Lexus isf to camaro zl1....a farewell
09-27-17, 09:40 AM
#31
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Congrats on the purchase Tammer, and I wish you many enjoyable track days to come!
Rafi
Rafi
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09-27-17, 02:14 PM
#35
Glad you leased it. Guy in town just got rid of his Camaro and the depreciation hit after just the first year would make us peasants cry. Luckily he’s well to do and was his 5th or 6th car but damn.
09-27-17, 04:41 PM
#36
We all get it that the ZL1 is FAR faster than the ISF/LC500/RCF. It's supposed to be with a motor like that supercharged. In all honesty, the ISF supercharged would top all of those performance numbers of the ZL1.....guys (non professionals) are running 11.2s in the 1/4 at 129+ with supercharged ISFs. Honestly think the ISF/LFA, etc are better looking vehicles as well (although I do admit that the ZL1 is the 1st Camaro I actually approved the looks of).
One more thing, I work on cars/car electronics, and take apart cars for a living and let me tell you that the Camaro and Lexus' are on 2 different levels as far as luxury and quality on the inside (things you can't see). But obviously you, and everyone else knows that.... because obviously you can't have luxury, quality and the performance figures of the ZL1 for $65k brand new (or $400/month in a lease like your case).
Ton of power, super fast (super car type speeds) but you'll see why sooner than later why the car is so cheap. BUT, like you said, you were smart and leased it��! You'll be giving it back probably before you find out why it so cheap and you'll be driving off with a 2020 ZL1, lol.
Have fun with it!
V.
One more thing, I work on cars/car electronics, and take apart cars for a living and let me tell you that the Camaro and Lexus' are on 2 different levels as far as luxury and quality on the inside (things you can't see). But obviously you, and everyone else knows that.... because obviously you can't have luxury, quality and the performance figures of the ZL1 for $65k brand new (or $400/month in a lease like your case).
Ton of power, super fast (super car type speeds) but you'll see why sooner than later why the car is so cheap. BUT, like you said, you were smart and leased it��! You'll be giving it back probably before you find out why it so cheap and you'll be driving off with a 2020 ZL1, lol.
Have fun with it!
V.
I agree with Vitveet, you can slap an RR racing supercharger on the ISF with a aggressive r comp tire and beat the zl1 times handily. Another point that anyone that has been to the track is well aware of is this; track times have almost as much to do with the driver as it does with the cars performance. At my last track day at MidOhio I was faster than many cars that my relatively stock 2013 ISF on stock Bridgstones shouldn’t compete with on paper( Ferrari F430, C7 Z06, 2017 911 Turbo, etc.). It’s all relative in the end and if you love the zL1, you don’t have to justify your purchase to anyone��. I personally really like the ZL1 and hope you enjoy ownership!
Yes S/C makes ISF very competitive thats the great thing about it, but to insinuate that it would outperform ZL1 by just slapping on S/C and some comp r tires is a little naive and more complicated than that. 5ltvr8 you made mention how you out performed C7 Z06, 2017 911 turbo etc at your last track event all while on oem bridgestones wow!. But its driver that were outperformed not cars. That being said ZL1 is absolute Beast of a car, and I for totally understand the appeal of ZL1 I've driven it. I8ABMR enjoy your new toy brother wish you nothing but the best stay touch and let us know how it goes with ZL1.
Last edited by Weapon F; 09-27-17 at 04:49 PM.
09-28-17, 05:46 AM
#37
To the OP...first of all I remember you from my ISF days and to call you an enthusiast would be putting it lightly. Thank you for all the information you provided on this forum about tracking your F and you will be missed... good luck with the ZL1 and have fun...BUT you might be back???
