Just how great is the LS430?
03-25-18, 06:44 PM
#16
Moderator
Reliability does come into play and makes a heavy statement when you are on the side of the road with an Benz 500 or BMW 7 series which is not uncommon. The grief you might experience with a late model Benz or Bimmer that breaks down is enough to wish you were even driving a Toyota Corolla! Reliability comes in first for my choosing a daily car. Second is looks, and how I feel about driving it. Yes... there are a zillion cars in my development that are upscale, and most are leased. I own my car free and clear, gets me everywhere, shines and looks new and everyone knows me because I've had it so long. Visiting a Mercedes or Bmw dealer is not a fun thing with a new car and especially when it's their flagship.. I stick with my "old man's car" 2001 Lexus LS430....Comfy and gets me where I need to go with never a worry. Who's the hero?
03-25-18, 07:19 PM
#17
Reliability does come into play and makes a heavy statement when you are on the side of the road with an Benz 500 or BMW 7 series which is not uncommon. The grief you might experience with a late model Benz or Bimmer that breaks down is enough to wish you were even driving a Toyota Corolla! Reliability comes in first for my choosing a daily car. Second is looks, and how I feel about driving it. Yes... there are a zillion cars in my development that are upscale, and most are leased. I own my car free and clear, gets me everywhere, shines and looks new and everyone knows me because I've had it so long. Visiting a Mercedes or Bmw dealer is not a fun thing with a new car and especially when it's their flagship.. I stick with my "old man's car" 2001 Lexus LS430....Comfy and gets me where I need to go with never a worry. Who's the hero?
As my username suggests, I truly support this line of thought.
I do not want to visit dealership even if repairs are free and even if they give me a loaner for free. I just want to enjoy my car knowing it will not beak every now and then.
LS does break in certain aspects but it is manageable and doesn't leave you stranded for the most part. e.g. mirrors don't adjust. Big deal.
Only time I was kind of stranded was when my alternator went out and that too when my car was in my garage. It was manageable. I was actually stranded with a brand new Nissan more often due to s++itty factory tires than used LS430.
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Bocatrip (03-25-18)
03-26-18, 06:16 AM
#18
Pole Position
I just compared average used asking prices to the 2004 S500, which was about $15k more new. Nationwide with less than 100k miles.
2004 LS430 $12,363
2004 S500 $8,762
Considering how much more the S500 was new, it says a lot to asking prices of the LS430 to be almost 50% more after 14 years.
2004 LS430 $12,363
2004 S500 $8,762
Considering how much more the S500 was new, it says a lot to asking prices of the LS430 to be almost 50% more after 14 years.
03-26-18, 06:28 AM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
I just compared average used asking prices to the 2004 S500, which was about $15k more new. Nationwide with less than 100k miles.
2004 LS430 $12,363
2004 S500 $8,762
Considering how much more the S500 was new, it says a lot to asking prices of the LS430 to be almost 50% more after 14 years.
2004 LS430 $12,363
2004 S500 $8,762
Considering how much more the S500 was new, it says a lot to asking prices of the LS430 to be almost 50% more after 14 years.
When I looked at LS430s in 10/16, Audi A8's had 20k less miles, and cost $2k less, yet were $78k brand new. The question imho becomes how self sufficient, and how well do you know indies if you embark on the German flagships. I already say no way no how to BMW V8's, but am MB biturbo curious..........I wouldn't necessarily bet my timely arrival at work on one, but how nice would it be to drive one. In your above example, you have $3k that you can apply towards repairs. The one I would want is the 2007+ though, not 2004.
03-26-18, 06:43 AM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
+1
As my username suggests, I truly support this line of thought.
I do not want to visit dealership even if repairs are free and even if they give me a loaner for free. I just want to enjoy my car knowing it will not beak every now and then.
LS does break in certain aspects but it is manageable and doesn't leave you stranded for the most part. e.g. mirrors don't adjust. Big deal.
Only time I was kind of stranded was when my alternator went out and that too when my car was in my garage. It was manageable. I was actually stranded with a brand new Nissan more often due to s++itty factory tires than used LS430.
As my username suggests, I truly support this line of thought.
I do not want to visit dealership even if repairs are free and even if they give me a loaner for free. I just want to enjoy my car knowing it will not beak every now and then.
LS does break in certain aspects but it is manageable and doesn't leave you stranded for the most part. e.g. mirrors don't adjust. Big deal.
Only time I was kind of stranded was when my alternator went out and that too when my car was in my garage. It was manageable. I was actually stranded with a brand new Nissan more often due to s++itty factory tires than used LS430.
