Buying experiences for your LS430 New/Used/Good/Bad?
05-23-09, 05:35 AM
#61
buying a lexus
Hi Folks..this is my first post on here and I will relate my experience buying my 2003 ls 430 nav bought in sept 08
Found it on e bay at tampa bay lexus...traded in my beloved 98 cobra..got 7 grand for the cobra and they wanted 21787 for the LS..good deal. Got to the dealership and the car was all prepped and ready to go. Went around and check all the "new" tires they had put on. Got back to the saleman and told him I would not be taking the car because the tires were made in the year 2000. He wasnt very happy. After negotiations with sales manager they mounted new Michelins on the car. The also charged me $200. The steering was also off center which they fixed. By the way this was a CPO car. It took me 6 hours to get out of the dealership. There was also 5 dents on the car which they didnt see.
I callled Lexus in Ca. and related the story and they sent me a service check for $250.
Anyway got the car home and found out the right lower passenger front door panel was loose, the rear speaker was blown out and the passenger front seat belt was backwards. Luckily I then starting using my local dealer "Scanlon Lexus of Fort Myers" and they are the best.
By the way every tire is stamp dated right after the DOT info. If your tires are over 6 years old be careful esp. in hot climates. You can Google tire manufacture dates for further info.
Great site looking for great info. Also just bought the wife an 06 Es 330 from Scanlon...Great dealership.
Found it on e bay at tampa bay lexus...traded in my beloved 98 cobra..got 7 grand for the cobra and they wanted 21787 for the LS..good deal. Got to the dealership and the car was all prepped and ready to go. Went around and check all the "new" tires they had put on. Got back to the saleman and told him I would not be taking the car because the tires were made in the year 2000. He wasnt very happy. After negotiations with sales manager they mounted new Michelins on the car. The also charged me $200. The steering was also off center which they fixed. By the way this was a CPO car. It took me 6 hours to get out of the dealership. There was also 5 dents on the car which they didnt see.
I callled Lexus in Ca. and related the story and they sent me a service check for $250.
Anyway got the car home and found out the right lower passenger front door panel was loose, the rear speaker was blown out and the passenger front seat belt was backwards. Luckily I then starting using my local dealer "Scanlon Lexus of Fort Myers" and they are the best.
By the way every tire is stamp dated right after the DOT info. If your tires are over 6 years old be careful esp. in hot climates. You can Google tire manufacture dates for further info.
Great site looking for great info. Also just bought the wife an 06 Es 330 from Scanlon...Great dealership.
05-23-09, 05:45 AM
#62
Welcome!
Re: CPO, the "inspect and repair" component of the program is somewhat of a joke at many delaerships (and I'd venture to say MOST dealerships). The cars do in fact carry the extended warranty and they WILL fix issues that you identify upon your inspection or that happen during the warranty period, but the "inspection" process during the CPO certification process is very half-assed from what I've personally seen at multiple dealerships on multiple vehicles. You can easily find things on most CPO cars that obviously indicate that the car was NOT closely inspected by anyone with functioning ears and eyeballs and a decent understanding of cars.
Re: CPO, the "inspect and repair" component of the program is somewhat of a joke at many delaerships (and I'd venture to say MOST dealerships). The cars do in fact carry the extended warranty and they WILL fix issues that you identify upon your inspection or that happen during the warranty period, but the "inspection" process during the CPO certification process is very half-assed from what I've personally seen at multiple dealerships on multiple vehicles. You can easily find things on most CPO cars that obviously indicate that the car was NOT closely inspected by anyone with functioning ears and eyeballs and a decent understanding of cars.
Last edited by I6turbo; 05-23-09 at 05:55 AM.
05-23-09, 07:49 PM
#63
Lexus Champion
Welcome!
Re: CPO, the "inspect and repair" component of the program is somewhat of a joke at many delaerships (and I'd venture to say MOST dealerships). The cars do in fact carry the extended warranty and they WILL fix issues that you identify upon your inspection or that happen during the warranty period, but the "inspection" process during the CPO certification process is very half-assed from what I've personally seen at multiple dealerships on multiple vehicles. You can easily find things on most CPO cars that obviously indicate that the car was NOT closely inspected by anyone with functioning ears and eyeballs and a decent understanding of cars.
Re: CPO, the "inspect and repair" component of the program is somewhat of a joke at many delaerships (and I'd venture to say MOST dealerships). The cars do in fact carry the extended warranty and they WILL fix issues that you identify upon your inspection or that happen during the warranty period, but the "inspection" process during the CPO certification process is very half-assed from what I've personally seen at multiple dealerships on multiple vehicles. You can easily find things on most CPO cars that obviously indicate that the car was NOT closely inspected by anyone with functioning ears and eyeballs and a decent understanding of cars.
