RR Road and Track Versus Penske
11-05-18, 04:04 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
RR Road and Track Versus Penske
I’m looking for a coilover education. I decided RR is the vendor, but not sure which product to go with. I hope to keep a ride similar to OEM 13 suspension. Right now I mostly drag race, and eventually will throw in a couple road courses a year. Is it worth the additional cost to go to the Penske shocks which have adjustable compression and rebound? Will it actually shave any measurable time out of the quarter? And finally, any difference in ride quality?
I have the USRS,will be full bolt on soon and running 18x9.5 et 45 Volks by spring. I don’t really plan any other major mods for a very long time. R comp tires versus 100-200 treadwear rating is still up in the air. Goal right now is high 11s in the quarter, then I’ll start looking at courses (I should get some free passes to Putnam next year).
Please school me on shocks and how to tune them for drags versus courses, and anything else I should be thinking about. Thanks!
I have the USRS,will be full bolt on soon and running 18x9.5 et 45 Volks by spring. I don’t really plan any other major mods for a very long time. R comp tires versus 100-200 treadwear rating is still up in the air. Goal right now is high 11s in the quarter, then I’ll start looking at courses (I should get some free passes to Putnam next year).
Please school me on shocks and how to tune them for drags versus courses, and anything else I should be thinking about. Thanks!
11-05-18, 05:27 PM
#2
I’m looking for a coilover education. I decided RR is the vendor, but not sure which product to go with. I hope to keep a ride similar to OEM 13 suspension. Right now I mostly drag race, and eventually will throw in a couple road courses a year. Is it worth the additional cost to go to the Penske shocks which have adjustable compression and rebound? Will it actually shave any measurable time out of the quarter? And finally, any difference in ride quality?
I have the USRS,will be full bolt on soon and running 18x9.5 et 45 Volks by spring. I don’t really plan any other major mods for a very long time. R comp tires versus 100-200 treadwear rating is still up in the air. Goal right now is high 11s in the quarter, then I’ll start looking at courses (I should get some free passes to Putnam next year).
Please school me on shocks and how to tune them for drags versus courses, and anything else I should be thinking about. Thanks!
I have the USRS,will be full bolt on soon and running 18x9.5 et 45 Volks by spring. I don’t really plan any other major mods for a very long time. R comp tires versus 100-200 treadwear rating is still up in the air. Goal right now is high 11s in the quarter, then I’ll start looking at courses (I should get some free passes to Putnam next year).
Please school me on shocks and how to tune them for drags versus courses, and anything else I should be thinking about. Thanks!
I think you and I have have exchanged all sorts of messages and info but I will post some here. But feel free to PM me as well.
See my sig for full mods, but I have the RR Road & Track coilovers (16/12kg spring setup)on 08 OEM wheels with Michelin PS4s. I have drag raced a couple times but not on the coilovers or PS4s. I was stock suspension and DWS06 all seasons. The proper setup for the drag strip per RR's instructions is to basically soften the rear and stiffen the front to transfer more weight to the rear wheels to gain additional traction. I can't tell you however if it makes any difference.
However, I've done Putnam and Mid Ohio (and yes, you better come out with me to one of them next year! lol) before and after the coilover setup. With proper adjustments I easily shaved several seconds off my lap times. The car is much more stable/controllable on the track and you can slightly dial in under/over steer to your liking.
As far as ride quality, I personally felt little to no improvement on the streets despite what RR will tell you (but I am lowered maybe 1.0-1.5 inches too). I was a little disappointed it wasn't softer, but happy with the track performance (which is the main reason I bought them). But keep in mind, I also came from the rougher 08 setup. So I view them as a reasonable track coilover that is streetable rather than a street coilover that is trackable.
It will be very hard to get high 11's without going full bolt on and with drag radials. You and I have similar elevation and best I did FBO on OEM suspension and all seasons was 12.6 (2000 DA). I would love to go back on a cool night with a much lower DA to see what I could do.
Keep an eye on Autointerests' website and Facebook page for track events. Great organization based out of Ohio. I hope to organize an F group track day in 2019 likely at Mid Ohio.
If you are ever near Cincinnati, I can let you experience the coilovers for yourself.
Last edited by lexicon72; 11-05-18 at 05:42 PM.
11-05-18, 08:11 PM
#3
I have the 16/12 Road and Tracks and personally would’ve gone 18/14 given the chance to do over. I also think the shocks were valved a bit too soft, as I am fully adjusted front and rear to stiff and would still like a bit more. I like my cars tight. We’ve got good roads in MD and could handle that extra bit of stiffness of the 18/14. In terms of firmness, the 16/12 is quite similar to the 11+ suspension. They do make noise over bumps, or more specifically over depressions - I remember Rafi saying they make “coilovers” noises, but I’m not sure why this has to be the case. I’ve got coilovers on my G35 that are lesser quality by far, but silent as the oem suspension. Not sure why the Road and Tracks have to make noise - do wish this wasn’t the case. It’s not bad, but again, I could do without.
