New ES300h vs certified RX350 or 450h?
08-01-18, 09:09 PM
#1
Intermediate
Thread Starter
New ES300h vs certified RX350 or 450h?
[I posted a related thread in Car Chat about the sell/trade options on models. Sorry if I’ve wasted anyone’s time but I thought the topics belonged in different forums’
We just bought a new ES300h that I love but my wife has some buyer’s remorse. It has 700 miles so can’t be called new but is in showroom condition. MSRP was 49.9, I paid 40.5 after everything except tax. She wants AWD and wouldn’t mind more storage. I want a Hybrid. Any opinions on any quality difference and wisdom of swapping a brand new ES for a used RX? I’ll give up on the hybrid if I have to but not the AWD.
Thank you
We just bought a new ES300h that I love but my wife has some buyer’s remorse. It has 700 miles so can’t be called new but is in showroom condition. MSRP was 49.9, I paid 40.5 after everything except tax. She wants AWD and wouldn’t mind more storage. I want a Hybrid. Any opinions on any quality difference and wisdom of swapping a brand new ES for a used RX? I’ll give up on the hybrid if I have to but not the AWD.
Thank you
08-02-18, 04:11 AM
#2
Pole Position
We own a 2017 RX450h and a 2017 ES300H. Previously had a 2013 ES300h and a 2015 RX450h. The 17's are vastly improvement over the others. We enjoy both vehicles. Matter of fact every couple of months we switch. Enjoy them both and can not decide which we like the most. Also in NC and could care less that the ES does not have AWD. You got a great deal on the ES so if you trade in or sell privately you will not lose to much. My wife enjoys sitting up high in the RX with better visibility but she also enjoys driving a sportier vehicle like the ES. We average 38 mpg with the ES and 29 mpg with the RX. If you can afford the small loss with the trade in the RX is a great choice but so was the ES. Are you sure if you get the RX than seven months from now she will not change her mine. If you really like the ES than if you trade in the ES for a RX, they will probably give you $20,000 for it. LOL Tell her if you read it here it must be true. I f you are averaging what i am with the ES300h around 38mpg and go with a RX350 looked at the gas mileage thread and the last two post are averaging 21 mpg. I personally could not go from 38mpg to 21 mpg with the amount of miles we drive.
Last edited by Freds430; 08-02-18 at 04:16 AM.
08-02-18, 04:20 AM
#3
Advanced
Being in a country where it is more winter than summer, the only reason we did not go for an ES is that it is offered only in FWD. We were going for a GS AWD for that reason and then switched our mind for an RX AWD for it's height and larger wheels for more stability in the snow.
But other than that, the ES hybrid is a great car! I got to drive a couple of times as a courtesy car. If it becomes AWD someday, I might consider it (once the kids are all grown ups and drive their own cars, which is very soon)..
But other than that, the ES hybrid is a great car! I got to drive a couple of times as a courtesy car. If it becomes AWD someday, I might consider it (once the kids are all grown ups and drive their own cars, which is very soon)..
08-02-18, 04:28 AM
#4
Pole Position
Being in a country where it is more winter than summer, the only reason we did not go for an ES is that it is offered only in FWD. We were going for a GS AWD for that reason and then switched our mind for an RX AWD for it's height and larger wheels for more stability in the snow.
But other than that, the ES hybrid is a great car! I got to drive a couple of times as a courtesy car. If it becomes AWD someday, I might consider it (once the kids are all grown ups and drive their own cars, which is very soon)..
But other than that, the ES hybrid is a great car! I got to drive a couple of times as a courtesy car. If it becomes AWD someday, I might consider it (once the kids are all grown ups and drive their own cars, which is very soon)..
Last edited by Freds430; 08-02-18 at 04:41 AM.
08-02-18, 04:32 AM
#5
Advanced
But speculations for now...
08-02-18, 04:35 AM
#6
08-02-18, 04:37 AM
#7
GS, more than likely, but the IS should be staying. There is an F Sport 2019 ES variant.
