Are we still loyalists or what?
05-16-18, 08:37 PM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
I’ve seen several on the road here
05-17-18, 08:15 PM
#17
Driver School Candidate
After LS400, 430, 460 (all great), the LS500 ride feels super nervous like shaky, like vibratory, (at low speeds). High speeds is OK. Very disappointed. Cannot get the LS500. Thank God there are plenty of LS 460 to buy for a long time.
First I test drove the LS500H. Complete disaster. Jerky, my body was leaning forward and jerking backwards with the gear changes. I wouldn't drive it even if it was free.
Then two weeks later I test drove a LS500F Sport. That was OK. Going fast it was OK. Going slow it felt like a Bycicle. You could read braille with the car. Too much high frequency feedback. Really nothing special. At high speed, it felt light, too much like a little jet with wind outside.
Contrast to a 430 or 460 ride (I've driven only LS models 25 years, since the 400, all great cars), the LS500 Sport at low speeds does not have that 430/460 majestic Enterprise going straight by the space dock feeling of confidence. No the 500 feels like it informs about every little pebble, the ride is nervous, the car feels like it weighs little, I was sooo disappointed. Felt really like a BMW 3. Even a 5 had more composure. If you want a 460 feel, the BMW 7 gives it perfectly.
I don't know what to do. Forget the 500. I still have a year and a half on my LS460 lease. I am tempted by the ES350 2019 with Apple CarPlay as I am an Apple aficionado. On a silver color it will feel like an Apple product. I hear the ES2019 has a better ride than the 18. However I just drove a 2018 ES350 loaner while my LS460 was getting serviced, and it was just not like a LS460 majestic ride.
In despair I drove an GS350. It is great. Much better than a BMW 5. Smoother. Nice and smooth bouncy moves. Perfect. It felt small for me, but I'd get used to it.
I also am so disappointed at the one circle on the instrument panel. 1 circular gage? I long for the two gage design of forever with the tach. One gage? That's like a 1950 Oldsmobile with its one gage. Yuck.
So far the 460 is yet to be bested. Lexus should offer it, bring it back. A lot of loyalists still demand that serene, powerful, smooth confident strut. Magnificent. You feel the road enough to be in control, but not the high frequency pebbles and such.
Finally, the LS500 does give you less lag than the LS460 but you hear and feel the busy engine too much.
First I test drove the LS500H. Complete disaster. Jerky, my body was leaning forward and jerking backwards with the gear changes. I wouldn't drive it even if it was free.
Then two weeks later I test drove a LS500F Sport. That was OK. Going fast it was OK. Going slow it felt like a Bycicle. You could read braille with the car. Too much high frequency feedback. Really nothing special. At high speed, it felt light, too much like a little jet with wind outside.
Contrast to a 430 or 460 ride (I've driven only LS models 25 years, since the 400, all great cars), the LS500 Sport at low speeds does not have that 430/460 majestic Enterprise going straight by the space dock feeling of confidence. No the 500 feels like it informs about every little pebble, the ride is nervous, the car feels like it weighs little, I was sooo disappointed. Felt really like a BMW 3. Even a 5 had more composure. If you want a 460 feel, the BMW 7 gives it perfectly.
I don't know what to do. Forget the 500. I still have a year and a half on my LS460 lease. I am tempted by the ES350 2019 with Apple CarPlay as I am an Apple aficionado. On a silver color it will feel like an Apple product. I hear the ES2019 has a better ride than the 18. However I just drove a 2018 ES350 loaner while my LS460 was getting serviced, and it was just not like a LS460 majestic ride.
In despair I drove an GS350. It is great. Much better than a BMW 5. Smoother. Nice and smooth bouncy moves. Perfect. It felt small for me, but I'd get used to it.
I also am so disappointed at the one circle on the instrument panel. 1 circular gage? I long for the two gage design of forever with the tach. One gage? That's like a 1950 Oldsmobile with its one gage. Yuck.
So far the 460 is yet to be bested. Lexus should offer it, bring it back. A lot of loyalists still demand that serene, powerful, smooth confident strut. Magnificent. You feel the road enough to be in control, but not the high frequency pebbles and such.