Yeah that pass mirror where the gel is gone (can't dim as a result), I could have gotten a new OE mirror glass for $186 minus 20%, and I still couldn't do it, just live with it....Toyota parts are insane at list, that glass is $389 list. For a mirror glass. Decided to check the part on a BMW 7 series, and it lists for $371, Lexus wins! But usually it wins by a bigger margin than that...
03-26-18, 07:48 AM
#21
How nice? Nicer than most brand new cars and a bulletproof '05 Rolls Royce Phantom. I went to the Atlanta International Auto Show this weekend and couldn't find a car that matches the LS430 in terms of quality--driving experience aside. However, I will say that the LC500 and LX570 do come close.
03-27-18, 11:47 AM
#22
Driver School Candidate
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I recently bought a pristine 2005 LS430 and am trying to come to grips with it., so my comments reflect some serious ambiguity I have about this car.
"How nice? Nicer than most brand new cars". I've rented a few new cars recently and don't find this comment to be accurate at all. Comparable? Certainly, but build and material quality has gone up significantly in new cars available in the last 10 years. As cars approach similar levels of performance and reliability, the mfgs have to increase creature comforts to differentiate and compete, and it shows in many makes and models.
Left by the side of the road? That's happened to me once in 50 yrs of driving, and it was almost in my driveway. And that's what AAA is for.
Reliability is tossed out a lot, but that's not an exclusive characteristic. My experience, with very few repairs, has included Toyota 240K, Mitsubishi 230K, Chevy 200K, Lincoln 160K, Chrysler 150K. None of these received excellent preventative maintenance from me, but they still performed amazingly. Repairs included tires, brakes, battery, radiator, alternator, etc, items most would agree are anticipated replacement items over the life of the vehicle. None of those cars required a $1k set of tires every 30k miles or $1900 factory service every 90k miles. Every one got much better mileage on regular gas than my current 16 mpg on premium.
A number of posters have mentioned how important it is to them to get safely and reliably from point A to point B. I understand that concern, but I'd like the ride to include more engagement in the driving experience.
I bought this car because my wife loved the look and the luxurious interior. But this is the most boring car I've ever driven. I'm not trying to knock other folks' choice of car, but I'm a car guy, not a Barcalounger guy. I want a car that's fun to drive, not take a nap in it. I used to look for excuses to take a drive. Now driving is just another daily task.
I concede that if you can find a good one at an attractive price (<$10k), you do get a lot of transportation for the money.
"How nice? Nicer than most brand new cars". I've rented a few new cars recently and don't find this comment to be accurate at all. Comparable? Certainly, but build and material quality has gone up significantly in new cars available in the last 10 years. As cars approach similar levels of performance and reliability, the mfgs have to increase creature comforts to differentiate and compete, and it shows in many makes and models.
Left by the side of the road? That's happened to me once in 50 yrs of driving, and it was almost in my driveway. And that's what AAA is for.
Reliability is tossed out a lot, but that's not an exclusive characteristic. My experience, with very few repairs, has included Toyota 240K, Mitsubishi 230K, Chevy 200K, Lincoln 160K, Chrysler 150K. None of these received excellent preventative maintenance from me, but they still performed amazingly. Repairs included tires, brakes, battery, radiator, alternator, etc, items most would agree are anticipated replacement items over the life of the vehicle. None of those cars required a $1k set of tires every 30k miles or $1900 factory service every 90k miles. Every one got much better mileage on regular gas than my current 16 mpg on premium.
A number of posters have mentioned how important it is to them to get safely and reliably from point A to point B. I understand that concern, but I'd like the ride to include more engagement in the driving experience.
I bought this car because my wife loved the look and the luxurious interior. But this is the most boring car I've ever driven. I'm not trying to knock other folks' choice of car, but I'm a car guy, not a Barcalounger guy. I want a car that's fun to drive, not take a nap in it. I used to look for excuses to take a drive. Now driving is just another daily task.
I concede that if you can find a good one at an attractive price (<$10k), you do get a lot of transportation for the money.
03-27-18, 01:04 PM
#23
Pole Position
I have been driving my "boring" "barcalounger" to look at used cars for my middle kid (daughter). We have been driving the most ridiculous junk available to man. These are $7,000 to $8,000 smaller SUVs.
Noisy, bumpy, buzzy, harsh, small, ugly. Like sitting on a splintered wooden bench as compared to a barcalounger. My 2001 was $5,400. It is 10 times the car for less money.
I'm sure you could sell your LS and get a harsh, feel every bump "car guy" car very easily. They are everywhere. Spring pot holes ready to take out super low profile tires. If the kid would let me I'd get her an LS 430. Heck with what other people think.
