W58 info needed
04-13-15, 09:11 AM
#1
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W58 info needed
Hi all new to the site. I have a 95 Bmw m3 with a 2jzgte swap. I tried looking through the forums and I believe this is the right place to post ( sorry I am use to Bmw forums). I have a question for w58 experts. I right now have the w58 with the extending shifter but it sits to far back to go into the shifter hole so I know I need to remove the extending shifter and replace it with a shifter from a r154 I think? The ones that go straight up from the shifter housing not being remote? Can anyone give the process of changing it over and what parts will be needed? ( also tried posting this to supra forums but my acct is locked for some reason)
04-13-15, 10:26 AM
#2
if you have the tripod version of the w58, you cannot simply bolt on parts to make it like the older version.
you would have to cut and reweld the tripod cage to shorten it, along with the shift lever.
if you had the older type of w58, then yes you could just change the shifter or the base plate, but between the 2 you can't just bolt the old parts onto the tripod one if I remember right they changed the housing pattern some.
you should have just gotten one from a mk3 supra or a 92-94 sc300 then the shifter would have been in a better spot for your car.
95-97 sc300's got the tripod shifter, and all mk4 supra n/a got the tripod shifter.
you would have to cut and reweld the tripod cage to shorten it, along with the shift lever.
if you had the older type of w58, then yes you could just change the shifter or the base plate, but between the 2 you can't just bolt the old parts onto the tripod one if I remember right they changed the housing pattern some.
you should have just gotten one from a mk3 supra or a 92-94 sc300 then the shifter would have been in a better spot for your car.
95-97 sc300's got the tripod shifter, and all mk4 supra n/a got the tripod shifter.
04-13-15, 10:36 AM
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if you have the tripod version of the w58, you cannot simply bolt on parts to make it like the older version.
you would have to cut and reweld the tripod cage to shorten it, along with the shift lever.
if you had the older type of w58, then yes you could just change the shifter or the base plate, but between the 2 you can't just bolt the old parts onto the tripod one if I remember right they changed the housing pattern some.
you should have just gotten one from a mk3 supra or a 92-94 sc300 then the shifter would have been in a better spot for your car.
95-97 sc300's got the tripod shifter, and all mk4 supra n/a got the tripod shifter.
you would have to cut and reweld the tripod cage to shorten it, along with the shift lever.
if you had the older type of w58, then yes you could just change the shifter or the base plate, but between the 2 you can't just bolt the old parts onto the tripod one if I remember right they changed the housing pattern some.
you should have just gotten one from a mk3 supra or a 92-94 sc300 then the shifter would have been in a better spot for your car.
95-97 sc300's got the tripod shifter, and all mk4 supra n/a got the tripod shifter.
04-13-15, 01:07 PM
#4
you do have the more desirable w58 as the tripod one has little updates but nothing that makes it hold more power, I think its more related to shift feel. if its just a couple inches though I have seen someone cut the tripod bracket shorter and the shift rod and have it welded back together, then you could keep the same trans and the tripod version does shift better.
but in all honesty I would just sell it as most SC/supra owners or even v8 5spd swappers may want that version as its the newest. I would just get a mk3 r154 and throw a 2jz bellhousing on it and call it a day, it might cost you 1k more in the end but it will likely not need much of an extension at all and even a used r154 will likely hold double the power a w58 can, unless its on its last limb already.
seriously with the gte and how quick the power comes on with twins you will likely break the w58 in short order, especially since I believe most m3's came with lsd, that extra traction you get will blow a w58 in no time its not even worth the time to install one I wouldn;t do it if you paid me. if you have an open diff it may last a little while. I only have a w58 cause it was already in the car and I still dislike having it. its the weakest link in the chain without a doubt. having a w58 with a turbo motor is like driving on borrowed time literally everyone who has that setup is planning on a r154 at the very least just trying to save you a bunch of time and effort you are about to waste.
but in all honesty I would just sell it as most SC/supra owners or even v8 5spd swappers may want that version as its the newest. I would just get a mk3 r154 and throw a 2jz bellhousing on it and call it a day, it might cost you 1k more in the end but it will likely not need much of an extension at all and even a used r154 will likely hold double the power a w58 can, unless its on its last limb already.
seriously with the gte and how quick the power comes on with twins you will likely break the w58 in short order, especially since I believe most m3's came with lsd, that extra traction you get will blow a w58 in no time its not even worth the time to install one I wouldn;t do it if you paid me. if you have an open diff it may last a little while. I only have a w58 cause it was already in the car and I still dislike having it. its the weakest link in the chain without a doubt. having a w58 with a turbo motor is like driving on borrowed time literally everyone who has that setup is planning on a r154 at the very least just trying to save you a bunch of time and effort you are about to waste.
