or so and then even out to the 14.8-15.2 range within seconds.
So that debunks the 550cc injector question, the car drives wonderful! Idles smooth as silk not a single hiccup either.
One thing that I have noticed, I re-checked timing when I got home. I put the jump cable into TE1 and E1 and the timing clamp is on the #1 spark plug wire.
The base timing is high, like 12-13 ish, and the distributor is all the way clocked as "low" as it will go, as in I cannot lower the timing any further.
Do you know what would cause this Ali? Is the distributor not "stabbed" correctly? I wanted to lower timing to 8ish base.
Another thing I noticed is that the normal "change in sound" when the timing is locked at 10deg did not occur. Normally is pretty audible when you lock the timing with the jumper cable.
Some pictures of the setup:
Jerry Rigged the intake pipe but its simple and works:
My pile of wiring from my old stock harness:
Added 5 pins to the ecu for the other 5 cylinders, these are soldered together and then spliced into the stock IGT wire.
The pins used on the new DS62 ignitor, shows 4 pins unused.
Quick Pic of the car just for reference:
So just to update you guys. Originally I installed my JDM supra ecu with the factory injectors and it was running very lean and didn't want to idle properly, and drove sluggish, very poorly.
Today I did two things:
Replaced the spark plugs with fresh BKR7EIX's, kept the stock gap at .31-.32
Installed my osidetiger 550cc injectors.
These were the only two things replaced and I pulled the battery to reset the ecu.
Cold started the car, fired first try idling low in the 3-400 range. The fuel was at 16.XX ish and then richened up to a flat "10.0". This was expected as the injectors are 110cc larger than stock. The question that everyone has is if the GTE ecu is able to compensate / learn with the larger injector and lean out by itself.
After 10 miles of driving I now have a solid 14.8-15.2 A/F mixture at idle. It warm starts perfectly without any issues and idle is now solid at 700-800rpm. Cruising the A/F fluctuates now between 14.5-15.5. The only part that is noticeably rich is say the transition from throttle to pulling out of gear coasting to a stop, the car will go rich to 11.0 or so and then even out to the 14.8-15.2 range within seconds.
So that debunks the 550cc injector question, the car drives wonderful! Idles smooth as silk not a single hiccup either.
One thing that I have noticed, I re-checked timing when I got home. I put the jump cable into TE1 and E1 and the timing clamp is on the #1 spark plug wire.
The base timing is high, like 12-13 ish, and the distributor is all the way clocked as "low" as it will go, as in I cannot lower the timing any further.
Do you know what would cause this Ali? Is the distributor not "stabbed" correctly? I wanted to lower timing to 8ish base.
Another thing I noticed is that the normal "change in sound" when the timing is locked at 10deg did not occur. Normally is pretty audible when you lock the timing with the jumper cable.
Some pictures of the setup:
Jerry Rigged the intake pipe but its simple and works:
My pile of wiring from my old stock harness:
Added 5 pins to the ecu for the other 5 cylinders, these are soldered together and then spliced into the stock IGT wire.
The pins used on the new DS62 ignitor, shows 4 pins unused.
Quick Pic of the car just for reference:
Last edited by HiPSI; 05-07-14 at 02:01 PM.
05-07-14, 02:18 PM
#1684
That is awesome news. I knew the 550's would work better than the 440's for sure.
Really like the chrome TT wheels on the Red btw.
If you can't lower the distributor anymore that means you need to re-stab it, but what concerns me is you didn;t hear the sounds from doing the jumper. you may be looking at the actual timing and not the base timing.
Last time that happened it was the tps needing adjustment. If the tps is not in the right spot it wont let you set the base timing.. I know its pretty weird but that was the fix a few pages back it happened to Buff remember?
I would fix that first till you hear the sound change and then see where its at, cause if 12 is your regular timing and you have maxed out the distributor where it already was, you may already have the base at like 6-8 and just not be able to see it cause its not going into that mode.. well that is my best guess at the moment.
see if there is a spot on the tps where the ecu tries to idle down a bit and should smooth out, for me its mostly where the tps is close to *edit* fully Counter-clockwise but not fully Counter-clockwise*. Always a good idea to mark the original spot too with a dab of whiteout or scratch with a screwdriver or something so you can revert back if it doesn't help.