11-05-18, 08:30 PM
#4
Interesting take on your personal experience as it is different than mine. I daily drive my 08 15k annually and am used to getting beat to hell for the last 4 years on OEM. Was hoping to get some improved comfort but am thinking being lowered doesn't help.
I use 5 clicks from full on the track and maybe 20 clicks from full on the street (front only - been meaning to do rears too). Curious - are you lowered at all?
Yes - mine make noise as well (sounds similar to loose bolts). I think it has something to do with the metal tophats.
I use 5 clicks from full on the track and maybe 20 clicks from full on the street (front only - been meaning to do rears too). Curious - are you lowered at all?
Yes - mine make noise as well (sounds similar to loose bolts). I think it has something to do with the metal tophats.
11-06-18, 02:49 AM
#6
Interesting take on your personal experience as it is different than mine. I daily drive my 08 15k annually and am used to getting beat to hell for the last 4 years on OEM. Was hoping to get some improved comfort but am thinking being lowered doesn't help.
I use 5 clicks from full on the track and maybe 20 clicks from full on the street (front only - been meaning to do rears too). Curious - are you lowered at all?
Yes - mine make noise as well (sounds similar to loose bolts). I think it has something to do with the metal tophats.
I use 5 clicks from full on the track and maybe 20 clicks from full on the street (front only - been meaning to do rears too). Curious - are you lowered at all?
Yes - mine make noise as well (sounds similar to loose bolts). I think it has something to do with the metal tophats.
Yep, lowered front and back by about an inch back and 1.5 front - the typical, conservative drop. The only real difference in ride that I noted between the R&T and stock 2011 suspension was the slightly increased noise and the fact that the R&Ts were better on the rebound control, ie not as bouncy as the 11 suspension. Overall I find the R&Ts to be great for handling, I just wish I wasn’t at the end of my adjustment so I had some more room to play. That and I wish they were a bit quieter - between them and my clunking NS400 pads, there is sometimes a bit too much metal noise from the car than would be ideal and I miss the stock sound (or lack thereof). But the car looks so much better that I could never go back.
BTW, does it feel odd to have them so stiff up front and soft in the back?
Last edited by Jz39; 11-06-18 at 02:52 AM.
11-06-18, 09:02 AM
#7
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Great question as I'm contemplating the same as well though for slightly different situation. I don't drag but do about 3-4 road course track days per year plus daily and my car is only driven in summer. Don't plan on lowering anymore than 0.5" in the front and 0" in the rear.
Currently leaning towards the R&T coils at 18/16k but really wondering how much better the Penskes are at a 1200 premium.
I've had coilovers with pillowball uppermounts before on other cars so not worried about the increase NVH but wondering the following:
1. Do both the Penske and R&T coils make the same noise or are the Penskes quieter? Guessing no since they are the same RR uppermounts.
2. Would the Penskes require a rebuild sooner seeing as they are a race shock and built to tighter tolerance or would a degraded Penske shock still perform better than a brand new R&T set up?
3. Are the shocks valved at the upper end or lower end of the available spring rates? Ie Penskes at 18/16 should be no problem due to the quality of the valving but R&T at 18/16.. would it prematurely wear out the shock?
Currently leaning towards the R&T coils at 18/16k but really wondering how much better the Penskes are at a 1200 premium.
I've had coilovers with pillowball uppermounts before on other cars so not worried about the increase NVH but wondering the following:
1. Do both the Penske and R&T coils make the same noise or are the Penskes quieter? Guessing no since they are the same RR uppermounts.
2. Would the Penskes require a rebuild sooner seeing as they are a race shock and built to tighter tolerance or would a degraded Penske shock still perform better than a brand new R&T set up?
3. Are the shocks valved at the upper end or lower end of the available spring rates? Ie Penskes at 18/16 should be no problem due to the quality of the valving but R&T at 18/16.. would it prematurely wear out the shock?
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11-06-18, 03:38 PM
#8
BTW, does it feel odd to have them so stiff up front and soft in the back?
[/QUOTE]On track, RR's recommended 5 clicks from stiff all around is near perfect. I went full stiff and too much understeer. Fyi, they also suggested softening the sikky rear 1 setting but I chose not to.
For daily I currently have 20 clicks from stiff front and still 5 in back - as I mentioned I really need to adjust the rears similarly. Didn't notice a difference in normal driving.
I asked RR for daily street settings and they said 7 clicks from stiff. Not much of an adjustment IMO. Plus they never told me what the max softest setting (in clicks) was which was frustrating.
So I guess I'm still playing a little.
11-08-18, 01:41 PM
#9
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Thread Starter
The noise will be frustrating. I don’t like rattles and sounds in such a high end car. The required rebuild rate does seem high. Apparently the Ohlins don’t require rebuilding as often. Can anyone chime in on how they ride? I’ll never be a good enough driver to find the limits of either suspension sets on a road course... but I am a good enough driver to develop a back ache or get tired of hearing squeaking.
11-09-18, 06:19 AM
#12
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Thread Starter
did the Ohlins fix the noise issues? My roads are similar to New York’s roads... they are bend-a-rim-able. I plan to run 18s for lighter weight and more sidewall as well.
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