VVT-i

I've seen a lot of Toyota/Lexus vehicles go well beyond 100k with regular maint. If you don't take care of the vehicle, it will not last( any vehicle ....period). You can do this to any car manufacturer and drive the heck out of it without any maint....it will fail on your face.

LexFather

Well Antisludge, I have a 1992 ES 300 manual with 230k miles, no sludge issue. Also my father has a SC 400 with 240k miles, no sludge issue. My RX 300 now has 142k miles, no sludge issue.

Of course, we do change the OIL ever 5-7k miles. That may help those that have sludge issues

O. L. T.

iTrader: (17)

flipside909

We're not here to chase and libel you. That's none of our business nor do any of really care to do so. Your credibility factor isn't that great as what we can research on the internet. Yahoo, Google, you name it. To answer your question of "Where are those Toyota's that supposedly make it to 200,000 miles and beyond?" It's simple, they're out driving their cars trouble free as the internet user only represents a fraction...in reality 1% of those real world owners out there. Where are they you ask? Driving their cars to over 100k, 200k and 300k plus instead of moping around the internet waiting to be sympathized upon. I have no need to search the sludge issue since i'm content with my regular oil change practices and have ZERO issues with my 7 year old, 97k+ 1MZ-FE V6. I'm still not convinced of the argument of the 5 years i've seen this. Moving Forward...Sludge Free.

antisludge

With all due respect (because I think that civility is #1 on internet postings), I have to say that those who are afflicted with this engine malady are not simply "whining" but actually in dire financial situations because of it. If it were a broken vent cap or a squeaky interior, I think the description of "whining" would be more accurate.

I would like to make clear that the issue, especially in the Lexus as the engine replacements have cost upwards of $8,000 in the ES300 and RX300 models, is the destruction of the engine in the presence of proper maintenance (i.e. according to the manufacturer's recommended schedule). Again, with all due respect, the problem has occurred with regular maintenance. I know that the generalization that it won't happen with regular maintenance is not an accurate one based on the thousands of owner reports filed at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and the Center for Auto Safety. These affected Toyota engines are failing despite proper maintenance. This is a fact based on my five+ years of involvement in the matter.

The engine problem is neither "hype" nor a "hoax." There is plenty of data to support the conditions that increase the likelihood that sludge will develop in these engines. The data includes the fact that the passages are smaller within the engine and that the engine shows increased head temperatures. There is also the fact that the owner's manual itself has recommended oil change intervals that are too long given the inherent design of the engines. This is not an issue exclusively related to oil change interval, and changing the oil every 3,000 miles has not prevented the condition from developing in the affected engines. Indeed, some Toyota models other than those currently covered under the CSP program are showing engine sludge build up in the presence of proper maintenance.

Again, with utmost civility in posting, I think it is important to present all the facts as they are known to date. I do appreciate the opportunity to highlight this additional information for those who would be most interested.

Have a great holiday weekend!

Charlene Blake

flipside909

Any updates to your findings?

mmarshall

It wasn't just that schoolteacher, flip. These sludge issues and websites are all over the Internet. Edmunds is just one of the largest ones, that's all. I personally have read dozens...even hundereds..... of them myself. There is truth on both sides of it.....but most of the truth, as you know as well as me, is on Toyota's side. You and I have both agreed in the past that 3-5 months and 3000-5000 mile oil change intervals are best. Many of these Internet posters SAY they follow this schedule....but not all are actually credible. Some people will lie if they think that by lying and covering up they can get a new or remanufactured engine free through their own fault.

Yet there is SOME truth to their position as well. The 3.0L V6, in spite of the standard 195-200 degree coolant-temperature thermostat that starts radiator cooling at that temperature range, does tend to have a substantially higher internal operating temperature for several reasons.......among them optimal temperature for low emissions and rather narrow oil passages that tend to limit the amount of oil cooling you can get. So, after a while, if you drive around with your head up your a** and neglect the oil, it sludges first, then gels, then cooks and carbonizes, and then good-bye engine. I've seen a number of these removed, ruined engines in Toyota and Lexus service bays...it is not a pretty sight. You can clearly see the brown gel-like goo all throughout the engine...what's left of it. Some other Toyota engines will let you get away with a little neglect on the oil now and then. This one clearly won't.....but of course that is no excuse for neglect in the first place.