You see I built an awesome ISF ( see build thread in sig) but wanted to go faster. I did my track thing when younger mainly with motorcycles but back then I just wanted to go fast...1/2 mile racing. So I chased the "Holy Grail"... I started with a 911...then a 911 Turbo, then a 2014 ZL1, even owned a GTR and was going to go Alpha 10...and a few other fast cars in-between. However, somewhere along the way I realized it cost a ton and there are no guarantees that you will ever be the fastest. So with accepting that fact I sat back and thought about what attributes ate most important to me for a DD but yet a performance car. And yes there arose many choices but I landed back with Lexus as they checked many of the boxes for me. So go Chase your Holy Grail and the ZL1 is a great choice for what you want but don't be surprised if one day your back on this forum driving a Lexus. IMHO
One last thing...comparing a LFA to a ZL1??? Night and day my friend regardless of track times, 0-60, etc...there is a lot more to a performance car than that...but I get it as right now you are focused on going fast on the track. But come on...a LFA is clearly an iconic automobile and a ZL1 is just a very fast Camaro. Again good luck and be safe!
You see I built an awesome ISF ( see build thread in sig) but wanted to go faster. I did my track thing when younger mainly with motorcycles but back then I just wanted to go fast...1/2 mile racing. So I chased the "Holy Grail"... I started with a 911...then a 911 Turbo, then a 2014 ZL1, even owned a GTR and was going to go Alpha 10...and a few other fast cars in-between. However, somewhere along the way I realized it cost a ton and there are no guarantees that you will ever be the fastest. So with accepting that fact I sat back and thought about what attributes ate most important to me for a DD but yet a performance car. And yes there arose many choices but I landed back with Lexus as they checked many of the boxes for me. So go Chase your Holy Grail and the ZL1 is a great choice for what you want but don't be surprised if one day your back on this forum driving a Lexus. IMHO
One last thing...comparing a LFA to a ZL1??? Night and day my friend regardless of track times, 0-60, etc...there is a lot more to a performance car than that...but I get it as right now you are focused on going fast on the track. But come on...a LFA is clearly an iconic automobile and a ZL1 is just a very fast Camaro. Again good luck and be safe!
Last edited by OURISF; 09-28-17 at 05:52 AM.
09-28-17, 08:26 AM
#38
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I agree with Vitveet, you can slap an RR racing supercharger on the ISF with a aggressive r comp tire and beat the zl1 times handily. Another point that anyone that has been to the track is well aware of is this; track times have almost as much to do with the driver as it does with the cars performance. At my last track day at MidOhio I was faster than many cars that my relatively stock 2013 ISF on stock Bridgstones shouldn’t compete with on paper( Ferrari F430, C7 Z06, 2017 911 Turbo, etc.). It’s all relative in the end and if you love the zL1, you don’t have to justify your purchase to anyone��. I personally really like the ZL1 and hope you enjoy ownership!
Here is how I look at it. The ISF and RCF are *great* cars. In stock form, they are "good" but not "great" track cars. Camaro ILE's and ZL1's are track ready cars that come with aggressive track alignment settings and suspensions, not to mention R-comp tires that will last about 5000miles (or maybe less in the rear
.If you want to tilt the balance of your ISF to more of a track car, basic alignment, tires, and suspension changes will get you ever bit as much performance as a Camaro SS ILE. In the end of the day though... you are driving a well built and polished 4 door practical family Lexus sedan, and not a GM product, where for all their specs on paper, when you look up close you can see the difference.
As for the supercharged ZL1, for all its great lap times, I bet that there are very few people out there cross shopping Camaros with Porsches, Ferraris, McLarens, Lamborghinis, or for that matter Lexus, BMWs, or Mercs.
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
__________________
We Engineer Track Proven Upgrades For Your Lexus!
SUPERCHARGERS : ECU TUNING : SUSPENSION : EXHAUST : PPE MASTER DEALER
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Last edited by RRRacing; 09-28-17 at 08:33 AM.
09-28-17, 09:16 AM
#39
Here is how I look at it. The ISF and RCF are *great* cars. In stock form, they are "good" but not "great" track cars. Camaro ILE's and ZL1's are track ready cars that come with aggressive track alignment settings and suspensions, not to mention R-comp tires that will last about 5000miles (or maybe less in the rear.
If you want to tilt the balance of your ISF to more of a track car, basic alignment, tires, and suspension changes will get you ever bit as much performance as a Camaro SS ILE. In the end of the day though... you are driving a well built and polished 4 door practical family Lexus sedan, and not a GM product, where for all their specs on paper, when you look up close you can see the difference.