Noisy, bumpy, buzzy, harsh, small, ugly. Like sitting on a splintered wooden bench as compared to a barcalounger. My 2001 was $5,400. It is 10 times the car for less money.
I'm sure you could sell your LS and get a harsh, feel every bump "car guy" car very easily. They are everywhere. Spring pot holes ready to take out super low profile tires. If the kid would let me I'd get her an LS 430. Heck with what other people think.
03-27-18, 02:15 PM
#24
Instructor
I have been driving my "boring" "barcalounger" to look at used cars for my middle kid (daughter). We have been driving the most ridiculous junk available to man. These are $7,000 to $8,000 smaller SUVs.
Noisy, bumpy, buzzy, harsh, small, ugly. Like sitting on a splintered wooden bench as compared to a barcalounger. My 2001 was $5,400. It is 10 times the car for less money.
I'm sure you could sell your LS and get a harsh, feel every bump "car guy" car very easily. They are everywhere. Spring pot holes ready to take out super low profile tires. If the kid would let me I'd get her an LS 430. Heck with what other people think.
Noisy, bumpy, buzzy, harsh, small, ugly. Like sitting on a splintered wooden bench as compared to a barcalounger. My 2001 was $5,400. It is 10 times the car for less money.
I'm sure you could sell your LS and get a harsh, feel every bump "car guy" car very easily. They are everywhere. Spring pot holes ready to take out super low profile tires. If the kid would let me I'd get her an LS 430. Heck with what other people think.
Like you mentioned, it's hard to find a car that's not a POS for that kind of money.
03-27-18, 02:18 PM
#25
Pole Position
If I could find a nice, reasonable GS for $7-$8k I'd pounce on it. We have a few used RX in the area, but when those are used up, they are not good.
There is an RX 400h that is really nice but 171k miles and I think it is used up.
I have a line on an 04 ES 330 with 76k miles. The older lady that owns it upgraded. The continual snow we have been getting has been preventing her from getting it out for sale.
There is an RX 400h that is really nice but 171k miles and I think it is used up.
I have a line on an 04 ES 330 with 76k miles. The older lady that owns it upgraded. The continual snow we have been getting has been preventing her from getting it out for sale.
03-27-18, 02:38 PM
#26
As crazy as this sounds and it does sound crazy......I'm enjoying my 2001 LS430 with almost 135,000 miles, more now than I did when I first purchased it 9 years ago! It might very well be because of all the many maintenance and repairs done over the years as well as the most recent...replacment of my tires to Michelin MXV4s, replacing the LCA bushings, and getting a new OEM Denso MAF. My car just drives consistently like a new car and still has a faint smell of leather. On top of that as a plus.... the paint and finish just glistens while the interior shows almost no wear whatsoever other than some hairlines in the veneer of the steering wheel. What do I have to complain about? I love this car and enjoy every time I'm behind the wheel! It is crazy! Where do we go from her?
Last edited by Bocatrip; 03-27-18 at 05:08 PM.
03-27-18, 03:38 PM
#27
Instructor
If I could find a nice, reasonable GS for $7-$8k I'd pounce on it. We have a few used RX in the area, but when those are used up, they are not good.
There is an RX 400h that is really nice but 171k miles and I think it is used up.
I have a line on an 04 ES 330 with 76k miles. The older lady that owns it upgraded. The continual snow we have been getting has been preventing her from getting it out for sale.
There is an RX 400h that is really nice but 171k miles and I think it is used up.
I have a line on an 04 ES 330 with 76k miles. The older lady that owns it upgraded. The continual snow we have been getting has been preventing her from getting it out for sale.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...068_isFeatured
Last edited by caverman; 03-27-18 at 03:43 PM.
03-27-18, 03:58 PM
#28
Oh my, MB had more than their share of issues with their own air suspensions. They weren’t any less expensive to fix, either. My brother in law still has one, and it’s flat the way around. The two leakers finally took down the compressor. With 2 kids in college, it’s likely to stay that way for a couple of more years. You know, I would like to drive an M5 v10, or one of the hot rod MBs, just long enough to get a speeding ticket, but not long enough to have to pay the repair bill. They are beautiful to look at.
In in all seriousness, I’ll take the Toyota Camry of luxury vehicles for the next 10 years or so.
In in all seriousness, I’ll take the Toyota Camry of luxury vehicles for the next 10 years or so.
03-27-18, 04:21 PM
#29
I recently bought a pristine 2005 LS430 and am trying to come to grips with it., so my comments reflect some serious ambiguity I have about this car.
"How nice? Nicer than most brand new cars". I've rented a few new cars recently and don't find this comment to be accurate at all. Comparable? Certainly, but build and material quality has gone up significantly in new cars available in the last 10 years. As cars approach similar levels of performance and reliability, the mfgs have to increase creature comforts to differentiate and compete, and it shows in many makes and models.