05-23-09, 11:27 PM
#64
CL Shopping and Pricing
I have been lurking for about a month, and thanks to all for the very helpful information I have found here. I wanted to share what is happening in my search for an 04-06 CL somewhere in the eastern US. I have not found very many of them. I have been looking on Autotrader, cars.com, CarMax, ebay, and craigslist. Let me know if I am missing any other good sources.
05 CLs seem to be priced around 29,900 with mileage from 35 to 50k. I am hoping those prices may be soft, and it would be great to find something in the $26-27k range. Does that sound like it would be in the ballpark?
I made an offer for $27k to a Lexus dealer for one, and it was rejected with a no negotiate reply. They were asking around $29,800 with CPO, and $28,600 without it. So that price was not soft, it seems.
05 CLs seem to be priced around 29,900 with mileage from 35 to 50k. I am hoping those prices may be soft, and it would be great to find something in the $26-27k range. Does that sound like it would be in the ballpark?
I made an offer for $27k to a Lexus dealer for one, and it was rejected with a no negotiate reply. They were asking around $29,800 with CPO, and $28,600 without it. So that price was not soft, it seems.
05-25-09, 10:56 AM
#68
Yes, I found that CPO in effect came at very little upcharge. Plus, I think it is reasonable to pay a LITTLE more to a Lexus dealer even if you don't have a warranty per se, because generally speaking they will take care of you within reason. I think they'd probably fix anything that you could find within 30 days, and perhaps even longer if something went wrong. To me, there's some value in knowing that you could get the car, check it out for a couple of weeks, then get any issues corrected.
Anyway, IMO, bottom line is that if you find a car you like at a Lexus dealer, just make him the offer you think is fair based upon what you see in the market. IME, there's a decent chance that you might end up getting the car.
Anyway, IMO, bottom line is that if you find a car you like at a Lexus dealer, just make him the offer you think is fair based upon what you see in the market. IME, there's a decent chance that you might end up getting the car.
Personally, I judge a car from it's condition and mileage, not where it came from. I don't care if it is from the back alley in the ghetto or a Lexus dealer in Beverly Hills. Because you never know, the guy in the ghetto might be honest and the Beverly Hills guys could be a scum.
05-29-09, 09:39 AM
#69
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I too had bad experiences with CPO. Lexus claimed they "meticulously" inspected and certified the vehicle. Yet a simple cursorly look of my 2006 CPO LS430 I found several easy to spot flaws. I think the only thing the CPO gives you is the mechanical warranty and additional profits for Lexus.
I had a terrible experience at my Lexus dealer. Overall my experience was much worse than when I was buying my Toyota.
Also, I suspect that the original Lexus team has mostly retired and a new generation has taken over, that's why we are starting to see a drop in service, a drop in quality and a shift in engineering philosophy (LS460 is trying to be a BMW750, not an evolution of the LS430).
Keep this up and I think the competition will catch-up, I seriously considered a Genesis and frankly couldn't tell too much difference but wanted to wait another year or two before the verdict is out.
I had a terrible experience at my Lexus dealer. Overall my experience was much worse than when I was buying my Toyota.
Also, I suspect that the original Lexus team has mostly retired and a new generation has taken over, that's why we are starting to see a drop in service, a drop in quality and a shift in engineering philosophy (LS460 is trying to be a BMW750, not an evolution of the LS430).
Keep this up and I think the competition will catch-up, I seriously considered a Genesis and frankly couldn't tell too much difference but wanted to wait another year or two before the verdict is out.
05-29-09, 10:52 AM
#70
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I have been lurking for about a month, and thanks to all for the very helpful information I have found here. I wanted to share what is happening in my search for an 04-06 CL somewhere in the eastern US. I have not found very many of them. I have been looking on Autotrader, cars.com, CarMax, ebay, and craigslist. Let me know if I am missing any other good sources.
05 CLs seem to be priced around 29,900 with mileage from 35 to 50k. I am hoping those prices may be soft, and it would be great to find something in the $26-27k range. Does that sound like it would be in the ballpark?
I made an offer for $27k to a Lexus dealer for one, and it was rejected with a no negotiate reply. They were asking around $29,800 with CPO, and $28,600 without it. So that price was not soft, it seems.
05 CLs seem to be priced around 29,900 with mileage from 35 to 50k. I am hoping those prices may be soft, and it would be great to find something in the $26-27k range. Does that sound like it would be in the ballpark?
I made an offer for $27k to a Lexus dealer for one, and it was rejected with a no negotiate reply. They were asking around $29,800 with CPO, and $28,600 without it. So that price was not soft, it seems.