As for the supercharged ZL1, for all its great lap times, I bet that there are very few people out there cross shopping Camaros with Porsches, Ferraris, McLarens, Lamborghinis, or for that matter Lexus, BMWs, or Mercs.
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
.If you want to tilt the balance of your ISF to more of a track car, basic alignment, tires, and suspension changes will get you ever bit as much performance as a Camaro SS ILE. In the end of the day though... you are driving a well built and polished 4 door practical family Lexus sedan, and not a GM product, where for all their specs on paper, when you look up close you can see the difference.
As for the supercharged ZL1, for all its great lap times, I bet that there are very few people out there cross shopping Camaros with Porsches, Ferraris, McLarens, Lamborghinis, or for that matter Lexus, BMWs, or Mercs.
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
To me, Lexus has the good recipe of very competitive balance of luxury, power, and reliability. Whilst it does not excel in any specific area, but it sure is leading in overall scorecards. I am an avid antagonist against RCF, GSF, and LC500 in the category of performance/bang for buck, but these cars still have the best overall go-around compared to other choices on the market, currently.
09-28-17, 09:24 AM
#40
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
Rafi
I've always had a thing for "sleepers" anyway. I lusted after Mustangs back in the late '80s, but I didn't want the GT with all that fancy body work.. I wanted the low key LX with the 5.0 under the hood!
-Mike
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RRRacing (09-28-17)
09-28-17, 09:53 AM
#41
Here is how I look at it. The ISF and RCF are *great* cars. In stock form, they are "good" but not "great" track cars. Camaro ILE's and ZL1's are track ready cars that come with aggressive track alignment settings and suspensions, not to mention R-comp tires that will last about 5000miles (or maybe less in the rear.
If you want to tilt the balance of your ISF to more of a track car, basic alignment, tires, and suspension changes will get you ever bit as much performance as a Camaro SS ILE. In the end of the day though... you are driving a well built and polished 4 door practical family Lexus sedan, and not a GM product, where for all their specs on paper, when you look up close you can see the difference.
As for the supercharged ZL1, for all its great lap times, I bet that there are very few people out there cross shopping Camaros with Porsches, Ferraris, McLarens, Lamborghinis, or for that matter Lexus, BMWs, or Mercs.
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
.If you want to tilt the balance of your ISF to more of a track car, basic alignment, tires, and suspension changes will get you ever bit as much performance as a Camaro SS ILE. In the end of the day though... you are driving a well built and polished 4 door practical family Lexus sedan, and not a GM product, where for all their specs on paper, when you look up close you can see the difference.
As for the supercharged ZL1, for all its great lap times, I bet that there are very few people out there cross shopping Camaros with Porsches, Ferraris, McLarens, Lamborghinis, or for that matter Lexus, BMWs, or Mercs.
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
Rafi
09-28-17, 10:15 AM
#42
I agree with you Rafi, while Tammer has multiple track days and probably has more experience than the average F driver. There's no doubt that he left a lot of power on the table, his car was bone stock other than JoeZ exhaust (I believe?); running stock suspension, stock headers, no tune, etc. I don't feel as he "maxed" his ISF capabilities before moving into a new platform. While gutting the car and turning it into a full race car is probably not ideal for a family man however I'm sure upgrading many of the components I had mentioned would shaved some time off his lap time. Most F owners generally do the staple upgrades: Headers, Exhaust, Intake, and Tune. Anyways, congrats on the new Camaro Tammer!, it's a beast and makes a lot of power but you cannot compare it to an LFA. It may be faster around the track compared an LFA but the LFA is in a different class of its own.
And the pic Tammer put up about some ZL1 owner beating a Ferrari 458 and throwing a tissue out the window for the Ferrari owner.....let's be serious here a bit. Ferrari guy may now have been racing....or maybe he was. Even still, if so, end if the day, he's in a Ferrari, not a fast Camaro....hell, he may have a few zl1s at the house also for track duty. Never know...just nothing to boast too proudly about.