Left by the side of the road? That's happened to me once in 50 yrs of driving, and it was almost in my driveway. And that's what AAA is for.
Reliability is tossed out a lot, but that's not an exclusive characteristic. My experience, with very few repairs, has included Toyota 240K, Mitsubishi 230K, Chevy 200K, Lincoln 160K, Chrysler 150K. None of these received excellent preventative maintenance from me, but they still performed amazingly. Repairs included tires, brakes, battery, radiator, alternator, etc, items most would agree are anticipated replacement items over the life of the vehicle. None of those cars required a $1k set of tires every 30k miles or $1900 factory service every 90k miles. Every one got much better mileage on regular gas than my current 16 mpg on premium.
A number of posters have mentioned how important it is to them to get safely and reliably from point A to point B. I understand that concern, but I'd like the ride to include more engagement in the driving experience.
I bought this car because my wife loved the look and the luxurious interior. But this is the most boring car I've ever driven. I'm not trying to knock other folks' choice of car, but I'm a car guy, not a Barcalounger guy. I want a car that's fun to drive, not take a nap in it. I used to look for excuses to take a drive. Now driving is just another daily task.
I concede that if you can find a good one at an attractive price (<$10k), you do get a lot of transportation for the money.
"How nice? Nicer than most brand new cars". I've rented a few new cars recently and don't find this comment to be accurate at all. Comparable? Certainly, but build and material quality has gone up significantly in new cars available in the last 10 years. As cars approach similar levels of performance and reliability, the mfgs have to increase creature comforts to differentiate and compete, and it shows in many makes and models.
Left by the side of the road? That's happened to me once in 50 yrs of driving, and it was almost in my driveway. And that's what AAA is for.
Reliability is tossed out a lot, but that's not an exclusive characteristic. My experience, with very few repairs, has included Toyota 240K, Mitsubishi 230K, Chevy 200K, Lincoln 160K, Chrysler 150K. None of these received excellent preventative maintenance from me, but they still performed amazingly. Repairs included tires, brakes, battery, radiator, alternator, etc, items most would agree are anticipated replacement items over the life of the vehicle. None of those cars required a $1k set of tires every 30k miles or $1900 factory service every 90k miles. Every one got much better mileage on regular gas than my current 16 mpg on premium.
A number of posters have mentioned how important it is to them to get safely and reliably from point A to point B. I understand that concern, but I'd like the ride to include more engagement in the driving experience.
I bought this car because my wife loved the look and the luxurious interior. But this is the most boring car I've ever driven. I'm not trying to knock other folks' choice of car, but I'm a car guy, not a Barcalounger guy. I want a car that's fun to drive, not take a nap in it. I used to look for excuses to take a drive. Now driving is just another daily task.
I concede that if you can find a good one at an attractive price (<$10k), you do get a lot of transportation for the money.
03-28-18, 02:49 PM
#30
No question...the youtuber Tavarish got a 2007 S600 V12 for $12k, from another youtuber (many of you might even follow or know). I think the car was $140k when new. There isn't a doubt in anyone's minds, this car is ridiculous and not even a 2018 LS500 could compare. When Lexus was fooling around with air suspensions (that eventually go bad and cost $$$$), MB was using CHF11S and their systems were hydraulic.
When I looked at LS430s in 10/16, Audi A8's had 20k less miles, and cost $2k less, yet were $78k brand new. The question imho becomes how self sufficient, and how well do you know indies if you embark on the German flagships. I already say no way no how to BMW V8's, but am MB biturbo curious..........I wouldn't necessarily bet my timely arrival at work on one, but how nice would it be to drive one. In your above example, you have $3k that you can apply towards repairs. The one I would want is the 2007+ though, not 2004.
When I looked at LS430s in 10/16, Audi A8's had 20k less miles, and cost $2k less, yet were $78k brand new. The question imho becomes how self sufficient, and how well do you know indies if you embark on the German flagships. I already say no way no how to BMW V8's, but am MB biturbo curious..........I wouldn't necessarily bet my timely arrival at work on one, but how nice would it be to drive one. In your above example, you have $3k that you can apply towards repairs. The one I would want is the 2007+ though, not 2004.
That 3k would cover the coil packs if they go bad on that V12..... mabye just the one bank can't remember but repairs for that car are ridiculous for just the parts. I could do most of the repairs myself but many of the jobs are engine out jobs and not something i'd look forward to doing a lot. Still the power and features of the S600 have always grabbed my attention. I may grab one in the future as a second car just to see how bad it can actually be.
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