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08-02-18, 04:46 AM
#8
Advanced
For sure the RX (h) will consume way more gas than the ES.
Check your needs/want.
Does your wife wants an SUV because it is the type of vehicle that is trending and she wants to be on the wave?
I bought and RX more for the commodity during winter (lots of ice and snow). I had cars all my life and prefer the handling of them over SUV. But my RX beats any car I have owned in winter conditions!
Check your needs/want.
Does your wife wants an SUV because it is the type of vehicle that is trending and she wants to be on the wave?
I bought and RX more for the commodity during winter (lots of ice and snow). I had cars all my life and prefer the handling of them over SUV. But my RX beats any car I have owned in winter conditions!
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Dmaxdmax (08-02-18)
08-02-18, 04:55 AM
#9
Lead Lap
Even though you bought the ESh for a very attractive price, you are still going to take a big financial hit if you sell or trade it now. You certainly can try to minimize that hit by trying to sell the ESh yourself, but, if you have to trade it in, you likely will be doing so with a large loss. A dealer would want to sell the car as a CPO vehicle, and, if a new similarly equipped ESh can be bought for a little over $40,000, the dealer's asking price for your CPO vehicle would likely be somewhere just a bit over $38,000. That means that their likely trade-in offer to you would be no higher than around $35,000.
On the other end, if you want to buy a 2018 (or even a 2017) CPO RXh, not many of them will have yet come back to dealers as trade-ins or lease returns, and, thus, with small supply of such vehicles, dealers will be holding pretty firmly to prices within a couple of thousand dollars of the price for which what would be able to buy a similarly-equipped new RXh.
When you add together what you paid for the ESh and what you will have to add to buy a certified RXh, I'm confident that the total amount of money spent will exceed by a fair amount the price that you would have paid if you had originally bought a fully loaded Luxury Package brand new RXh.
Only you and your wife can decide whether making is the swap would be a good decision, but, if you do make the switch, it will come at considerable cost.
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Dmaxdmax (08-02-18)
08-02-18, 12:24 PM
#10
Driver
This seems like a weird "want" in the middle of summer. I'm guessing there's something else (or some other combo of wants) in this story
Anyway, this is all pointless banter until you get some numbers. If you want a quick and easy estimate, use CarMax for an easy trade-in $$$ number. They give out estimates all the time. Then you'll know a baseline of what you're working with. Your Lexus dealer might even get you a bit more if you buy the CPO from them. My guess is that they'll give you decent money for the car. It doesn't matter how much you originally bought the car for, just the MSRP. For example, I bought a 2017 Passat for $18k brand new (not a leftover either, I bought in 2016) and saw the exact same trim, color, and options but with 13k miles at CarMax a year later, asking $20,988...
Anyway, this is all pointless banter until you get some numbers. If you want a quick and easy estimate, use CarMax for an easy trade-in $$$ number. They give out estimates all the time. Then you'll know a baseline of what you're working with. Your Lexus dealer might even get you a bit more if you buy the CPO from them. My guess is that they'll give you decent money for the car. It doesn't matter how much you originally bought the car for, just the MSRP. For example, I bought a 2017 Passat for $18k brand new (not a leftover either, I bought in 2016) and saw the exact same trim, color, and options but with 13k miles at CarMax a year later, asking $20,988...
08-14-18, 04:49 PM
#11
Intermediate
Thread Starter
I'm resurrecting this thread because we just took our first mini-trip and I was appalled at what I could actually fit in the trunk. 4 19" carryon bags plus a v small cooler and a beach bag left almost nothing to spare. Had the bags been normal US 21" we wouldn't have fit the mini-cooler. (we have 19" for small European airlines that kill you on fees at 20")
I found a 2016 RX450h w/44k miles on it for $41.9k (Certified, 1-owner, maintenance all at Lexus dealer, AWD, NAV, Safety+). I own cars for a long time so a concern is what position will I be in 10 years, assuming 12k/year with either:
a 10 year-old ES300h w/120,000 miles
vs
a 12 year-old RX450h w/164,000 miles
It seems to me that 164k is going to feel a lot longer in the tooth.
