You can have it both ways. The LS430 with a European handling package produced a dead quiet car, a smooth ride, and very limited body roll. Granted, it's not a BMW or a Porsche, but it's a heck of a lot better than the soft mushy suspension that seems to appeal to retirees.

I'm guessing that the demand for the European option was limited (again due to the target market for the car), so they killed it.

I'm wondering if you could take your LS460 to a decent shop to have one installed aftermarket? I'd guess that upgraded components might get rid of the roll.

 

If Lexus wanted the LS to drive like a BMW (stiff) they would have built it that way. For someone to say the Lexus is not fun to drive, in my opinion is making un-mentionable remarks, truly inappropriate. I take drives with no where to go just because A Lexus is so fun to drive! Matter a fact, this thread has creating such a overwhelming urge and reminder just how "FUN" my Lexus is to drive, I'm going for a ride right now. Thanks!

 

Sorry, but that's a generalization that's just not true. It's a common phrase amongst German car fans and Lexus detractors.

I LOVE to drive, and HATE being driven. I especially love to drive on twisty, scenic (albeit paved) back roads.

I've owned 2 LS's, and currently own a BMW. I'll be RUNNING back to an LS in '08 when my lease is up.

Since I'm not a race track driver or ever on a race track, I've found no difference in handling between my BMW and my previous LS's.

If your definition of FUN is harsh ride, and feel and hear every bump, in exchange for (supposed) better handling then BMW is for you.

If your definition of FUN driving is tight, competent handling, all bumps smoothed out to nothing, absolute comfort and confidence, then the LS is just right.

HBH

 

This makes no sense to me. You cannot have a good handling car without performance tires/suspension/steering, etc. The smoother the car the worse the handling. That is why the IS is perhaps the best handling Lexus ever built.

 

Wow, that's an incredible statement. I drive a year old LS430 and I'm on my 3nd BMW....currently a 2007 3-Series coupe with Sport Suspension. If you think there is no difference in handling between a Lexus and a BMW you are truly missing the BMW Experience. The Lexus is pleasurable to drive, isolated from the road and isolated from any road feel...pure comfort. Sort of like being in a coffin. The BMW, on the other hand, is exciting and exhilerating to drive...it is truly "The Ultimate Driving Machine." This is not meant to be any criticism of the Lexus...they are just totally different cars. The Lexus is superior in terms of reliability and dependibility, and pure comfort and isolation, but it in no way drives like a BMW.

 

I have driven the wife's girlfriend's BMW 750 Sport for a week each spring. For normal driving on the streets and freeways the handling is not noticeably different from the LS460. The 750's only advantage in that kind of driving is the brakes. AWESOME brakes. IMHO, other than that, under "normal" driving conditions, the LS460 is superior in all other aspects, including exterior and interior design. Even the electric motor that opens and closes the trunk is quieter on the LS

 

I would say the LS has never won a brake feel contest, and im guessing that is intentional. I, too wish it had more brake feel, but im guessing most owners love the smoothness.

 

Sunday's NY Times review - Not sure why people think an LS handle like a 7 series. I have yet to find a review that agrees with you.

Personally if I drove an LS, I would feel very old. I am not ready to drive off into the sunset.


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In an article which will be in Sunday's NYTimes, a review of the Lexus LS460 makes comparison to 7-Series saying BMW has "athletic moves." See below:

December 10, 2006
Behind the Wheel
It’s a Luxury Liner, Not a Love Boat
By LAWRENCE ULRICH
AS history buffs are fond of saying, you can lose the battle but win the war.

That bromide surely describes the Lexus LS sedan, now entering its fourth generation as the LS 460. Since its inaugural year of 1989, this Japanese flagship has received its share of cannonballs from auto critics. Its styling has been dismissed as a Mercedes knockoff. Its soothing driving experience, a bit like doing the breaststroke in a gravy boat, can’t match the athletic moves of a BMW 7 Series. For design panache, it’s no Audi A8. And with Toyota on its coat of arms, it lacks the pedigree of Jaguar.