Two things puzzle me here over this now-famous case. One, why Toyota is replacing some of these engines as a good will even if the owner can document only one oil change in the last 12 months ( with the proper oil and filter, of course ). A once-a-year oil change........you and I will both agree........is clear engine abuse. Second, why Toyota and Lexus have not, at least in a service bulletin, recommended synthetic oil for these engines. Another thing you and I have both agreed in the past on is that in most cases dino oil is OK with regular changes, ( like you, I use Castrol 5W-30 dino and factory filters ). But in this particular case, synthetic might be the way to go...especially for the oil-change slackers..........the synthetic has much greater resistance to sludge, gelling, carbonizing, and viscosity breakdown from high heat.

parula

I went to synthetic after ~2600 and will stick with it every 5k (I am not one of the slackers), I had gotten a letter some time ago. I applaud Lexus for stepping up and notifying owners of potential problems. If synthetic is better, and I heard BMW and Mercedes ship it why doesn't Lexus make the switch to synthetic?

valgs350

iTrader: (1)

That sucks!

Toyota Hater

parula

Val, so why is that important to you?

Pheonix

Ooooo I Looooooove this discussion! I'm glad it came back from the dead woot~!
<- is happy!!!!
Quoting my own post about how 1mz-fe sludge actually isn't a problem. Because there is not a problem...
And noone else on earth can prove there is a problem...
nor even provide a sound engineering/mechanical aregument
that there is a problem...

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...ghlight=sludge

Ok here goes. To begin with:
1) If the oil meets the requirements the OEM sets out, and is changed on the OEM schedule, there IS NO oil problem.
2) The actual cause of the problem has, and likely never will be known, or disclosed. It would take someone doing major dyno testing, with engineers & very smart people to figure out the actual answer to why the oil, if any, cooks itself irregularly in the first place in the engines in question.

The problem is NOT the PCV system. What ever back-yard mechanic ever decided to say that is a moron. It uses the exact same breather system that every other Toyota v6 has used.
It is also not the cooling capacity. If it was, They'd have spent $5 an engine putting in a lower rated thermostat & higher rated pressure cap, or raised coolant flow through a pulley retrofit, or redesigning the water pump.
The problem is magnified by short driving distances so that the engine oil never gets really hot, infrequent oil changes, or mechanical malfunctions. Congratulations to whatever moron originally wrote that. All of which are owner problems. Not car problems...



My personal thoughts on the matter.
*If you've got a problem cooking oil, you're a bad owner & brought it on yourself*
*Every engine will cook it's oil if you don't maintain it*
*Toyota lowered the oil change intervals on said engines before they were released from previous 5 month/7500 mile schedule*
*Toyota recommended 5w-30 only*

In conclusion, I have never personally seen any more physical problems with oil on a 1mz-fe, that I haven't seen on JUST AS MANY engines from other makers. I think the whole thing is mostly BS. I doubt Toyota replaced/repaired a few hundred out of a hundred of thousand 1mz-fe's produced from oil sludge problems.


Look I don't know everything, but nothing about what anyone "Theorized" about 1mz-fe oil sludging has ever made any since.

Pheonix

In conclusion... People with sludge *are* whining & at some point in the vehicles life, they broke it. They caused their own problem. To bad, So sad.

Pheonix

btw, mm & paula.
They don't specify synthetic oil because it's simply not avalible in all parts of the world & it makes joe dirt feel better that he can run any *normal* oil.
Finally... Toyota is both:
1) Beginning to use modern light-weight oils 0w-20 in south east Asia. (Here too!)
2) Recommending synthetic oils, on a limited basis... (Toyota & Lexus of Canada)

http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_artic....cfm?x=b11,0,w

http://www.toyota.ca/cgi-bin/WebObje...800012e%2ehtml


Toyota is the world's greatest follower.

toy4two

Only update right now is I put on a new EGR valve.

I haven't pulled off the valve cover because I don't know if there is enough room to do it in the RX300. Owners have complained how impossible it is to change the rear spark plugs I don't even know how I could get the valve cover off to inspect the engine.

Pheonix

...
The same as everyone else. Either wiggle in with the right assortment of tools, or the better choice is just take the upper intake air chamber itself off.

Shouldn't take a half an hour with the right tools. Takes me about 3-5 min to be looking at 4 cams. But I have the correct tools...