coug66

I don't believe these sellers even know that its a genuine part or if its a counterfeit. are you looking for a genuine part at a non genuine price?
The price is the answer. If its cheap its a non genuine part. I am going to switch my MAF back to the original part. My car has been running great with a cheap one though. They are very simply sensors not allot to worry about for substandard pieces.
The wire and resistance is the big issue and who knows if this isn't the same as a genuine part?

It just seems like you are wasting the vendors time and yours to determine what we all know as true to be true?

I am not trying to spoil your mission just to say it is probably a waste of your and their time and money.

Head to the dealer or rock auto and buy a legit part and enjoy the peace of mind knowing you are taking less of a risk in life.

If the parts they are selling work and are at a cheap price what are you trying to stop?

Bocatrip

The Denso MAF I just received and returned was made in Vietnam and was purchased from Rock Auto!! Go figure!

coug66

Just swapped the original OEM MAF back on the car. The other two are going back in my glove box.

I carry a scanner with me so my hope is I will find a Toyota driver on the side of the road and I can diagnose and install one of my extra maf's and have him on his way.

If I had a mechanic friend look in my glove box and see two extra MAFs he would figure I was pretty paranoid. A car should be able to drive a lifetime without needing to replace a MAF. I just threw away a Nissan MAF from a 1993 Quest van I had as an extra. sold the car and never needed it.

Gronemus

Did you call up RockAuto and ask them where the part was manufactured before you ordered it? Here is their page for the Denso sensor that you probably ordered. The only mention of the part being from Japan is if you use the zoom feature on the photo and happen to see it. It's likely that the picture has been in their database for 10 years now and at that time maybe Japan was the only country where they made that part. You do understand that Denso is a huge company and that they manufacture a lot of product in Vietnam? You can get an idea of this by visiting this link. I'm sure that the part that you received would have worked just as it was designed to. It seems to me that you are wasting a lot of energy needlessly...

911LE

I'd be willing to bet that even if you were to pony up the money for one at the Lexus dealership it would be made in Vietnam as well. This is where Denso produces them and I seriously doubt they would have two separate factories making these. These sensors with the same part number are used on almost all Toyota engines and are by no means exclusive to our cars.
As a side note my car throws the same 2 lean codes but only after extended periods of high speed driving. Both of my front O2 sensors are new. Do you get an occasional light engine pinging under acceleration?

Bocatrip

Thanks 911LE. Yes, I do get the light pinging under acceleration. This has been going on for some time. Right now the CEL has not come back on. I did replace Bank 2 Sensor 1 about 3 years ago. Do you think it might be the 02 sensors? I do almost all city driving. The only symptom other than the pinging is my acceleration when punched is uneven, non linear and sometime erratic. If I accelerate nice and easy, no problem at all. How were you able to do your diagnosis? Where did you go to figure out your problem? What year and how miles on your car?

911LE

I still get the lean codes on long trips. Once I clear them they are gone until my next trip. I get the light pinging which I assume is a result of a lean mixture. I also have the same issue in regards to the non-linear acceleration with dead spots. I do think that the two issues are unrelated. I still have the original MAF (I cleaned it) but everything else is newer (spark plugs, all PCV hoses, exhaust gaskets, front O2 sensors). Mine is an '01 with 134k. I have a copy of Techstream and as soon as I can get it working with my laptop I will start diagnosing everything myself.

Bocatrip

We both have 01s with 134,000 miles. After a 100 mile trip today my CEL came on again. Went to autozone to pull the P0171 and P0174 codes again. Still leaning towards the MAF as the culprit. I’ll be replacing my original MAF within the next few weeks with a new Denso.

Gronemus

Boca, just curious, was your Indy able to confirm that you had no exhaust leaks anywhere???

Bocatrip

None that he could find. He also checked for vacuum leaks as a possible cause for the lean mixture on both banks being "unfiltered air". I happened to get into conversation with the main diagnostic wiz at my local Lexus dealership today who was finishing a discussion with a customer. After explaining all I've gone through with codes and my car's history, the first thing out of his mouth was the MAF. He asked.....what do you have to lose by replacing a 16 year old part that might be the cause. If not, he suggested to bring the car in while the check engine light is still on for a thorough diagnostics. Sometimes they may find it within the first hour as they have the latest diagnostic tools for our cars. Bottom line is, once Lexus finds the issue, they stand behind it regardless. I'm still hoping it's the MAF. I will report back once I do the replacement. Thanks everyone for the great advice.and feedback.

coug66

Bocatrip, did you ever try the MAFs from Vietnam?
You are now going to buy one from the dealer for $130 or ? Pay $150 for diagnosis and could there be a possibility that the cheap $22 MAF might have solved the problem?