But every year, when the smoke clears, a funny thing happens: the Lexus LS handily outsells them all, in part because it keeps rolling while its trouble-prone rivals are stuck in the shop.

The LS 460 is more of the same, easily the most user-friendly of the big luxury cars and a magnificent long-distance tourer. But despite its endless virtues, the Lexus still isn’t the stuff of executive daydreams or nightclub fantasies.

For the first time, buyers can choose two sizes: the LS 460, starting at $61,715, or the $71,715 LS 460 L, which gets a nearly five-inch stretch for a roomier back seat.

The V-8 engine, the first all-new design since Lexus’ opening year, delivers the cruise-ship power expected in this class: 380 horsepower and 367 pound-feet of torque from a mere 4.6 liters.

This silken, sophisticated engine is joined to the world’s first eight-speed automatic transmission, one-upping Mercedes’s seven speeds. The gearbox shifts almost imperceptibly and helps the LS hum from 0 to 60 miles an hour in just 5.4 seconds. Yet cruising at 65 m.p.h. in eighth gear — with the engine loafing at a near-silent 1,600 r.p.m. — the Lexus returned 30 miles a gallon, remarkable for such a big, mighty machine. My mileage exceeded the federal highway rating of 27 m.p.g. (18 in town). Over all, I got 21 m.p.g. in my test car.

An adaptive air suspension and optional variable-ratio steering deliver effortless comfort and control. As ever, the LS isn’t especially sporty. In this class, if you want hot handling, you go with BMW or, one better, with a Maserati Quattroporte.

Instead of thrills, it’s all about chill: The LS 460 L I tested was reading-room quiet, as relaxing as a four-star resort. Visually, the cabin may lack the boutique dazzle of Audi or Mercedes, but the materials and finishes are fully on par. For instance, the LS’s steering wheel leather is buffed twice and gets a special water-based dye for a pleasing look and feel. Outside, the flawless paint is hand-sanded twice.

The latest edition of the fabulous, optional Mark Levinson audio system features 19 speakers and 450 watts, plus a hard drive that holds up to 2,000 songs from CD’s — though the drive cannot store tunes from an iPod. (You can play your iPod through the system, however.)

Except for one gimmicky feature, not one function required a trip to the owner’s manual — or the maddening trial and error required on some German models just to find the ballgame on the radio. (Isn’t that the point of a luxury car, to make life easier rather than harder?) The Lexus touch screen, which controls the navigation, climate and audio systems, remains the class benchmark for intuitive operation.

The one unconvincing feature is the “advanced parking guidance system.” This $1,200 option lets the car parallel-park itself or back into a space between two cars. A screen displays a camera view of the intended space, overlaid with a rectangular grid that you adjust to confirm the final destination. After that, you simply feather the brake and the car steers itself into place. Theoretically.

In practice, the system often took multiple tries over several minutes before docking successfully. It struggled to identify curbs and regularly asked me to realign the car before trying to park. The parking space has to be huge, at least five feet longer than the car, calling the entire exercise into question. And the system shuts down if you back up too fast.

My advice: If your parking skills are so bad that you need a robotic rescue, hire a driver and take the executive seating package instead.

This $12,675 option (available only on the stretch version) comes closest to giving the Lexus the cachet it covets. Both its rear seats can be reclined, heated or cooled. And the right-side chair features a deeper, 45-degree recline plus an extending ottoman — imagine a first-class airliner seat, complete with a remote control for “shiatsu,” or stretch massage, in varying strengths.

Sensors measure rear passengers’ body temperatures in three zones and adjust the climate control accordingly. The package also adds a DVD entertainment system with a vivid nine-inch display; fancier leather and headliner; power sunshades for the rear doors; a box that cools beverages; and a center console with a Bentleyesque folding table of polished wood.

The only thing missing, my wife suggested, was a power pedicure.

The fixed center console limits riders to two in back, and the package significantly reduces trunk space to 12 cubic feet, down from 18 in cars without it, to accommodate a separate rear air-conditioner. And there’s only one V.I.P. seat, because fully extending the ottoman requires pivoting the front passenger chair forward via a rear console control.

