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Question what would be crank horsepower of FBO + RRR Tune ISF?^

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Question what would be crank horsepower of FBO + RRR Tune ISF?^

 
Old 06-07-18, 06:41 AM
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Weapon F
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Default Question what would be crank horsepower of FBO + RRR Tune ISF?^

I was asked this question recently of a BMW owner before I give him answer I have my own ideas but I like feedback from other in our community Rafi from RRR if you see this thread or Lance if we extrapolate the gains of I/H/E plus RR RacingTune along with their Tuned intake system what crank HP numbers roughly are we looking at?
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Old 06-07-18, 07:16 AM
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17% drivetrain loss so if you dyno 420whp your around 495 crank.
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Old 06-07-18, 08:48 AM
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I think there are too many variables. This is assuming that all engines make the same exact horsepower with no variances (which is hard to believe). Then assuming drivetrain loss from a dyno reading that has variances of its own depending on weather, technician, gear it dyno in, and dyno type. I don't think the question can really be answered in an exact manner. I think the best answer is "I don't know...no one has ever dyno'd a car to the crank before...."
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Old 06-07-18, 11:17 AM
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Hence why he stated "what crank HP numbers roughly are we looking at?" According to Rafi @ RRRacing they have consistently been around 17% with what they have seen.
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Old 06-07-18, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by BS ISF View Post
Hence why he stated "what crank HP numbers roughly are we looking at?" According to Rafi @ RRRacing they have consistently been around 17% with what they have seen.
But you see my point right? A dyno is just a measure between 2 deltas. It's not a measurement of crank hp. I don't think there is anything on record stating a dyno should be read for assumption of parasitic loss of "x" amount percentage. Of course, I don't mind being wrong...that's why I'm here on the forums
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Old 06-07-18, 01:58 PM
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for sure i see your point but drivetrain loss is a constant. regardless of your mods you are going to see the same/or close to drivetrain loss. that is how Rafi and RRRacing market their 725hp package for our cars. That is crank HP numbers.
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Old 06-07-18, 04:38 PM
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I've always told people it's between 485-500 @ the crank depending on what drivetrain loss you want to calculate with.............but more importantly @ sealevel are those numbers correct, as soon as you start climbing in altitude those numbers are lower unfortunately and up to debate like politics
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Old 06-07-18, 04:52 PM
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I tell people about 600. It sounds much better than 500. Make that 650.
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Old 06-07-18, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by BS ISF View Post
for sure i see your point but drivetrain loss is a constant. regardless of your mods you are going to see the same/or close to drivetrain loss. that is how Rafi and RRRacing market their 725hp package for our cars. That is crank HP numbers.
No, it's not a constant and that's the whole problem. If you want to know crank numbers, you need to pull the engine and put it on a Superflow dyno.

IMHO, crank numbers don't mean anything. There is only one thing that means anything important to me - trap speed over a measured course. You can take that to the bank. Anything else is pure bench racing and there are too many uncontrolled variables to make it anything more than a pissing contest. Besides, it doesn't matter what the numbers are when you line up with someone. The numbers don't win, but the driver might!
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Old 06-07-18, 09:20 PM
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Thanks for reply everyone and MileHiFcar 485 to 500 is where I would put FBO Tuned ISF as well. Now,what sparked this was friendly debate with friend that owns M3, was this video he saw on Youtube of FBO Tuned ISF vs stock E60 M5. He felt ISF had more than what was posted. When I told that they put any where between 480 and 500 at crank to e60 M5 507 crank up it was pretty fair race. Driver MOD is also as just as import as tune, or FBO. That like ISF the e60 M5 really shines up top. That its beast of top end car.


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Old 06-07-18, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by lobuxracer View Post
No, it's not a constant and that's the whole problem. If you want to know crank numbers, you need to pull the engine and put it on a Superflow dyno.

IMHO, crank numbers don't mean anything. There is only one thing that means anything important to me - trap speed over a measured course. You can take that to the bank. Anything else is pure bench racing and there are too many uncontrolled variables to make it anything more than a pissing contest. Besides, it doesn't matter what the numbers are when you line up with someone. The numbers don't win, but the driver might!
So people should be really asking “does this mod add to my trap time” instead of “does it free up horse power”..... Hmmm....focusing on real world measurements....Lance, you crazy!
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Old 06-08-18, 06:36 AM
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i stand corrected. good to know.
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Old 06-08-18, 07:51 AM
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I totally get an agree with lances comment regarding crank horsepower some people's fixated on Dyno numbers. Just was curious what the motor might be possibly be putting out. On another thread regarding an owner wanting to know how much whp full bolt on and a tune would make thoseas my response:

Originally Posted by Weapon F
I have similar set up PPE Jet hot coated headers, JoeZ exhaust & intake along with RRRacing Tune and Tuned intake system with RRRacing AOS. Regarding dynoing your car there's so many variables weather condition, type of dyno, dyno operator etc. For me better measure to see how well mods are performing is to take it to track whether it be 1/4mil, Road course, 1/2mil, 1mil, Autocross any timed event. If you see better times then everything is working. The RRR Tune will give you things you can't feel on dyno, like that mid range punch as well as bit better bottom end. The way it shifts especially if you increase RPM like I did to 7200rpm Redline, that little 400rpm makes difference. Take the car out driving see how it feels don't worry so much about Dyno numbers.
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