TF109B

You seem to know nothing about what Lexus' intent is. It was said her boyfriend bought it. So what if Paris Hilton owns one? People aren't going to be turned off it because she has an LFA. That's just ludicrous. The brand is trying to move in a sporty direction, with the F parts, the F cars, the LFA in their recent commercials, etc. We'll see in the future the products that will benefit from the sporty side of Lexus. The new 2011 IS-F is faster around the track than a Mustang in C&D's lightning lap. That's pretty decent seeing as how Ford benchmarked the M3 with their new stang.

Gojirra99

What REAL car enthusiasts who really know how to appreciate the engineering, driving dynamics & performance of the exotic cars will have their image of the LFA tarnished just because Paris Hilton drives it anyway LOL ??

If Lexus want to impress the REAL car enthusiasts, then I don't think they worry about Paris Hilton at all. Now there are tons of pretend car enthusiasts on the internet who just like to yap about this and that but don't really know as much about cars as they think.

There are also a percentage of exotic car owners who are posers who buy them just because they can afford them, they think it's cool to own them just as a status symbol to show off too, so are those the type that Lexus should worry about that MIGHT get turned off by a car just because Paris Hilton drives it ?

Even if Lexus somehow have an agreement with Paris & her boyfriend to show off the car in her show, it's just more exposure and publicity for the brand as a whole, to show the world what they are capable of doing, that they have made a legitmate supercar, not to try to sell the LFA.

If it's the boy friend who bought it, Lexus has no control of who the owner gives it to, he can carry the 2-year lease but can let anybody drive it all the time.

TommyJames

You guys say all this stuff then whine when the LFA and others Lexus aren't given the respect these cars deserve. If branding image management didn't matter companies wouldn't spend hundreds of millions working so hard to shape their image. Before you decide who is and isn't "real" I suggest you participate more in exotic events and see just who actually shows up. I think you'd be surprised if this is what you really believe.

I've read pages and pages of defensive comments about the LFA and how it deserves a lot of respect yet this same group constantly puts down those who choose to own something else and call them either "posers" or not "real" car guys. How does that help win the LFA argument?

It is incredibly expensive to turn a brand image once it's cemented in consumer's mind. It's why you could have the best performing car, regardless of brand, but if it doesn't fit the image of the consumer, they will still reject the brand and not give it a chance. Sound familiar?

I can't say what I know because I'm under NDA regarding a specific company's automotive branding efforts, but to say this stuff doesn't matter with "real" car guys is badly mistaken and the research has proven it again and again.

Every time you see an automotive commercial, notice that they aren't just delivering the face message you see in the ad, they are also telling you where they think they need to take the brand, either because they are fighting a negative image or because they think it's what they most need to reinforce with consumers. Ford pitches reliability against Toyota because this is where they know they have to make the argument. Knowing this, what message is Paris (who cares if it was her boyfriend who supposedly wrote a check) conveying? Simple question with out the personal attacks, do you think it helps or hurts the brand?

Seriously, if some of you were so confident in LFA standing on its own, there wouldn't be half the posts defending it, right? Everyone would understand it without the arguments about its value.

Lexus does some brilliant commercials, some of the best in the industry. They know who they are and they have built a solid reputation in the luxury market. I argue that they keep getting it wrong on the exotic side where they mistakenly assume it's one in the same. However, that being said, lets assume they are down to 25 remaining cars. They achieved this completely outside of the existing mainstream exotic market and that alone is remarkable. It means they actually grew the pie without taking sales away from others.

Before you all dive on that last statement, I need to explain something. Washington state, along with many other states have a high sales tax on cars. That tax is often allowed to be deducted from the trade in, with the consumer paying the difference. This means that if someone is new to exotics in Washington state, and not trading in anything of high value, they pay full freight of about 10%. That's about another $ 38-46k on top of the LFA's sticker. If you're trading in your car, you only pay the difference. This is huge incentive to get rid of your exotic and you have a year to use the credit. So if you have an 08 LP640, you may only pay about $15-20k in sales tax. (This is why you see so many exotics and RVs licensed in Montana where there is no tax.)

