roadfrog

Got my Blackstone Labs report back.. Here it is:

Blackstone.pdf

So everything looks great with 6k miles on the oil. Have been advised to go 8k miles on this change.

No idea where the oil is going (2 qts in 6k miles). Obviously not burning it and there is no indications of any leaks. The good thing is that the consumption went down by a qt in this OCI. Perhaps it will continue to drop with continued use of the TGMO. Regardless, I'm not concerned and apparently neither is Lexus, as they consider this sort of consumption as well below normal levels. I realize there are many here that have no consumption whatsoever, but there's also many who do.

Doublebase

Thanks for posting, I love these things. One thing that I can't help but notice is how low TGMO has dropped in their moly - and I've seen it in other reports too - which is confusing because that is what people praise the oil for. Some have said the quality of moly has increased, but I don't know anything about that (or if moly does what it's supposed to do anyway).

Losing two quarts in 6k miles doesn't seem like a big deal to me either. You going to push it out to 8k miles on your next change?

stkgator

Chris

Your report has the incorrect engine, it should be 1UR-FSE, unless you swapped engines with a Tundra☺ - this should only affect the Universal Averages column.

On my last test, I had 6,400 miles on the oil and the results were very similar to your test. I also had a TBN test which came back at 4.6.

Nospinzone

They sent you someone else's report, under client name it doesn't read roadfrog!

I would be really interested to see if you extend the testing past the 8000 mile mark. I'd love to see what it looks like at 10k and even beyond, but I realize you probably would not want to leave the oil in that long.

I have never had to add oil to my engine between changes, and I do it at 10k intervals. One interesting note though is I don't get anywhere near the gas mileage that I read others here get. I wonder if there is any connection, I could speculate.

Devh

If you're referring to the virgin oil analysis where they found lower levels of moly it is due to the switch to trinucular moly which is supposed to be better and does not require large quantities.

If you're referring to the lower moly from the recent oil analysis it could be due to the moly burnishing into the metal. Whatever the case is this report looks a lot better than any of the Mobil one reports that I've seen. There is virtually no wear and I think a lot has to do with the additive package which is robust in zinc and moly. I think further analysis is necessary from other owners to confirm these findings.

roadfrog

Yep! I'll do that a couple of times and then and in another sample.

I'm pretty happy. The report is a lot better than I got with the Quaker State Ultimate Durability, which gets good reviews on BITOG. There's no way I'm using anything but TGMO from now on. This report and the ZERO hesitation issues with it, only reinforces my stand.

Devh

I think I possibly know why the moly is higher in the first sample. It looks like there were 3 quarts added on the earlier interval vs the latest sample and depending on when it was added before the sample was taken the moly would have been replenished.

Roadfrog I noticed that you did not get the TBN done. I think that would be one of the more important values in predicting how long we can go on this oil.

Doublebase

I think going from a 159 moly count, to a 37 moly count might have more to do with a formula change than the moly burnishing into the metal. I could be wrong. And he did add two quarts along the way. I've used TGMO before and I liked it, I'd just like to know for sure what's going on.

And this trinucular moly you speak of, do you think Mobil one puts an exclusive moly package in to just TGMO, and then leaves it out of their own product? Because their oils (mobil 1 synthetic, etc) have a higher moly content than what I've been seeing lately on BITOG, etc, in used oil and virgin oil analysis of TGMO.

I'd just like to know - and we'll never find out - but either way the UOA shows little wear on his engine, so it's certainly doing it's job. I think I might send a sample in on mine (right now I'm running Mobil 1 EP synthetic), I'll let it go till 8k and then send a sample in. I remember you saying how the EP is corrosive in nature - and I don't plan on using it again - I just want to see the moly content and if the readings come back normal for wear.

Devh

I did a little digging around and found that the VOA for trinucular moly version is 124PPM. The old formulation had 800PPM of regular moly. It also appears that they bumped up the Zinc to 900 ppm from 700ppm. Those are significant changes.
Supposedly the trinucular moly is a lot more effective.
Compared to the Mobil 0w-20 EP VOA it appears that the Moly is only 54 ppm and the Zinc is 787 ppm.


This there is a big difference between the two oil as far as it's additive package and because the Toyota oil has a much higher viscosity index it is another contributor to reduction of wear.

satiger

iTrader: (1)

Roadfrog (Chris!), thanks for sharing the oil analysis. If you haven't noticed, your address, phone numbers are unmasked on the attached pdf.

How many miles on the engine?. Engine oil consumption happens as it ages however there is a formula Toyota issued as to how much oil consumption is allowed based on miles/type of engine. If I can find that service bulletin, will share is here. If you have < 100k miles and have to top off 2 quarts every 5k miles, I believe it may not be the normal range. Did you discuss this with trusted service advisor at Lexus/Toyota?. Just for peace of mind, you even can call Lexus 1 800 ask the question (will be transferred to second level support).

Just for the reference, I don't (no need to) top off on my 245k miles ES nor 135k miles GX. Used Toyota/Lexus oil changes up to around 100k miles and then switched to Mobile 1 High mileage full synthetic.

Doublebase

I did a little research too, but I couldn't find any proof that TGMO uses the trinucular moly technology (but then again I only spent ten minutes looking).

I did discover that there are two companies that make the moly and Mobil and Shell own the one that makes the trinucular stuff (if I read that right and can trust what I'm reading on message boards), so you'd think TGMO has it.

One thing that seems certain, TGMO has gone through several changes in it's formulation over the years, but the viscosity remains top notch. Also I think this oil is perhaps the most debated/praised oil on the market, yet very few people outside of the Toyota community know or use it. I know I've mentioned it to many tech friends of mine and none of them have even heard of it

Devh

It has to be the trinucular version evidenced by the fact that the numbers for moly would be abnormally low if it was otherwise. I believe the formulation changed when Toyota switched manufactures from Enos to Mobil. Then it changed again around 2011 to meet SN standards which I think was the switch to the newer moly and more zinc. I also believe the VI also improved a bit so it is probable that the oil got better in it's evolution in both efficiency with reduced engine wear.
RFs oil analysis is one of the best ones I have seen on this board and it's trending so it's not a fluke. I would like to see what this oil looks like at 10k.

Doublebase

Yeah I'd like to see it at 10k too, the larger sump on the LS would lead you to believe that it wouldn't be a problem. But then again we have the filter to consider, is it ok to leave it in there for 10k miles? I guess it depends on the brand. Topping up will help with the TBN, but I just find that my oil shears quite a bit after 5k miles and I start to lose a little oil at that point. All the way up to 5k miles I lose nothing, but once I hit that magic number I start to lose about a half a quart every 1k miles.

7500 is what I generally do now. I feel comfortable with that...I top off a couple times and I don't replace the filter, but I might consider going 10k if reports are positive.

Devh

Oil filtration is not a problem with modern filter media. The only reason to change the filter is if you do a 25k mile oil interval that many Amsoil customers have done without any ill effects.
All cars burn oil, the amount is what is important. If your engine oil is burning after a certain millage then there is something wrong with the oil that you are using or there is a problem with your car.
The reason why I'm interested in stretching the interval is not because Im cheap, it's because it will have less wear.

roadfrog

It's my understanding that this is fine. I would still change it at the 1 yr mark though. According to what I saw on BITOG, a quality filter (like Toyota's) will go a year no problem and 15k miles as well.