Finally, the LS500 does give you less lag than the LS460 but you hear and feel the busy engine too much.
Last edited by mgauss7; 05-17-18 at 08:29 PM.
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corpnupe85 (07-07-18)
05-18-18, 02:52 PM
#18
I have been a Lexus loyalist since before I could drive, but I don't like the direction the company has gone. My first car at 16 was a 2001 IS300 and I've owned a total of 10 Lexus' since then. I can see where people are upset with the changes of the LS. Since it's inception, any redesign of the LS has been conservative and on par with what loyalist expected. The new LS took a different course, and although it's a great car, it went against what the loyalist expected. As I have said in other posts, had the new LS been the redesign for the GS, it would have been a home run, but since this is the flagship, it's a hard pill to swallow for some. I can say the new LS has grown on me since its launch. I still cannot get over the fact that there is no V8 option, and for a company that made such a fantastic and reliable V8, it's sad to see its demise in their flagship. I will be in the market for a new car in the near future, but I am going to be aiming for a 2013-2017 LS or a 2016-2017 GS with the luxury package (I know.. two totally different cars).
05-18-18, 09:08 PM
#19
Lexus Champion
I was at the dealer again yesterday, they had several on the lot. There were two $102,000 examples in the showroom which I sat in.
I'm not a super-tall man, 5'11", and my head almost hit the ceiling. That was the first thing I noticed when I got in. Not good.
Rear legroom/space is unacceptable. My knees almost hit the driver's seat. The car feels very cramped inside. The backseat (whole interior, really) in my old LS430 feels much more spacious. I can't believe the car is this long, with this little room inside.
What baffles me is that Lexus doesn't realize that a hugggggge part of a big body luxury car is just the space inside. This is also why dealers can't keep Yukons and Escalades on the lots. Remember the old E38 LWB (740iL) cars from the 90s? They had it right. Legroom was absolutely ridiculous in the back.
I'm not a super-tall man, 5'11", and my head almost hit the ceiling. That was the first thing I noticed when I got in. Not good.
Rear legroom/space is unacceptable. My knees almost hit the driver's seat. The car feels very cramped inside. The backseat (whole interior, really) in my old LS430 feels much more spacious. I can't believe the car is this long, with this little room inside.
What baffles me is that Lexus doesn't realize that a hugggggge part of a big body luxury car is just the space inside. This is also why dealers can't keep Yukons and Escalades on the lots. Remember the old E38 LWB (740iL) cars from the 90s? They had it right. Legroom was absolutely ridiculous in the back.
05-19-18, 07:38 AM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
I was at the dealer again yesterday, they had several on the lot. There were two $102,000 examples in the showroom which I sat in.
I'm not a super-tall man, 5'11", and my head almost hit the ceiling. That was the first thing I noticed when I got in. Not good.
Rear legroom/space is unacceptable. My knees almost hit the driver's seat. The car feels very cramped inside. The backseat (whole interior, really) in my old LS430 feels much more spacious. I can't believe the car is this long, with this little room inside.
What baffles me is that Lexus doesn't realize that a hugggggge part of a big body luxury car is just the space inside. This is also why dealers can't keep Yukons and Escalades on the lots. Remember the old E38 LWB (740iL) cars from the 90s? They had it right. Legroom was absolutely ridiculous in the back.
I'm not a super-tall man, 5'11", and my head almost hit the ceiling. That was the first thing I noticed when I got in. Not good.
Rear legroom/space is unacceptable. My knees almost hit the driver's seat. The car feels very cramped inside. The backseat (whole interior, really) in my old LS430 feels much more spacious. I can't believe the car is this long, with this little room inside.
What baffles me is that Lexus doesn't realize that a hugggggge part of a big body luxury car is just the space inside. This is also why dealers can't keep Yukons and Escalades on the lots. Remember the old E38 LWB (740iL) cars from the 90s? They had it right. Legroom was absolutely ridiculous in the back.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 05-19-18 at 07:46 AM.
