Leander311

iTrader: (2)

As a mechanical/HVAC/energy PE, I’d like to fancy myself as one of “those physics guys” Lance mentioned.

A study was conducted where fins were flattened on a split system condensing unit to model airflow obstruction, from 30-95%. No change in head pressure was observed until they were in the 70-80% range, far higher than most in the industry (myself included at the time) would suspect.

That’s to say, for an air/fluid HX, size >>>>> airflow. (Edit: to a point, and then it’s diminishing returns. Calculating LMTD for the design condition is helpful. In my job, it most often comes down to LCCA calcs over a 30-50 year expected useful life, for chiller HX’s impacting 3-5MW each.)

Funny also to think the very name “radiator” implies the inherent named mode of heat transfer is dominant vs. convective or even conductive cooling. Relevant? Perhaps, but I’m very doubtful.

-Nick

FWIW, after enjoying the RLI and Amsoil craze started here on CL, and with some measurable success, I’m now on QSUD in both the IS-F and GX. My wallet has thanked me handily. Many thanks also to the 540rat blog. He’s not a PE, but his methodology appears pretty solid.

Jwconeil

540 Rat has posted a new best oil, even better than QSUD. It’s Quaker state full synthetic. Quote below from his blog.

“1. 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” (abbreviated QSFS), dexos 1 Gen 2, ILSAC GF-6A, API SP = 152,674 psi
And that psi value sets a WHOPPING NEW ALL-TIME RECORD for motor oils that I have put through my Engineering Torture Test on motor oil. It was tested in Spring 2021.
This new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil replaces the previous 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” (abbreviated QSUD) synthetic.
zinc = 905
phos = 764
moly = 176
The psi value of this new oil, which came from testing it at the normal operating test temperature of 230*F, put it in the SPECTACULAR Wear Protection Category. However, I went on to also test this oil at the much higher temperature of 275*F. At that elevated temperature, most hotter and thinner oils typically experience a drop in Wear Protection Capability. But, even at that elevated temperature, this oil produced an extremely impressive 148,133 psi, which was only a small 3% drop in capability. And that value put this much hotter and thinner oil in the AMAZING Wear Protection Category.

I also tested this oil to find out its onset of thermal breakdown, which was 290*F.

This new oil was purchased at Walmart. And its truly amazing performance is further proof that Walmart is selling legitimate motor oil, even though their prices are extremely low compared to typical Auto Parts Stores.

Many of us who have been devoted users of the previous Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” motor oil, were concerned that Quaker State’s Corporate bean counters might get their hands on this new Quaker State “Full Synthetic” oil, and cut costs that would ruin the oil. Fortunately, as it turned out, that did not happen. And in fact, now this latest new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil, is BY FAR, the BEST PERFORMING motor oil that I have ever tested. This is absolute proof that Quaker State REALLY knows how to formulate motor oil.

This new “Full Synthetic” motor oil has set the bar so high, that it is the oil I will be using in my own vehicles from stock to High Performance, from now on. And it is the motor oil that I will recommend to my Blog readers for most water cooled, gasoline powered engines, that can use 5W30. This is especially THE “go to” motor oil for traditional flat tappet engines to provide the utmost in protection against wiped cam lobes.

Never say never, but it is hard to imagine another motor oil ever producing numbers this amazing.

Here is a back to back comparison of the new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” and the old 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability”.

NOTE: The Higher the psi value, the Better the wear protection capability. And the Higher the onset of thermal breakdown value, the Higher the oil temperature can reach before the oil begins to deteriorate due to heat.

QSFS at 230*F = 152,674 psi
QSFS at 275*F = 148,133 psi
QSFS onset of thermal breakdown = 290*F

*****
QSUD at 230*F = 133,125 psi
QSUD at 275*F = 115,764 psi
QSUD onset of thermal breakdown = 275*F

The only possible concern about this amazing new 5W30 Quaker State Full Synthetic motor oil, was that it might be “too good” for use in wet clutch motorcycles. But, motorcycle Owner feedback in July 2021, proved that this amazing new motor oil works just fine in wet clutch motorcycles, meaning there was no clutch slipping at all. Of course that applies to wet clutch motorcycles with clutches that are in good condition.”