Parents be warned: Plopping siblings in back will be sheer fratricide as they vie for the junior V.I.P. chair. But the real-deal executive could indeed hire a chauffeur and simulate the Roll-Royce or Maybach experience for a fraction of the price.

Laden with options, the LS 460 L test car checked in at $92,120.

This powerhouse of luxury, quality and technology demands respect, but it still doesn’t spark much lust. Blame the styling again, a letdown considering the momentum Lexus showed with its handsome IS and GS. Those sedans are perhaps the most distinctive Lexuses yet, but the LS takes a safer approach. The result is another apologetic Asian design, a doughy blend of BMW 7 Series and Toyota Avalon.
The look is so, well, acceptable — and you expect a grander adjective for a car that can top $90,000. (The hybrid LS 600h arrives in spring with a price that can hit six figures.)

Like a brain surgeon who dreams of being a rock star, Lexus imagines its new LS as a hotter, more desirable machine. But really, what’s wrong with being a brain surgeon? Once again, men and women unmoved by flash will happily settle down with this brilliant, sensible and successful Lexus.

•

INSIDE TRACK: A thrilla in vanilla.

 

If you want to go around a curve posted at 45 MPH at 60 MPH, yup, a 750 or 550 is better. I'm just not in that much of a hurry to wear my tires out.

 

I think the above posters have made it very clear that under "normal" driving on regular roads/highway, not a test track, that the difference is not that much. And normal driving is >95% if not 100%, that cars in this class are used for.

Merely driving a car will not make me feel ANY different about myself, as much I love cars. It's health, personal well-being & attitude towards life that should REALLY make people feel young/old. I will not let a car make me feel any different about myself.
I can enjoy a very sporty car like a Porsche, a S2000 etc. just as much as a more sedate , luxurious & refined car like a LS. They offer DIFFERENT kinds of satisfactions that I can appreciate just the same. It has NOTHING to do with age


I think the LS460, epecially in LWB, looks better than the IS overall, although I like the more aggressive front end of the IS better. The LS460 looks a lot better than the GS to me. See how subjective this can be ?
Also, I think the only other large luxury sedan in this class that looks better overall than the LS460 is the Audi A8.

 

To throw another log on this fire, another issue with the LS 460 is it has lost its unique look. The lines a very similar to many other Toyota products. It looks a bit like an 07 Camry on steroids!

 

I've encountered three+ problems with my LS460L

1. DVD changer broke after about 3 days. Still waiting for a replacement three weeks later. Changer won't eject discs (yes they're store bought discs with silk screen label art and no paper labels).

2. Vynil on B pillar at, and below, the arm rest on drivers side is delicate (probably on passenger side too, but rarely do I have passengers). If you brush against is with denim jeans, or similar thick seamed slacks, the material will show scrapes and even tear. Same thing has happened with my wife's 2006 GS300. It looks just terrible. I'll probably order a replacement now so I can switch it out when selling the car years from now.

3. There's a bit of hesitation when moving from a standing start (unless you use the hold feature which seems to eliminate the problem). And I can't make the car stop without a lurch no matter how careful I am. Not a problem really but a nuisance.

Still love the car. Would still buy it today.

 

From past experience, I have noticed that cars with firmer suspension setup tends to be more wobbly or easily jolted to the left and right when driven on bumpy road conditions. This makes the car feel unstable. With tight suspension, you do turn faster on a curve, but most of the time the road is straight. The firmer suspension also exaggerate the road bumps more, so you feel every little bumps there is. It's not good when you're having a bad day, i.e. headache.

With that said, I think Lexus got the right setup between smooth ride and road handling. I am also excited that Lexus is creating the new F car line-up to cater to the sportier customer base. These are exciting years to be a Lexus owner/shopper.

In the future, one can have a Lexus for the smooth long drive and a F batched Lexus for the thrill ride.

 

My right turn singal light has water in it.

 

people say something about the bland styling but when BMW designs an ugly generation of cars trying to be different people dont like it, cant please anyone. Trying to be different doesnt work all the time especially in BMW Bangles case