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04-06 Sealed Transmission fluid change interval? (The Mother thread)

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04-06 Sealed Transmission fluid change interval? (The Mother thread)

Old 09-06-17, 08:46 AM
  #361  
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Thanks Todd, nothing like real world info.....I wonder then, say I drove 90 min. to my indie, and he got ready to do a drain/fill after my car sat for 15 min....keep in mind he stated how critical the temp is....logically, it would NOT be "too" hot, right? Because he was the one who explained how the overflow plug worked etc.

When I watched that special Toyota tool and how it's a straw that can vary its length based on the temp, I really thought wow, if only the vehicles had dipsticks, none of this would be necessary....then again I thought this Toyota guy said it's better if customers leave their cars overnight (sigh)
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Old 09-06-17, 04:21 PM
  #362  
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Originally Posted by Johnhav430 View Post
Thanks Todd, nothing like real world info.....I wonder then, say I drove 90 min. to my indie, and he got ready to do a drain/fill after my car sat for 15 min....keep in mind he stated how critical the temp is....logically, it would NOT be "too" hot, right?
yeah it would be too hot. So I drove home today, 30 minute drive, outside temp 63 degrees, starting fluid temp of 99 degrees, fluid temp reached 164 degrees by journey end. I thought it would surely begin to cool off after getting home and shutting the engine off and waiting a bit. Not the case though, after 30 minutes the fluid temp had actually gone up to 172 degrees. You can speculate as to why this is so but the net is that it would therefore take several hours of cool off time before fluid could be accurately checked, AFTER a long drive. To be more specific, if you're driving more than 10 minutes or so to your mechanic and expecting to get an accurate fluid reading sooner than several hours of cool off time....it ain't going to happen. maybe if you're in the middle of winter in north dakota...maybe
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Old 09-06-17, 05:47 PM
  #363  
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Originally Posted by toddmorr View Post
yeah it would be too hot. So I drove home today, 30 minute drive, outside temp 63 degrees, starting fluid temp of 99 degrees, fluid temp reached 164 degrees by journey end. I thought it would surely begin to cool off after getting home and shutting the engine off and waiting a bit. Not the case though, after 30 minutes the fluid temp had actually gone up to 172 degrees. You can speculate as to why this is so but the net is that it would therefore take several hours of cool off time before fluid could be accurately checked, AFTER a long drive. To be more specific, if you're driving more than 10 minutes or so to your mechanic and expecting to get an accurate fluid reading sooner than several hours of cool off time....it ain't going to happen. maybe if you're in the middle of winter in north dakota...maybe

My wife's coolant is that way, when you shut the vehicle off, the temp was correct. If you switch the ignition back on without starting, the gauge rises.

How about this....you have a vehicle driven for 90'minutes. If the check plug is opened, too much fluid will come out, and at proper temp, it is low. But you have no reason to check at this time. You drain hot fluid, replace with cold. Potential overfill.

What will the temp reach at this point? If it is below operating, it can be heated to proper temp. My indie was describing after refilling, pumping new, and letting it overflow, until temp was right, at which point it overflows until correct. It would seem some WS is wasted this way. Otherwise no shops could service vehicles unless left overnight...
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Old 09-07-17, 06:37 AM
  #364  
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Originally Posted by Johnhav430 View Post
My indie was describing after refilling, pumping new, and letting it overflow, until temp was right, at which point it overflows until correct. It would seem some WS is wasted this way. Otherwise no shops could service vehicles unless left overnight...
yes this should work. In reality I wonder how many techs really go to the trouble of doing the drain/fill accurately. Or doing the flush/refil process accurately either, for that matter.
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Old 09-07-17, 06:43 AM
  #365  
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Originally Posted by toddmorr View Post
yes this should work. In reality I wonder how many techs really go to the trouble of doing the drain/fill accurately. Or doing the flush/refil process accurately either, for that matter.
Next time I'll ask him more specifically...I know that when he decided to do a 2nd drain and fill on one visit, he was taking advantage of the fact that he dropped the car anyway and drove it for about a mile, looking for a clunk sound from the front end (he thinks it's brake pads shifting and demonstrated by tapping the pad lightly and creating the same noise, and stating that the shims are missing), which in turn saved me the labor of the drain/fill (they get $86 per time, so he only charged me for 2 more quarts of WS).

I think my guy has integrity as he explained how the check plug works, stated the temp is important, and said I might have a hard time simultaneously pumping in and letting it overflow and checking the temp all at the same time, but by no means is it impossible to do at home...then he said you have the challenge of keeping the vehicle level, which may require 4 jack stands....not to mention when I asked should I come back for drain and fill #4? He said no, just wait a year and we'll do another one....

p.s. after only one drain/fill at 83k or so, the fluid was still black on the 2nd drain/fill....

again imagine if the vehicle had a dipstick, how a lot of factors are no longer important and it is easier to accomplish...
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Old 11-15-17, 08:00 AM
  #366  
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hi, does anyone happen to know a specific person at a specific lexus dealership in atlanta (or even an indy shop that has techstream) that would properly perform this ATF filling procedure? i have the exact cold symptoms on this trans and i can't confidently get anyone to perform the service for me. i've attempted to get it done at my dealership but the morons keep telling me the level is fine and there's just no way it is. i'm pretty sure they are just removing the drain plug and seeing if some trickles out, so annoying.