05-19-18, 06:43 PM
#21
Driver School Candidate
Regarding the ride difference 460 vs 500, I thought the ride in the 500 was clearly smoother than the 460, while other posters say the reverse. However, quite often a ride difference will be tire pressure and tire brand.
I expected run-flats to be harsher, but not so vs what I had on the 460. Perhaps I had too much pressure on the tires in the 460?
I expected run-flats to be harsher, but not so vs what I had on the 460. Perhaps I had too much pressure on the tires in the 460?
05-20-18, 01:20 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
Regarding the ride difference 460 vs 500, I thought the ride in the 500 was clearly smoother than the 460, while other posters say the reverse. However, quite often a ride difference will be tire pressure and tire brand.
I expected run-flats to be harsher, but not so vs what I had on the 460. Perhaps I had too much pressure on the tires in the 460?
I expected run-flats to be harsher, but not so vs what I had on the 460. Perhaps I had too much pressure on the tires in the 460?
The difference in ride with the LS500 air vs non air is bigger than the difference in the LS460 air vs non air.
05-20-18, 01:48 PM
#23
Driver School Candidate
Thanks for the point about air suspension.
I have it on the 500
I did not have it on my earlier 460s.
I had it in the way past and didn’t think it was a big deal.
I did not test drive the 500 vs no air suspension but that may be why I like the 500 ride.
I have it on the 500
I did not have it on my earlier 460s.
I had it in the way past and didn’t think it was a big deal.
I did not test drive the 500 vs no air suspension but that may be why I like the 500 ride.
05-20-18, 02:28 PM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Then that explains a lot, the air suspension has a big impact on the 460 too, I’ve had 460s with and without it
05-21-18, 03:42 PM
#25
generally it is very similar for all of Lexi models, although LS might have suffered drastic change in performance targets due to very old average buying age.
2IS to 3IS and 3GS to 4GS also had many owners claiming they will not get it... even RX gets through it.
2IS to 3IS and 3GS to 4GS also had many owners claiming they will not get it... even RX gets through it.
05-22-18, 04:52 PM
#26
Was just checking the specs. The headroom of the LS500 is down 1.5 inches on the LS430. Front seat legroom is down 3 inches. Shoulder room decreased on the 500 by two inches in the back, same dimensions for the front seats. There are some strange this Lexus is doing with the new LS500.
05-22-18, 05:00 PM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
I keep saying it, but if this were the redesign for the GS, Lexus would have hit a home rum. For the LS, which is supposed to be the flagship, it's a hard pill to swallow for some. The fact that the interior doesn't have more space is a shock. It's longer than the outgoing model and the motor is smaller, so you would think the back seat would be cavernous.
You just have to adjust your thinking and understand that this car is a car thats to be compared against the likes of the Panamara and the Jaguar XJ, not really the same sort of car as the S Class, A8, 7 Series or G90. Those cars are flagships too, but the aim is different.
05-22-18, 05:26 PM
#28
hmm, never really noticed. I'll have to pay more attention with the next new gen coming out. i guess it's rare to own adjacent generations of the same model and very few transition to the new generation, and criticism will always be there, which is all fine. we'll all have our favorite Lexus. but some remarks of the new MKV are downright ruthless hahaha
05-23-18, 06:46 AM
#29
Pole Position
I don't mind the outside look of the car. It's ok. Nothing special, just ok. I'm just not a fan of the interior. It doesn't grab me like my 08 or even some of the 2013's I've been in. I've not driven a 500 so I can't speak of performance. Just the interior alone is enough to keep me away.
05-23-18, 03:44 PM
#30
It's a perception problem. Competitors have top end very powerful models, with either supercharged V8s (Jaguar) or bi-turbo V8s and V12s (Germans). Lexus has nothing up there. NOTHING. So while mercedes sells very few S65 AMGs, they exist and give the brand the perception of super powerful and hi-end. Lexus lost me because they went into a limbo market niche, perhaps populated by a new generation that expects just an ON/OFF switch under the hood and coudn't care less about how many cylinders any car has, or what is the displacement, torque, etc... Soon it will all be electric anyways, internal combustion engines might become a museum piece in less than 2 generations.