I could have sent you one of mine and had you run it for a while and then if it didn't fix it send it back. if it ran well send me $22.

If your goal is to fix the car, testing it with a cheap MAF seems like a great way to check if its a functionality problem with your old MAF?

Its one thing to check where a part is made but what seems more important is do these parts work and function like the vendors are selling them?

Bocatrip

Thanks Coug for the imput. It seems that Vietnam is indeed the location for MAF manufacturing for Denso. I also went to the Lexus dealership to see their $180 retail MAF for our car, and it did not have a box but just some plastic bubble wrap around it with the part number and the Toyota name. There was no mention of where it was produced on the label. The Toyota part is "Genuine" and cost the most because it is the manufacturer of the car. The Denso part is OEM and should be significantly less ($65-$70) because Denso makes the part for Toyota and the customer is not paying to have the Manufacturer's name on the product (Toyota/Lexus). I prefer to buy from the OEM rather than any product from China as they should be going by specific guidelines in their production. I just have always gone OEM with almost everything for my car. Yes the cheap $20 MAF might work and thank you Coug for your offer. It's a very nice gesture and it is much appreciated. I will be buying the Denso MAF most likely from RockAuto. For the $70 investment, I'm ok and will know regardless, that the part is new and as close to the original as possible.

coug66

Bocatrip,

Just a quick thought, have you checked the fuel pressure? If the pump was plugged or blocked and had low fuel pressure could that cause a lean fuel trim?

Simple test regarding fuel pressure and easy replacement of a fuel filter or pump.

http://www.import-car.com/step-step-...p-replacement/

Spark, fuel, air and compression. Fuel supply should be verified.

StanVanDam

I'm not taking any risk (getting all my money back + keeping the MAF they sent), so there is no risk to reduce. I am just doing a public service regarding the lying and misrepresentation of these MAF sensors. eBay has clear policies on counterfeit goods, keyword spamming, search manipulation, misleading titles, and misusing brand names, and these sellers are violating these policies.

In progressive societies such as in the US and Canada, it isn't acceptable to conduct and condone such fraud. I don't appreciate sellers lying about their products, and neither should you. These sellers are wasting other people's time and money with false advertising, and in turn, I'm wasting their time and money by calling them out on it.

If these sellers don't know that something is truly Genuine OEM Denso Toyota, then they shouldn't list it as such. If they don't know what the meaning of "genuine" means, then they shouldn't be using the word. If they don't know that the part is manufactured by Denso or Toyota, then they shouldn't select Denso or Toyota as the manufacturer of the item. There are many other manufacturers to select from, including "unspecified". They could easily list their products accurately, but they choose not to do so.

I have no problem with sellers listing non-OEM MAF sensors without lying about the details. I am sure these non-OEM MAF sensors would work just fine, but maybe won't last as long as OEM. If people want to knowingly buy a non-OEM sensor, go right ahead. I just have an issue with the false and fraudulent product advertising.

These sellers are trying to scam buyers all over the world. It only takes me a few seconds to browse the listing, confirm it says "brand new unopened genuine Denso Toyota" in the official description fields, save a screenshot of it, click Buy Now, and then upon receiving an item not as described, click the Request Refund button and all of my money is back in my account within 48 hours.

If anyone wants to buy used OEM or unused non-OEM MAF sensors, I have a few available

If anyone manages to obtain a new OEM sensor at a good price, this would be the thread to tell us where you got it from. Easiest way to tell if it is OEM is if you know for sure your existing MAF is OEM (either installed from factory or you have a new one directly from a Toyota/Lexus dealership to look at), then compare the markings on the top - they should be identical in every way. Genuine OEM has 5 rows of raised text just like the middle MAF in coug66's picture above, and I can confirm the MAF installed at the factory in my 2002 LS430 looks like that.

Bocatrip

Easiest way to tell if it is OEM is if you know for sure your existing MAF is OEM (either installed from factory or you have a new one directly from a Toyota/Lexus dealership to look at), then compare the markings on the top - they should be identical in every way. Genuine OEM has 5 rows of raised text just like the middle MAF in coug66's picture above, and I can confirm the MAF installed at the factory in my 2002 LS430 looks like that.

Actually Stan Van Dam......I've contacted and asked vendors with all the original 5 rows of raised text on their $20+ MAFs listed on ebay only to find out these items were made in China! Once again counterfeiting is alive and well on ebay. Another secure method on getting the right product is to buy from a Toyota/Lexus dealer on ebay or Amazon and/or not buy from a 3rd party vendor. Either buy directly from Amazon (not a 3rd party vendor listed with amazon) or a reputable business like RockAuto etc.