Really like the chrome TT wheels on the Red btw.
If you can't lower the distributor anymore that means you need to re-stab it, but what concerns me is you didn;t hear the sounds from doing the jumper. you may be looking at the actual timing and not the base timing.
Last time that happened it was the tps needing adjustment. If the tps is not in the right spot it wont let you set the base timing.. I know its pretty weird but that was the fix a few pages back it happened to Buff remember?
I would fix that first till you hear the sound change and then see where its at, cause if 12 is your regular timing and you have maxed out the distributor where it already was, you may already have the base at like 6-8 and just not be able to see it cause its not going into that mode.. well that is my best guess at the moment.
see if there is a spot on the tps where the ecu tries to idle down a bit and should smooth out, for me its mostly where the tps is close to *edit* fully Counter-clockwise but not fully Counter-clockwise*. Always a good idea to mark the original spot too with a dab of whiteout or scratch with a screwdriver or something so you can revert back if it doesn't help.
Last edited by Ali SC3; 05-07-14 at 03:18 PM.
05-07-14, 02:26 PM
#1685
That is awesome news. I knew the 550's would work better than the 440's for sure.
Really like the chrome TT wheels on the Red btw.
If you can't lower the distributor anymore that means you need to re-stab it, but what concerns me is you didn;t hear the sounds from doing the jumper. you may be looking at the actual timing and not the base timing.
Last time that happened it was the tps needing adjustment. If the tps is not in the right spot it wont let you set the base timing.. I know its pretty weird but that was the fix a few pages back it happened to Buff remember?
I would fix that first till you hear the sound change and then see where its at, cause if 12 is your regular timing and you have maxed out the distributor where it already was, you may already have the base at like 6-8 and just not be able to see it cause its not going into that mode.. well that is my best guess at the moment.
see if there is a spot on the tps where the ecu tries to idle down a bit and should smooth out, for me its mostly where the tps is close to fully clockwise but not fully clockwise. Always a good idea to mark the original spot too with a dab of whiteout or scratch with a screwdriver or something so you can revert back if it doesn't help.
Really like the chrome TT wheels on the Red btw.
If you can't lower the distributor anymore that means you need to re-stab it, but what concerns me is you didn;t hear the sounds from doing the jumper. you may be looking at the actual timing and not the base timing.
Last time that happened it was the tps needing adjustment. If the tps is not in the right spot it wont let you set the base timing.. I know its pretty weird but that was the fix a few pages back it happened to Buff remember?
I would fix that first till you hear the sound change and then see where its at, cause if 12 is your regular timing and you have maxed out the distributor where it already was, you may already have the base at like 6-8 and just not be able to see it cause its not going into that mode.. well that is my best guess at the moment.
see if there is a spot on the tps where the ecu tries to idle down a bit and should smooth out, for me its mostly where the tps is close to fully clockwise but not fully clockwise. Always a good idea to mark the original spot too with a dab of whiteout or scratch with a screwdriver or something so you can revert back if it doesn't help.
See that's what is odd because the idle is very smooth, doesn't show issues that the TPS isn't adjusted right. If the TPS adjustment is off shouldn't the idle be all over the place?
Would you recommend trying to set the TPS with a voltimeter to the .65 range? Or just adjusting the TPS by hand and seeing if I can get the Timing to lock at 10deg.
I'll go fool with it a bit.
EDIT:
Went outside, started the car, and took a picture of the current TPS setting, jumper was not working, and it showed base timing was at 12-13 with the distributor locked all the retarded:
Adjusted the TPS to the opposite side:
Plugged in the Jumper for timing and it immediately changed to the "audible" locked 10deg mode. The timing was set at 0! So I loosened the distributor, and bumped timing up to just under 10 deg and set it.
You guys are wizards at the sc300 platform. This ECU must really rely on a good TPS voltage to function.
Last edited by HiPSI; 05-07-14 at 02:49 PM.