But I understand the excitement about buying a new, fast car. Tammer has always been very passionate about his main ride....and I don't expect it to stop just because he went away from Lexus! But no need in bashing F model cars now that you don't own one any longer and moved on....100% reminds me of one of my close friends who's girl left him for another guy a few months ago and now he's all of a sudden talking about how small her ***** are, how bad she was in bed, how this and that on her stunk.........but NONE of that was a problem while you two were together!! Suddenly it's all an issue when the relationship (ownership) is over...doesnt make sense, lol. IDK, maybe it's human nature to have those/these types of reactions 😏!
V.
Last edited by Vitveet; 09-28-17 at 12:40 PM.
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Brad3275 (09-28-17)
09-28-17, 11:03 AM
#43
And as for supercharging your ISF or RCF, based on our experience, the reasons our customers do it is not so much because they are cross shopping a Lexus with a Camaro, but because they really love many aspects of their Lexus, such as the design, fit, finish, quality, but they simply want to enhance performance. Most off all, they want something unique, something special. Last track day I did, I think I counted something like 8 Corvette C7 Z06's and 4 GT350's. But when you show up at the track, or Cars&Coffee, on a 600+hp supercharged Lexus, half the paddock is wondering, "wow WTF is that?"
The C&C here in Scottsdale last month had two brand new ZL1's and one brand new ZL1 1LE...however, I was the only RCF at the event
and it got a lot of attention as I heard people say things like "oh that is one of those F's"!
09-28-17, 11:27 AM
#44
Me thinks I8ABMR did one too many track days in a stock ISF. Getting smoked on a straightaway by another car when you think you are "getting it done" puts a funny feeling in the pit of your stomach. Ask anyone who has had the misfortune of being placed next to a GTR in their ISF at a "test-n-tune" and got SMOKED (me). A humbling experience to say the least. The desire for a faster car is no surprise given the circumstance he has placed himself in with the track days.
The post above mentioning women hits the nail on the head. We have all dated women that were the best at one thing. We married women that were really good at everything. There will ALWAYS be someone faster because they have more time, more experience, more natural ability, or simply more car. Adrenaline begets adrenaline and trying to be the fastest amateur driver usually results in your car going home on a flatbed at some point. Enjoy the new ride, have fun, be safe, but consider the ZL1 a double-bagger that you can't marry.
Btw, trust me, I'm not hating. I'm considering an Audi S6 4.0T with an APR Tune. Not for track use of course, only highway speed and comfort. The older I get, the more comfort and quiet I want. It is really unfortunate that Lexus has been stuck with "400" hp NA, RWD cars for a decade or more. A 2018 EcoBoost Mustang will run a sub-5 second 0-60 now for pete's sake. I can't go out like that and I can't wait for Lexus to bring FI and AWD to the F game any longer. Enjoying the ISF till the warranty runs out and then who knows...
The post above mentioning women hits the nail on the head. We have all dated women that were the best at one thing. We married women that were really good at everything. There will ALWAYS be someone faster because they have more time, more experience, more natural ability, or simply more car. Adrenaline begets adrenaline and trying to be the fastest amateur driver usually results in your car going home on a flatbed at some point. Enjoy the new ride, have fun, be safe, but consider the ZL1 a double-bagger that you can't marry.
Btw, trust me, I'm not hating. I'm considering an Audi S6 4.0T with an APR Tune. Not for track use of course, only highway speed and comfort. The older I get, the more comfort and quiet I want. It is really unfortunate that Lexus has been stuck with "400" hp NA, RWD cars for a decade or more. A 2018 EcoBoost Mustang will run a sub-5 second 0-60 now for pete's sake. I can't go out like that and I can't wait for Lexus to bring FI and AWD to the F game any longer. Enjoying the ISF till the warranty runs out and then who knows...
09-28-17, 12:48 PM
#45
Btw, trust me, I'm not hating. I'm considering an Audi S6 4.0T with an APR Tune. Not for track use of course, only highway speed and comfort. The older I get, the more comfort and quiet I want. It is really unfortunate that Lexus has been stuck with "400" hp NA, RWD cars for a decade or more. A 2018 EcoBoost Mustang will run a sub-5 second 0-60 now for pete's sake. I can't go out like that and I can't wait for Lexus to bring FI and AWD to the F game any longer. Enjoying the ISF till the warranty runs out and then who knows...