Last edited by scamsel; 11-15-17 at 08:04 AM.
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Old 11-15-17, 08:26 AM
  #367  
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Originally Posted by scamsel View Post
hi, does anyone happen to know a specific person at a specific lexus dealership in atlanta (or even an indy shop that has techstream) that would properly perform this ATF filling procedure? i have the exact cold symptoms on this trans and i can't confidently get anyone to perform the service for me. i've attempted to get it done at my dealership but the morons keep telling me the level is fine and there's just no way it is. i'm pretty sure they are just removing the drain plug and seeing if some trickles out, so annoying.
Personally, I have always had good luck with Yelp (not just auto or home or restaurants, in general). I hear they have some secret algorithm that keeps the reviews valid....

So this is what they have for your area....I'd call these places and see what they say. On the phone call ask if they install customer parts, and if they do the tranny, can you see your car on the lift and have the tech show/explain the process....can you see the fluid which is drained out. imho an indie worth their salt has no issue explaining and showing you...this is their advantage over a dealership....good luck.

https://www.yelp.com/search?find_desc=Japanese+Auto+Repair&find_loc=Atlanta%2C+GA

A guy stated he provided brake parts for his IS-F to this shop

https://www.yelp.com/biz/apna-garage...se+Auto+Repair

https://www.yelp.com/biz/japanese-au...se+Auto+Repair
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Old 11-26-18, 08:56 AM
  #368  
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looking to get this done in NYC area, does anyone know a shop well aware how to get this done?
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Old 11-27-18, 08:18 AM
  #369  
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Originally Posted by scamsel View Post
hi, does anyone happen to know a specific person at a specific lexus dealership in atlanta (or even an indy shop that has techstream) that would properly perform this ATF filling procedure? i have the exact cold symptoms on this trans and i can't confidently get anyone to perform the service for me. i've attempted to get it done at my dealership but the morons keep telling me the level is fine and there's just no way it is. i'm pretty sure they are just removing the drain plug and seeing if some trickles out, so annoying.
TechStream isn't necessary. Follow the procedure under #5b. You just need a short piece of wire to jump between CG(4) and TC(13). If you have jack stands and hand tools (with a long hose/funnel to fill the transmission) this will take an hour for any DIY. I had my indie (who passed away) do the first flush/fill and he insisted the vehicle sit overnight. I did the same thing, once the vehicle idles after you set up the jumper wire you wait for it to indicate that the transmission has reached temperature. This took under ten minutes with temps in the 70's. I have a friend in the Atlanta area that runs a automotive service business (specialty GM FWD transaxle) in case you can't find a Lexus specialist. I really don't see that you need a specialist if a tech can follow directions. Can you complete the procedure yourself or with assistance from a friend(s)?
Attached Files
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ATF Adjustment.pdf (77.5 KB, 28 views)
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Old 11-27-18, 12:39 PM
  #370  
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I wonder what is the difference in volume between room temp and whatever the proper temperature is. I think if we know the difference, there is no need to wait until the transmission reach the proper temperature. I am thinking that for ~2 qt of fluid the difference in volume is probably not that much.

I maybe over simplifying this, but just thinking out loud. I need to do this myself, but just have not had a chance.
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Old 11-27-18, 01:06 PM
  #371  
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Originally Posted by BCT View Post
I wonder what is the difference in volume between room temp and whatever the proper temperature is. I think if we know the difference, there is no need to wait until the transmission reach the proper temperature. I am thinking that for ~2 qt of fluid the difference in volume is probably not that much.

I maybe over simplifying this, but just thinking out loud. I need to do this myself, but just have not had a chance.
If the change in volume was negligible the fluid level wouldn't be so important. It is important...
Take a look at this thread- https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...-04-ls430.html
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Old 11-27-18, 02:16 PM
  #372  
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Originally Posted by bradland View Post
If the change in volume was negligible the fluid level wouldn't be so important. It is important...
Take a look at this thread- https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...-04-ls430.html
Thank you for the link @bardland and @rkw77080 for the experiment. Here is my thinking, and please correct me if I am mistaken in my calculation below.

Looking at that experiment, it goes from 80F to 150F, and we can see the fluid expand from 120ml to ~125ml. So we are looking at ~5% expansion for 70F increase in temperature. The ideal temp is 115F-130F, which is 35-50F from 80F. Lets say for argument sake, 3-4% fluid expansion assuming the expansion rate is linear.

So we are looking at 3-4% of 3.2 qts (drain and refill per repair manual). I seems to recall that most folks get 2.5 qts from drain and refill.

If we are using 3.2 qts x 4% = 0.128 qts. Kinda hard to believe that in a tranny with 11.5 qts total capacity, 0.128 qts makes a different. Maybe it does matter?

I do agree that it does make a significant difference when one do a drain and refill when the tranny is hot, which I am sure it reach higher than 150F.

Appreciate you are reading my rambling here
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Old 11-27-18, 06:59 PM
  #373  
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i'm getting this done at my Indie tomorrow. I have 3 litres of WS and i have the "instructions" printed out for him. Not sure what he will do about my air suspension if he tries to lift the car while running, but i will warn him of this before he starts. Oil change and tranny drain and fill to be done. Will post results if anything out of the ordinary happens. Last drain and fill looks to be about 100000kms ago.
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Old 11-28-18, 02:16 PM
  #374  
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just got the car back from my competent indie and he said that the tranny fluid was black. Suggests i come back in about 5000km - 10000 km and have it drained and filled again. Service records indicate that transmission fluid was done at 194000 kms and now has 305000. Find it funny that it is now black, but he's willing to do a few changes for me to get it back to red within the next few months. Charged me $85 total + tax for oil change and drain and fill. i supplied 3 litres of WS and he basically only used what he needed. IT seems to shift a bit smoother as well.

Toyota wanted $65 for the oil change and $155 for the drain and fill. Good thing i have a great mechanic to do this for me in the winter months.

Last edited by caddylover; 11-28-18 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 11-28-18, 07:53 PM
  #375  
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i need a shop like this in NYC
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