I'm thinking of buying 10 ls460l, has awd, air susp, leather trim, luxury package, but no ML. Is there a big difference in sound. What are the major problems with the 10 besides air suspension. Thanks

 

Highly unusual for a car with that level of spec not to come with ML. Can you put a DVD into the changer? If it plays it, you have the ML system. If it ejects it, you don't.

 

Personally, unless it is a killer deal, I just can't see spending this kind of money for a car and not getting it. If it doesn't have ML, I doubt it has some other features.

There are plenty out there loaded to the gills. I would bypass something like that.

 

The ML system is just superior compared with the standard system and there is a difference in sound. The ML is a must if you truly enjoy listening to music. The air suspension shouldn't be an issue but costly to repair, but there are plenty of LS for sale without it. Regardless, the Lexus LS 460 is an outstanding automobile.

 

No kidding....didn't even think you could get that level of options without it.

If it were me, I would walk. There is no way I would get an LS without Mr. Levinson in the house! It's just THAT good....in fact the best factory sound in any vehicle manufactured.

When I was shopping for my LS, the number one option I was looking for was ML and avoided all cars on the market that didn't have it.

 

thanks all, you would be suprised how many 10 and 11 ive looked at that dont have ML. I would say more than 50 percent dont have the ML system. if you look on cars.com or autotrader, look at the stereo, if it doesn have it written in the middle of the radio functions is standard radio, i am wondering also why so many people have standard, but i figure many just dont realize it.

 

Must be an American thing. Of the nineteen 2010/11 LS's listed for sale on Autotrader in Canada right now, only one does not have the ML.

 

That's why I suggested the DVD experiment...... you may be surprised.

 

The easiest way to know if you have ML, is to look below the CD player and it will be marked "Mark Levinson Reference Surround"

 

The ML system and non ML both use the DSP(digital signal processor) to simulate high quality sound with cheap speakers. They only send certain
frequencies to certain speakers creating a surround sound effect. To upgrade, you must 1) upgrade the speakers 2) put in a summing device or line out converter(kicker zxsum8 as an example) which reassembles the sound into full range signals and then 3) run it though an amp(I used the Rockford fosgate 5 channel amp). This will produce full range sound from all speakers. Don't forget to upgrade your subwoofer and send at least 200w of power to it for a nice thumping effect..more if needed...

 

The ML system uses 7.1 DTS processing among other enhancements. Not sure what you're saying when you state, "The ML system and non ML both use the DSP (digital signal processor) to simulate high quality sound with cheap speakers"

 

The best systems out there are digital crossover active not passive as you suggested. The basic system is a generic passive system with drivers that have a natural frequency roll off.

I have not heard the ML system however I believe it is an active system. The ML also uses high quality components that are matched and if it is truly reference it would be front sound stage dominant and not surround with music. If one wanted to upgrade the system they would need at the very least higher quality amps then Fosgates which are crap in my opinion. I would choose Zappco amps instead which are known for sound quality.

 

Yes it is a "TRUE" reference surround. Trust me when I tell you that the ML and non ML are complete different animals. The only listeners that would not care or hear the difference, are those that think, "if it's loud it must be good".

 

That is one of the biggest problems with aftermarket car audio. The actual sound quality market has been overshadowed by the turn it up crowd who listen to poorly recorded audio.

If I have to make one criticism about the ML marketing or many of the other systems is the use of the word reference. If you heard reference you and I would not like it and therefore all listening systems are slightly colored which is the beauty of personal preference however there is a such thing as bad sounding.
The most important thing about a good system is the tuning not necessarily the components. Maybe if there is a local meet in my area I would like to judge the ML and determine if it is as good as my "reference sound" .

 

I didn't know my car had the ML system because I was looking for the ML logo in the wrong place. My 430 had it on the wall of the console. Now I know where it's supposed to be and I do see many 460's for sale without the ML logo.

I have to say the ML is superior in every way.