Opinions please
I found a 2016 RX450h w/44k miles on it for $41.9k (Certified, 1-owner, maintenance all at Lexus dealer, AWD, NAV, Safety+). I own cars for a long time so a concern is what position will I be in 10 years, assuming 12k/year with either:
a 10 year-old ES300h w/120,000 miles
vs
a 12 year-old RX450h w/164,000 miles
It seems to me that 164k is going to feel a lot longer in the tooth.
Opinions please
08-14-18, 04:58 PM
#12
Driver
I'd bet the ES will actually feel older when old, since it was from a 2013 design, versus a 2016 RX which is a 2016 design. The infotainment and safety features is similar between the two, so it should feel similar there. The mileage, if properly taken care of, will mean almost nothing in how "old" it feels. I test drove several 150k mile 2007 RX350s that were running like a top, I've driven high mileage Hondas and Toyotas all my life and I couldn't believe how smooth these Japanese V6's run at high mileage.
08-14-18, 05:11 PM
#13
Intermediate
Thread Starter
08-14-18, 05:53 PM
#14
Lexus Test Driver
The current ES is already long in the tooth. I do however love the look of the new model which is not out yet.
08-15-18, 01:35 PM
#15
Intermediate
Thread Starter
My take is somewhat different. If your wife would really like an RXh more than an ESh, it would be ideal for her to be able to have the car she wants, but if you make the switch now, it is going to come with a significant financial hit.
Even though you bought the ESh for a very attractive price, you are still going to take a big financial hit if you sell or trade it now. You certainly can try to minimize that hit by trying to sell the ESh yourself, but, if you have to trade it in, you likely will be doing so with a large loss. A dealer would want to sell the car as a CPO vehicle, and, if a new similarly equipped ESh can be bought for a little over $40,000, the dealer's asking price for your CPO vehicle would likely be somewhere just a bit over $38,000. That means that their likely trade-in offer to you would be no higher than around $35,000.
On the other end, if you want to buy a 2018 (or even a 2017) CPO RXh, not many of them will have yet come back to dealers as trade-ins or lease returns, and, thus, with small supply of such vehicles, dealers will be holding pretty firmly to prices within a couple of thousand dollars of the price for which what would be able to buy a similarly-equipped new RXh.
When you add together what you paid for the ESh and what you will have to add to buy a certified RXh, I'm confident that the total amount of money spent will exceed by a fair amount the price that you would have paid if you had originally bought a fully loaded Luxury Package brand new RXh.
Only you and your wife can decide whether making is the swap would be a good decision, but, if you do make the switch, it will come at considerable cost.
Even though you bought the ESh for a very attractive price, you are still going to take a big financial hit if you sell or trade it now. You certainly can try to minimize that hit by trying to sell the ESh yourself, but, if you have to trade it in, you likely will be doing so with a large loss. A dealer would want to sell the car as a CPO vehicle, and, if a new similarly equipped ESh can be bought for a little over $40,000, the dealer's asking price for your CPO vehicle would likely be somewhere just a bit over $38,000. That means that their likely trade-in offer to you would be no higher than around $35,000.
On the other end, if you want to buy a 2018 (or even a 2017) CPO RXh, not many of them will have yet come back to dealers as trade-ins or lease returns, and, thus, with small supply of such vehicles, dealers will be holding pretty firmly to prices within a couple of thousand dollars of the price for which what would be able to buy a similarly-equipped new RXh.
When you add together what you paid for the ESh and what you will have to add to buy a certified RXh, I'm confident that the total amount of money spent will exceed by a fair amount the price that you would have paid if you had originally bought a fully loaded Luxury Package brand new RXh.
Only you and your wife can decide whether making is the swap would be a good decision, but, if you do make the switch, it will come at considerable cost.
So I have to decide if a certified RX w/NAV is worth $45,885, which includes a $2,500 stupid tax. (40.5 - 38.0)
Opinions?
Last edited by Dmaxdmax; 08-15-18 at 01:44 PM.