Source: https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/201...-test-ranking/

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

Just keep in mind, RAT is testing ONE parameter of the oil's performance. Load capacity. Sure more might be better, but if the oil doesn't stand up to fuel dilution, or the VI modifiers shear easily, or it oxidizes at lower temperatures, or, or, or...

RAT's blog is a good place to start. You still have a lot of homework to do on your own to be sure what he tests will work in your application. If you read his blog critically, you'll see he doesn't recommend any particular oil. He tests them for load capacity and reports his findings.

I'd really want to send some used oil samples to Tribologik, or another ISO certfified lab and check how it handles fuel dilution - this truly is the biggest issue we have with the factory tune on our engines.

ChpEng

iTrader: (1)

@lobuxracer @Jwconeil I am mulling over where to start sending UOA's for my vehicles. MobilServ and Tribologik are ISO-certified but oriented towards corporate clients, and it is difficult to gauge the cost/benefit of starting a testing history with them without knowing their fee schedule. Despite their shortcomings, Blackstone makes it really easy to get started.

Potential middle ground might be QSUD/QSFS + RLI Booster Pak. Maybe the high VI of the booster would help with fuel dilution? I have QSUD in both vehicles now and have noticed quieter valve-train-type noises vs Pennzoil Ultra Platinum. The ISF makes occasional rattling noises similar to @lobuxracer 's video, but only when warm.

Rossi

iTrader: (4)

Going with AMSOIL SS this weekend first time after years of Royal Purple HPS.

Jwconeil

Where did we get the info that Renewable and QSUD stand up well to dilution? I can’t remember the source.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

No one said QSUD stands up to fuel dilution. I said it might be a good alternative based on RAT's testing and an unbeatable price. But I've never seen any testing on it for fuel dilution management. Daniel, formerly of Tribologik, said in the massive oil thread in the RC F forum that Renewable is "best" for managing fuel dilution. I did send a sample to Tribologik after Daniel moved on to another company, and it validated Renewable's fuel dilution capability. I have also seen a small but detectable difference in my Blackstone wear numbers. Slightly less iron over time with Renewable compared to Mobil 1 of the same weights.

CCColtsicehockey

iTrader: (3)

Reading up on this thread now that I have an ISF again. Was all set to pay the premium for the RLI reading what you were paying for it @lobuxracer . However, just looked at the price and it is now $265 shipped for a 5gal container. For this first change since I have it back I have ordered QSFS for now over using Mobile1. Wish we could find some fuel dilution numbers for it though. I had no idea that was an issue the last time around that I had one.
I am used to paying a good bit for good oil as running Redline in 2 other cars but they don't use as much oil. Redine is still $50-60 per gallon. I guess the same as RLI when buying at 5 gal price depending on the time besides the fact the ISF uses so much oil. Ordering in a small amount is even more expensive than Redline.

Edit: Disregard the above. By using the link directly to the product I missed that shipping is free above $50 since I never completed checkout. That is well below what I pay for Redline already and makes the cost per change not that much different than my CTS-V which uses less oil. Now I might not bother using the QSFS and just put it in something else.

93MSB

iTrader: (8)

you can also buy it through amazon for 200+ tax. I've gone back to changing my oil every 5k so the 5gal pail only sits opened for 5-6months before it's all used

ChpEng

iTrader: (1)

Here is a single FD data point for QSUD.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/is-...l#post11297614
Will have one for PUP w/ 2x RLI Booster Paks in a few weeks.

CCColtsicehockey

iTrader: (3)

Thanks. Looks like RLI it is then. I will put the QSFS in the wifes car instead.

The 5gal bucket also only seems to save you like $7 total vs 5 - 1 gallon jugs. Not sure the savings outweigh the convenience of the smaller container to me.