05-07-14, 02:59 PM
#1686
Wow that was a fast fix. Yeah got all the problems memorized pretty much these days.
The tps can be in lots of different positions and the idle will be smooth, its a learning ecu even if it sees something out of spec it will do its best to adapt. really it needs to be in the right spot though so it knows exactly when you are stepping on it and when you have let off exactly in the right percentage range to add fuel and stuff and idle down at the right times. once you hit the right spot you will notice the ecu starting to learn to idle even lower rpm's and it will still be smooth. mine is at lik 600 rpm's now and idles smooth as butter, I am not sure it even did that on the stock ecu.
I thought your base timing was probably lower but that is alot if it was at 0. yeah if you don;t hear the change you are not looking at base timing, that has thrown us a few times before here.
now that you set it to 10 probably just to be safe reset the ecu one last time. you will notice you will gain quite a bit more power especially since you are still n/a.
The tps can be in lots of different positions and the idle will be smooth, its a learning ecu even if it sees something out of spec it will do its best to adapt. really it needs to be in the right spot though so it knows exactly when you are stepping on it and when you have let off exactly in the right percentage range to add fuel and stuff and idle down at the right times. once you hit the right spot you will notice the ecu starting to learn to idle even lower rpm's and it will still be smooth. mine is at lik 600 rpm's now and idles smooth as butter, I am not sure it even did that on the stock ecu.
I thought your base timing was probably lower but that is alot if it was at 0. yeah if you don;t hear the change you are not looking at base timing, that has thrown us a few times before here.
now that you set it to 10 probably just to be safe reset the ecu one last time. you will notice you will gain quite a bit more power especially since you are still n/a.
05-07-14, 03:22 PM
#1688
The 500's should be a good injector size actually if the 550's only go to the 11's in transition. my 440's go to mid 12's in transition sometimes 12.0 or so, but when I start it for the first time after a reset its at like a 12.0, not 10-11 like it will be with the larger injectors.
I think they do the tps thing to prevent you from trying to set the timing or do diagnostic when there is load on the motor like you are revving or something. just another random toyota safety thing I think.
I just got a JDM 6 speed supra ecu on the way, gonna see how different it feels having the actual manual trans ecu. should be interesting.
I think they do the tps thing to prevent you from trying to set the timing or do diagnostic when there is load on the motor like you are revving or something. just another random toyota safety thing I think.
I just got a JDM 6 speed supra ecu on the way, gonna see how different it feels having the actual manual trans ecu. should be interesting.
05-07-14, 06:57 PM
#1689
Pole Position
Join Date: May 2012
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This is awesome! Glad I found something out that helps in this forum! That tps issue with the base timing threw me for a loop until I figured that out.
Btw I like how you have the same A/F gauge in the same place as me! Lol
Btw I like how you have the same A/F gauge in the same place as me! Lol
05-07-14, 10:32 PM
#1690
Pole Position
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So uhhh...The manifold I got has a bunch of stuff on it that I don't have. Looks like there's a sub tps and traction control. Did earlier sc300s have a sub tps? Also this thing looks like it was sitting at the bottom of the ocean. I dunno if it's salt deposits or what but there's white spots all over it.
All I was told was it was off a 1993, when I asked what car it came off of.
Also from the looks of it, can't I just remove my intake manifold and throttlebody as 1 unit? Like, just remove the bolts that join the runners? Seems like it would be easier to do that than remove everything piece by piece. Seems like an easier way to do spark plug changes too.
All I was told was it was off a 1993, when I asked what car it came off of.
Also from the looks of it, can't I just remove my intake manifold and throttlebody as 1 unit? Like, just remove the bolts that join the runners? Seems like it would be easier to do that than remove everything piece by piece. Seems like an easier way to do spark plug changes too.
05-08-14, 07:50 AM
#1691
So uhhh...The manifold I got has a bunch of stuff on it that I don't have. Looks like there's a sub tps and traction control. Did earlier sc300s have a sub tps? Also this thing looks like it was sitting at the bottom of the ocean. I dunno if it's salt deposits or what but there's white spots all over it.
All I was told was it was off a 1993, when I asked what car it came off of.