05-29-09, 11:45 AM
#71
The CPO does cost the dealer some money (I've heard it's about $1500 for the warranty plus whatever extra stuff they have to do to the car to qualify it, but not certain that's accurate) and of course that'll have to be paid for by the buyer in the end, but Lexus dealers have the advantage of having traded for several of the used cars they have to sell, and often they get them for less than the auction price when they take them in on trade. People like us will do their homework and drive a hard bargain on trading, but I've spoken to lots of people who just kind of go in and trade based upon what the dealer offers him, and I'm sure they get reamed pretty good. So, the dealer has room to move on those cars if he need to.
I've only traded in a car one time, but one benefit of trading in states that charge sales tax on cars is that you don't pay tax on the trade value of the car you're trading in. That's $1750 on a $25K car here where I live, so you'd have to sell that same car privately for $26,750 just to break even instead of trading it in for $25K.
I've only traded in a car one time, but one benefit of trading in states that charge sales tax on cars is that you don't pay tax on the trade value of the car you're trading in. That's $1750 on a $25K car here where I live, so you'd have to sell that same car privately for $26,750 just to break even instead of trading it in for $25K.
05-29-09, 12:21 PM
#72
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The CPO does cost the dealer some money (I've heard it's about $1500 for the warranty plus whatever extra stuff they have to do to the car to qualify it, but not certain that's accurate) and of course that'll have to be paid for by the buyer in the end, but Lexus dealers have the advantage of having traded for several of the used cars they have to sell, and often they get them for less than the auction price when they take them in on trade. People like us will do their homework and drive a hard bargain on trading, but I've spoken to lots of people who just kind of go in and trade based upon what the dealer offers him, and I'm sure they get reamed pretty good. So, the dealer has room to move on those cars if he need to.
I've only traded in a car one time, but one benefit of trading in states that charge sales tax on cars is that you don't pay tax on the trade value of the car you're trading in. That's $1750 on a $25K car here where I live, so you'd have to sell that same car privately for $26,750 just to break even instead of trading it in for $25K.
I've only traded in a car one time, but one benefit of trading in states that charge sales tax on cars is that you don't pay tax on the trade value of the car you're trading in. That's $1750 on a $25K car here where I live, so you'd have to sell that same car privately for $26,750 just to break even instead of trading it in for $25K.
05-29-09, 01:01 PM
#73
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I bought my first Lexus when I was 21 from a small mom and pop. The local Lexus dealerships wouldn't even deal with me. Showed up ready to buy an RX300 at Lexus of Cherry Hill in NJ - ending up standing outside with my printouts of their inventory for 30 minutes. Not a single salesperson would come outside and talk to me. That same day I called Wilkie Lexus and made an appointment with Charlie Blunt to look at their RX's thinking that maybe appointments were standard procedure for buying a Lexus. I showed up, announced who I was, and told them I had an appointment with Charlie. They sent someone into Charlie's empty office and told him I had spoken with him earlier in the day regarding their inventory of RXs. Charlie peered out of his office as I stood on the sales floor and I kid you not, he didn't move out of his chair for 20 minutes. As he got up to come greet me I walked back out to the parking lot and left.
That was 6 years ago. In that time we've added two additional Lexus's to the fleet, one of which is an LS430. Both cars were bought at non-Lexus dealers as a direct result of my earlier experiences with the local Lexus dealers.
When we bought the LS we were treated like royalty from the time we walked in to the time we drove the car off the lot. As we showed up to complete the transaction, their sales people made it seem like we were buying a Rolls Royce. By the time we headed out the door to drive the car home, the other customers were looking at us as though we were famous or something.
Last month I had my GX serviced under warranty at Lexus of Chester Springs. When we went to pick it up my wife and I decided check out the showroom. Granted, we weren't particularly interested in buying anything at that instant, but we found an 07 LS460 that we were interested in. I would've liked someone to at least unlock the thing for me. Same story as before. We were the only customers on the whole floor at around dinner time on a Tuesday and not a single sales person would come over and talk to us. 15 minutes of walking around and peering into the $57,000 car and we left.
I guess they don't understand that just because im not 40 doesn't mean I can't afford their cars. Unfortunately for them, this attitude has cost them a little over $100,000 in sales from me over the last 6 years and probably another couple thousand in service. I understand the concept of walking up to a salesperson and asking them questions - but when I come to your place of business looking to spend tens of thousands of dollars, you come to me and ASK ME what it will take to make it happen. Not the other way around.
That was 6 years ago. In that time we've added two additional Lexus's to the fleet, one of which is an LS430. Both cars were bought at non-Lexus dealers as a direct result of my earlier experiences with the local Lexus dealers.
When we bought the LS we were treated like royalty from the time we walked in to the time we drove the car off the lot. As we showed up to complete the transaction, their sales people made it seem like we were buying a Rolls Royce. By the time we headed out the door to drive the car home, the other customers were looking at us as though we were famous or something.