Last edited by Ali SC3; 04-13-15 at 01:11 PM.
04-15-15, 12:31 AM
#5
^^ THIS. Completely this. Maybe if you are at completely stock boost your W58 will hold... for a while. But I think even that applies more to a low boost single turbo setup. Twin turbos with power at very low rpms probably accelerate the stress. It's only a matter of time no matter how gently you drive it. W58's are best suited for NA 2JZ swaps and 1UZ 5-speed conversions where far lower horsepower levels come on more linearly and gently. R154's only begin to get stressed above 500whp and still have a general ceiling of around 650whp-750whp. Upgraded internal parts are sold for it, unlike the W58.
And it may be so that an MK3 Supra R154 (with the bell housing swap) may not need much or any shifter extension in your E36 chassis.
And it may be so that an MK3 Supra R154 (with the bell housing swap) may not need much or any shifter extension in your E36 chassis.
Last edited by KahnBB6; 04-15-15 at 12:35 AM.
11-19-15, 10:17 AM
#6
Hate to bring this back but to be clear, any MK3 W58 would bolt on to a 1j/2j but how is the shifter location? Theres an 89 MK3 W58 local to me and thinking about grabbing it.. Thanks
Edit: How about the clutch/brake pedal set, will those bolt on too?
Edit: How about the clutch/brake pedal set, will those bolt on too?
Last edited by Kris9884; 11-19-15 at 10:55 AM.
11-19-15, 10:57 AM
#7
it'll bolt on with the 2jz bellhousing (mk3 came with a 7m remember).
you know how people do the housing and lever extensions for the r154 to fit in an SC. when using a mk3 w58 its not any different, its basically the same extension needed to be perfect spot for our cars.
the mk3 w58 the housing doesn't extend past the back of the trans if you look at pics its basically just inline with the end of the housing, and the sc300 version the housing really only extends like an inch or 2 further back than the mk3 one, the rest is made up in the shifter. also both mk3 w58 and sc300 w58 have a swan neck shifter.
see this pic I found from this thread
http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums...sc300-5-speed/
its hard to see from the back or top, much easier from the side but I circled where the length difference is.
you can actually bolt in the sc300 shift lever and housing and use the mk3 shifter if you can find those 2 parts.
different bell housings and you can see the housing for the SC shifter on the left is longer different shape, trans arent lined up well but look at the bolt holes the one on the left is actually longer.
here I circled where you can see the difference in how far it hangs off the back, the one on the right (SC) hangs further back
as i said its not a huge difference but it makes a difference I think if you dont extend it you hit the shifter trim on 1st 3rd and 5th gear. some people even extend it much longer than they did on the SC and use a straighter shifter.
you know how people do the housing and lever extensions for the r154 to fit in an SC. when using a mk3 w58 its not any different, its basically the same extension needed to be perfect spot for our cars.
the mk3 w58 the housing doesn't extend past the back of the trans if you look at pics its basically just inline with the end of the housing, and the sc300 version the housing really only extends like an inch or 2 further back than the mk3 one, the rest is made up in the shifter. also both mk3 w58 and sc300 w58 have a swan neck shifter.
see this pic I found from this thread
http://us.lexusownersclub.com/forums...sc300-5-speed/
its hard to see from the back or top, much easier from the side but I circled where the length difference is.
you can actually bolt in the sc300 shift lever and housing and use the mk3 shifter if you can find those 2 parts.
different bell housings and you can see the housing for the SC shifter on the left is longer different shape, trans arent lined up well but look at the bolt holes the one on the left is actually longer.
here I circled where you can see the difference in how far it hangs off the back, the one on the right (SC) hangs further back
as i said its not a huge difference but it makes a difference I think if you dont extend it you hit the shifter trim on 1st 3rd and 5th gear. some people even extend it much longer than they did on the SC and use a straighter shifter.
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11-19-15, 11:10 AM
#8
Ahh good info, thank you sir! I found another thread about how terrible the MK3 pedal is so I'll pass on those but I'm thinking about picking this up as a spare. Ultimately I'll stick with the CD009, just hate the chatter sound it gives off with a lightweight flywheel.
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