Also from the looks of it, can't I just remove my intake manifold and throttlebody as 1 unit? Like, just remove the bolts that join the runners? Seems like it would be easier to do that than remove everything piece by piece. Seems like an easier way to do spark plug changes too.
All I was told was it was off a 1993, when I asked what car it came off of.
Also from the looks of it, can't I just remove my intake manifold and throttlebody as 1 unit? Like, just remove the bolts that join the runners? Seems like it would be easier to do that than remove everything piece by piece. Seems like an easier way to do spark plug changes too.
05-08-14, 08:25 AM
#1692
are you talking about the (throttle body - Y pipe - upper manifold)? all the manifold parts through the years believe it or not are interchangeable. the only one that is different is vvti has a different Y pipe to throttle body flange, but there is a plastic adapter piece I think you can remove and will even let you bolt older throttle body onto it. also the air hose for the injectors comes off the top of the Y pipe on vvti isntead of off the IACV on odb2 non-vvti.
You have a trac control throttle body which is why it has a sub-tps.
Its not a year thing its about if the car had trac as an option on automatics, it was not abailable on the 5 speed.
Your car did not originally come with trac hence the difference, the new one you got did but good news is just use your original one.
Your throttle body it the more desireable kind. what I would do is just use your old one and cap off that port that went to the odb2 lower runner. that is the only difference between yours and my 95 non trac throttle body, as I have a 96 5spd throttle body sitting here without trac and everything else looks the same.
If you want a throttle body without trac that you do not have to cap off, look for an odb1 one without trac, it wont have the second tps on there and the bulging part on the opposite side. You can also use the trac throttle body but really no point since you don't have trac and got rid of the code already.
Really the only part you should swap out is the lower runner, that will ensure everything mates up vacuum wise on egr etc... it is the same on most 2jz-ge's though.
If you try and take it off as 1 unit you will have a tough time. there are brackets that go from the upper to under the Y part, that will be tricky to remove the first go around. often I don't put them back in.
I like to remove the Y and throttle body as 1 piece, you will have to undo the large nut on the EGR pipe and don't forget the coolant lines on the TB if you haven't deleted those.
Then I take the upper off by isetlf. its tricky to get out anyways, better to do it in 2 parts.
Then you should be able to get to all the lower runner bolts, fix injectors, etc... put back together...
Here is what my warm idle looks like with a/c off. not sure the exact rpm but it sounds very low.
here is a vid 30 sec or so after cold start
here is a vide of it running mostly warmed up
You have a trac control throttle body which is why it has a sub-tps.
Its not a year thing its about if the car had trac as an option on automatics, it was not abailable on the 5 speed.
Your car did not originally come with trac hence the difference, the new one you got did but good news is just use your original one.
Your throttle body it the more desireable kind. what I would do is just use your old one and cap off that port that went to the odb2 lower runner. that is the only difference between yours and my 95 non trac throttle body, as I have a 96 5spd throttle body sitting here without trac and everything else looks the same.
If you want a throttle body without trac that you do not have to cap off, look for an odb1 one without trac, it wont have the second tps on there and the bulging part on the opposite side. You can also use the trac throttle body but really no point since you don't have trac and got rid of the code already.
Really the only part you should swap out is the lower runner, that will ensure everything mates up vacuum wise on egr etc... it is the same on most 2jz-ge's though.
If you try and take it off as 1 unit you will have a tough time. there are brackets that go from the upper to under the Y part, that will be tricky to remove the first go around. often I don't put them back in.
I like to remove the Y and throttle body as 1 piece, you will have to undo the large nut on the EGR pipe and don't forget the coolant lines on the TB if you haven't deleted those.
Then I take the upper off by isetlf. its tricky to get out anyways, better to do it in 2 parts.
Then you should be able to get to all the lower runner bolts, fix injectors, etc... put back together...
Here is what my warm idle looks like with a/c off. not sure the exact rpm but it sounds very low.
here is a vid 30 sec or so after cold start
here is a vide of it running mostly warmed up
Last edited by Ali SC3; 05-08-14 at 09:02 AM.
