Vitveet

Which M3 and/or ISF have you owned? What about your ownership of each/either made you come to that conclusion?

V.

Adziu

Valley plate is just a leak of coolant if im not wrong? Tried to search up on the net about what it is but never got a summarized answer. The M3 all i know has 2 things that need attention besides the regular stuff. Throttle actuators and rod bearings. Actuators is a 3-4 hour fix that I probably would be ok with doing since they are on top and saw the DIY for it. Rod bearings I don’t have that much experience with.

kolyan

Valley plate leak thread is here. Not cheap to fix, $1000-1500
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/is-...ley-plate.html

Rod bearings, if effected, could be catastrophic and cost lots of money. Many just pay $2000-2500 to install better aftermarket ones after that its not an issue anymore as far as I know.

Diesel350

At least the Valley plate leak is not a common problem. Probably less than 5% affected.

kolyan

Not sure what % numbers are on M3, but not all have this issue. Its just very expensive to fix if they fail thats why some just pay $2k or whatever and get aftermarket parts installed

FFM

And yet the actual reported rod bearing failures to production number on the M3 is something like .003% if I recall.

Forum hysteria > than the real world haha.

Adziu

So nothing much to worry about here when it comes to the ISF’s valley plate issue since not many models have been affected by it. The M3 rod bearing situation seems more serious in this case since they are one of the main key parts of the entire motor to prevent it from blowing up. I mean spend the $500 something on the rod bearings and have a shop install them and save my self $1,000’s from replacing the S65B40. Throttle actuators from what I have read up on are bound to go on the E9X M3’s just a matter of who knows when. Hmm interesting. Anything else the ISF can have go wrong besides the valley plate leak? I know the dashboard and door panels are possible to get cracked or melted as well as the crappy digitizer on the navigation unit. Based on my Is250 having the digitzer being replaced 2 times on my own and dashboard was under recall by Lexus. Sadly they don’t do door panel replacements anymore from what my service advisor had mentioned to me.

FFM

So far most of the F’s issues revolve around the cooling system. Really not that many, which is why I got mine to commute with over the M3.

My commute is no more, thus back to looking at M3’s again.

ISF I have no real fears of racking up mileage on. M3, I didn’t want to do that. Due to higher cost of ownership. But like you said. If you fear the rod bearing issue, then get it done as a preventative maintenance item and never worry again. No different than doing the VANOS on the E46. Took me a Saturday, $500, and did a valve adjustment while I was in there.

Adziu

Ouch that must not sound like a fun time. Why does BMW make their cars especially the M models not so reliable? Are they worried about not making money or did someone really mess up in Bavaria and still not learn from their prior mistakes ? That’s one thing I will never understand. They make nice looking sports cars but then they end up having problems at some point. Not trying to bash on them but one thing I really wish to know the answer to. Miles on the Lexus cars can go on for days. But if I get either one of the choices I will buy some kind of a cheap daily that will be fuel efficient so I don’t have to rack miles up each way and run through gas like hell. Seems like 99.9% of F owners are pretty confident in their cars when it comes to ownership.

FFM

I don’t think it’s a matter of them doing it on purpose. They push the platforms much further. Look at all the bottle necks on ISF, I think it’s just a different approach.

I believe the rod bearing issue is 90% user error. BMW tightly toleranced that motor due to its high rev limit. Thus proper warm up is paramount prior to smashing on it. I guarantee you, all the M bro douche original owners at least a handful of times dry revved those engines cold, or ripped on it cold, showing off for a friend during its lifetime. Starving the bearings of proper lubrication is irreversible damage.

The fix, is people putting a thou or two looser bearing. Making it dummy proof.

kolyan

This is most recent from customer reports.....just FYI

Piciu

I have a good friend who owns e90 m3 from 2012. He bought it with almost no mileage, I bought my 2012 ISF with 37k km. Both of us are coming from e90 330i.

M3 e90 vs ISF
- M3 is way sportier (engine characteristic, suspention) and much better on track in OEM form except brakes
- M3 has more space in rear - he's using it as family car
- M3 steering is less artificial
- M3 gearbox is faster in manual mode

- ISF has way better brakes (for me it's a big thing, as I wanted to limit modications)
- ISF is more comfy on the road, gearbox in auto mode is fluent

Reliability:
- I did 40k km in 2,5 years, he put around 60k km in 3 years
- we both track our cars (2-3 trackdays a year) on semislicks
- I did nothing but service and new brakes (oem discs, project mu pads)
- he had some sensor changed (gave cel light), small thing, under warranty
- he had vanos changed, under warranty
- he's struggling with aftermarket brakes
- he will soon do change rod bearings as preventive (around 800eur at independent specialist)

Now when I bought a diesel daily drive I like M3 more than ISF, mainly due to its sportier engine. But as a DD and occassional sport ISF is easier to live with. Hope it helped

Adziu

Thanks for your input on this. Thats what some F owners had told me as well. The M is such a good looking car and has the fun it was designed and built for. But it doesn’t come with the reliability factor that people are hoping to get. I always laugh at the people who claim the ISF is a rice burner for its aesthetics that it has. But there’s a purpose for why it was designed the way it is. M3’s have that look that appeals to a lot of people that just make them want them. For me the angel eyes and the aggressive front end really gets me on the M as well as that exotic exhaust note since the S65 was designed from the S85 (E60 M5 and E63 M6). One thing I really do miss is driving manual because it gives you a better feel of the car as you shift through the gears. I drive automatic now but the IS250 just doesn’t do it for me.

Vitveet

Kolyan?????

V.

kolyan

Yes, still here. Forum mod told me to ignore your stupid ***, just following the rule !

no offense btw, i had a few IPAs ))