Because so many turn over their cars to transfer the tax credit at the highest price, few want to simply trade them in because the wholesale versus street price difference can be huge and worth the time to sell on their own and simply pay a broker fee for title transfer. This is also why you see so many consignment cars. If sales were coming out of the existing exotic market, you'd see those exotics on the market now and people would be stating publicly why they are selling as they always want to have a positive reason for selling- like trading up versus saying they are out of money or something else. I'm on more than a dozen mailing lists with exotics and there has been no material change in inventories to reflect any displacement. There has been some with the F458 and a little with the McLAren, but that's about it.

Therefore, assuming Lexus is down to 25 cars, this means they did it with virtually no impact on the existing market, which means they grew the pie and that's actually a very good thing.

MR_F1

Would you have cared?

TommyJames

Paris does extremely well marketing women's brands. She would definitely strengthen women's impressions of the LS and I think this is important to the brand. She does it with just about every other brand.

I never got the whole Paris Hilton thing until I was having a lunch meeting in LA and was sitting outside. As I pulled up, there was lots and lots of photographers already standing around. It was a little unusual on that day. About twenty minutes later, she shows up (driven in a Suburban) gets out, walks into the restaurant for about twenty minutes. Didn't eat or do anything but go in, wait, and come out. The camera went nuts. She got back in the SUV and left and so did all the other photographers. I realized that the whole thing was staged, it was all they needed for the magazines and tabloids for the day. What she was wearing mattered and I'm guessing it was just her doing her thing; people see her in that dress, with that purse, etc., and they sell thousands. When it comes to daily drives, women often make the decision in the household.

Gojirra99

Respect from whom ? From those who would think less of the car JUST BECAUSE Paris Hilton drives it LOL, I can't speak for others, but I sure don't need or want or care for the respect from those people. And why are you so defensive about your exotic car community that you go to meets with? I wasn't talking about them specifically, not ALL of them for sure ,but are all exotic cars owners real car enthuiasts? no definitely not, that's why I said A PERCENTAGE OF THEM ARE posers, not all, and that is enough to get your panties in a knot ? They are not a homogeneous group of people who have the same level of knowledge in cars or the same intention in ownership, whether or not they would admit it. I know a few people who owns exotic cars too, and a couple of them are women, whose knowledge in cars and driving skills are not much better than average, they are just status symbols for them. So it is not me who is making a generalization here.

The arguments you've read before here are not directly from Lexus officially please remember, as has been pointed out by Gengar and a couple other many times, but mostly their own interpretation by some members here or some other enthusiasts from some press release.

Sure they may aim at selling to as many real enthusiasts who will track the cars as possible, but nowhere did they say they are trying to sell the LFA to those people exclusively, and I don't think they are dumb enough to think they can, from the way they price the car. They also want some high profile people to be seen driving it for sure, & that includes celebrities.

Seriously what thinking people who actually have the means to buy any exotic car will judge it based on what celebrity owns it also ? They may have positive or negative image of a certain celebrity, but they will not base their decision on that. Let's assume Paris will have one as reported, but what if another celebrity with positive image got one too, do they then change their mind immediately just because of that ? This line of argument seems so stupid to me I don't even know how to continue LOL ......

I have personallly criticize Lexus many times before you even registered here that I dislike their idea of selling this car at such a high price with such a limited run, and I would rather see them try to sell 2000 of them at maybe half the current price if they want to promote a more sporting image for the Lexus brand(you can search for old LFA posts), so a lot more owners can get an actual taste of owning their sports car. So I am not the type who defends lexus when I don't think they deserve it.

Besides, we are still making assumptions of how involved Lexus is in Paris getting this car as a gift, and if they think more people will see the car if some celebrities drive them, I don't think there is anything wrong with that, they are not using Paris as their official spokesperson for Lexus and the LFA from what we have seen so far, and I don't believe serious car buyers will base their impression too much on who has owned the LFA, all they will be exposed to is that Lexus has produced an exotic car that the rich and famous drive.

MR_F1

You didn't answer my question.

G Star

iTrader: (2)

You have fabricated this little fantasy world where Lexus contacted or hired Paris Hilton to do a publicity stunt with the LFA. Then you continue to add more to this story claiming that she isn't going to help the brand, or successfully market the way they originally (supposedly) wanted as if they actually did this as fact.