Last month I had my GX serviced under warranty at Lexus of Chester Springs. When we went to pick it up my wife and I decided check out the showroom. Granted, we weren't particularly interested in buying anything at that instant, but we found an 07 LS460 that we were interested in. I would've liked someone to at least unlock the thing for me. Same story as before. We were the only customers on the whole floor at around dinner time on a Tuesday and not a single sales person would come over and talk to us. 15 minutes of walking around and peering into the $57,000 car and we left.
I guess they don't understand that just because im not 40 doesn't mean I can't afford their cars. Unfortunately for them, this attitude has cost them a little over $100,000 in sales from me over the last 6 years and probably another couple thousand in service. I understand the concept of walking up to a salesperson and asking them questions - but when I come to your place of business looking to spend tens of thousands of dollars, you come to me and ASK ME what it will take to make it happen. Not the other way around.
Last edited by mwbuck; 05-29-09 at 02:06 PM.
05-29-09, 01:36 PM
#74
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I bought my first Lexus when I was 21 from a small mom and pop. The local Lexus dealerships wouldn't even deal with me. Showed up ready to buy an RX300 at Lexus of Cherry Hill in NJ - ending up standing outside with my printouts of their inventory for 30 minutes. Not a single salesperson would come outside and talk to me. That same day I called Wilkie Lexus and made an appointment with Charlie Blunt to look at their RX's thinking that maybe appointments were standard procedure for buying a Lexus. I showed up, announced who I was, and told them I had an appointment with Charlie. They sent someone into Charlie's empty office and told him I had spoken with him earlier in the day regarding their inventory of RXs. Charlie peered out of his office as I stood on the sales floor and I kid you not, he didn't move out of his chair for 20 minutes. As he got up I walked back out to the parking lot and left.
That was 6 years ago. In that time we've added two additional Lexus's to the fleet, one of which is an LS430. Both cars were bought at non-Lexus dealers as a direct result of my earlier experiences with the local Lexus dealers.
When we bought the LS we were treated like royalty from the time we walked in to the time we drove the car off the lot. As we showed up to complete the transaction their sales people made it seem like we were buying a Rolls Royce. By the time we headed out the door to drive the car home the other customers were looking at us as though we were famous or something.
Last month I had my GX serviced under warranty at Lexus of Chester Springs. When we went to pick it up my wife and I decided check out the show room. Granted, we werent particularly interested in buying anything at that instant, but we found an 07 LS460 that we were interested in. I would've like someone to at least unlock the thing for me. Same story as before. We were the only customers on the whole floor at around dinner time on a Tuesday and not a single sales person would come over and talk to us. 15 minutes of walking around the $57,000 car and we left.
I guess they don't understand that just because im not 40 doesn't mean I can't afford their cars. Because of this attitude, they've lost just over $100,000 in sales from me over the last 6 years.
That was 6 years ago. In that time we've added two additional Lexus's to the fleet, one of which is an LS430. Both cars were bought at non-Lexus dealers as a direct result of my earlier experiences with the local Lexus dealers.
When we bought the LS we were treated like royalty from the time we walked in to the time we drove the car off the lot. As we showed up to complete the transaction their sales people made it seem like we were buying a Rolls Royce. By the time we headed out the door to drive the car home the other customers were looking at us as though we were famous or something.
Last month I had my GX serviced under warranty at Lexus of Chester Springs. When we went to pick it up my wife and I decided check out the show room. Granted, we werent particularly interested in buying anything at that instant, but we found an 07 LS460 that we were interested in. I would've like someone to at least unlock the thing for me. Same story as before. We were the only customers on the whole floor at around dinner time on a Tuesday and not a single sales person would come over and talk to us. 15 minutes of walking around the $57,000 car and we left.
I guess they don't understand that just because im not 40 doesn't mean I can't afford their cars. Because of this attitude, they've lost just over $100,000 in sales from me over the last 6 years.
Out of all the posts to this thread no one has offered a new car buying experience. I wonder if it must feel like what you got from the mom and pop store? Maybe you received better?
05-29-09, 11:29 PM
#75
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Before I purchased the CPO LS430, I was in to purchase a brand new GX470 or the 400H. The salesperson wouldn't even invite me in the showroom and was extremely reluctant to let me test drive, after the test drive, he walked back into the showroom and not even bother to give me his business card nor invite me in for some water (it was hot that afternoon). I decided I didn't need to lose 50% of the value of the car in a 3-yr lease (YES, if you look at all the CPO 460s out there, Lexus does not hold its value better than any other car, you still lose 20% per year for the first 3 years of the lease).
So the rumors are true, the dealers are just getting much worse.
I went to 3 Lexus dealers and they are all pretty much the same in my area.
So the rumors are true, the dealers are just getting much worse.
I went to 3 Lexus dealers and they are all pretty much the same in my area.