You have consistently touted yourself as a man of truth and facts yet you pull something like this. Makes no sense.

UDel

The SLR did not sell or live up to expectations for Mercedes, I would not blame that on Paris Hilton but her being seen driving it and getting a DUI in it probably did not help with its image.

UDel

If Toyota's goal was to sell the car to people who will drive it, for it to be seen by many, to be visible to people for interest in the F sport, and to avoid speculation then they should build more and lower the price. People don't tend to drive 375K+ sports cars around very much because they are so expensive and rare and don't want to hurt the value. When they only build 500 very few people are going to see it period or know what it is unless they are enthusiasts that have followed this car.

If Toyota did not go on about how exclusive the buyer selection process is for this rare car and how they want people who will appreciate the car and its engineering and who will drive it and not just buy it for bragging rights then I doubt many would complaining that Paris Hilton got one. Her getting one means that the selection process was not that exclusive or special. If Toyota wanted some celebrities to be seen driving it they should have at least did some research for celebrities who are enthusiasts that are more respected and not in the tabloids/news all the time like Jay Leno, Jerry Seinfeld, Patrick Dempsey, Tim Allen, Adam Corolla, Ralph Lauren, etc. If they chose Hilton then nobody should be surprised if Lyndsey Lohan, Kim Kardashian, Brittany Spears, etc are also chosen from this "exclusive" selection process.

I saw Hilton on Letterman a few nights ago and Letterman asked about the car and as expected she knew nothing about it other then saying "it's hot" and it was 375K. I really doubt this is the kind of exposure Toyota was looking for after going on about the exclusive selection process and wanting to give more awareness and legitimacy to the F sport brand.

TF109B

What don't you get? Hilton didn't buy the car. Her boyfriend bought it. Whether she gets on with it and drives the thing isn't any of our concern. Her boyfriend didn't have to specify that he was giving it to her as a present. I'm pretty sure that since he was the one that bought it, he probably has a good deal of expensive toys and possibly a couple Lexus' as well.

raptor22

i don't see how it would do anything to its image, good or bad. It's not like we can control people's actions, and it's not like Paris is Mercedes' official spokeperson.

same thing with the LFA, not like Lexus chose Paris to be LFA's spokeperson.

TommyJames

It's never one thing that shapes a brand. It's a combination of things over time. Who buys the car definitely impacts the overall image of something but it's not JUST one person.

Over and over I hear very defensive comments about the LFA. This isn't about just the LFA, it's about branding overall. Think of any particular model of car and think of the driver and you will often come up with some stereotype view of a car based on your own experience. As an example, I type the PT Cruiser as something driven by old people. (sorry) Subaru Outbacks by slow driving tree huggers, (sorry again) and so on. It's never one driver, but a pattern of who buys something. It's a culture that follows a brand over time. I get it that it's her boyfriend who bought the car, etc., but I look at everyone around her as a part of an influential marketing machine. I don't see someone who actually buys or receives something personally. I think everything around her, including who she dates and what she does is about headlines. Some of you who are quick to argue need to learn a lot more about how trends are built, how certain brands catch fire and become household names, etc., while others die and why that happens in the first place. There is a very good book called The Tipping Point by Malcolm Gladwell. Read that very well researched book then come here and make your arguments about if it helps or hinders the brand.

07grIS350

Yawn... can we talk about the car and not about branding, marketing etc... there is no point in harping about something that would only become apparent in a year or so. Lexus will do what they do, if the brand's image suffered then they'd have to fix it. If the exotic market grew, good. If the value of other exotics tanked, blame it on Lexus and move on...

05RollaXRS

x 2

This is what needs to happen on this thread. I don't ever see any threads complaining about Lamborghini selling Gallardos to Chris Brown or Ferrari selling a F430 Scuderia to Justin Bieber or Lamborghini selling Hayden Christensen an LP640-4. Why should Lexus LFA be singled out???

Lexus actually sold the LFA to her boyfriend who in turn gave it as a present to Paris Hilton anyway.

A moderator should see to it that this thread does not drift off topic into the realm of marketing strategy and other hearse.