Could My Transmission Be Going Out Again?!?!?!
05-16-14, 05:30 PM
#1
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Could My Transmission Be Going Out Again?!?!?!
Hi ya'll...So I've been MIA for awhile. Life happens.
I just wanted to come back and share some stuff with you guys. This is a long read, so if you're interested, read along.
Roughly 36,000 miles ago, I was one of the first (maybe THE first) to have a transmission replaced in my IS F (I believe someone in Australia had his replaced but for another reason). I've been the original owner since Sept 17th, 2008 when it had 11 miles on it. Around 87,000 miles, the transmission died. I lost reverse gear as well as 7th and 8th gears. I was out of warranty.
After checking things over, Lexus said the transmission is done (obviously). Price tag of a new one, at the time, $12,000 plus installation and there was none to be found in the US. Yikes. After about 2 weeks, Lexus agreed to cover half the cost of a rebuilt transmission, but it still had to come from Japan. I would also pay 100% of the labor costs to install it. That's not bad, still saved me $2000 and in the end cost me $3800 with a new water pump and rear main seal installed (since the engine was already out of the car anyway)
Fast forward, roughly 18 months later, 36,000 miles on my rebuilt transmission, and this happens...
Part 1
It's a bit hard to see, but i'm doing about 30mph, DRIVE, Sport mode OFF, 3 bars oil temp, I take the RIGHT turn around 25-30mph, give it gas mid corner, CHECK ENGINE light comes on, Check VSC (Vehicle Stability Control) comes on, and the traction control light is on as well. This was the first time something like this happened where all all those lights came on, no engine power, car revs up and down, then when you come to a stop, the engine won't rev over 2000 RPMs.
This also happened once when I approached a freeway interchange, one of the loop ones, the car loss all engine power (dropped to idle) half way up, luckily no one behind me, and the car coasted to the top. I put the car back in park, then back in drive, and it drives away fine...W T H?!?
Here's what usually happens...
Again, 25-30mph, RIGHT turn, gas mid corner, engine revs to about 5000, then the tires chirp as they grab traction. But you'll notice, no warning lights come on at all this time.
BTW...notice how I wrote "RIGHT" both times capitalized...this ONLY happens in right turns. Left turns are fine.
What could be wrong? I'll leave it up for discussion and I'll check back later with you guys.
I just wanted to come back and share some stuff with you guys. This is a long read, so if you're interested, read along.
Roughly 36,000 miles ago, I was one of the first (maybe THE first) to have a transmission replaced in my IS F (I believe someone in Australia had his replaced but for another reason). I've been the original owner since Sept 17th, 2008 when it had 11 miles on it. Around 87,000 miles, the transmission died. I lost reverse gear as well as 7th and 8th gears. I was out of warranty.
After checking things over, Lexus said the transmission is done (obviously). Price tag of a new one, at the time, $12,000 plus installation and there was none to be found in the US. Yikes. After about 2 weeks, Lexus agreed to cover half the cost of a rebuilt transmission, but it still had to come from Japan. I would also pay 100% of the labor costs to install it. That's not bad, still saved me $2000 and in the end cost me $3800 with a new water pump and rear main seal installed (since the engine was already out of the car anyway)
Fast forward, roughly 18 months later, 36,000 miles on my rebuilt transmission, and this happens...
Part 1
It's a bit hard to see, but i'm doing about 30mph, DRIVE, Sport mode OFF, 3 bars oil temp, I take the RIGHT turn around 25-30mph, give it gas mid corner, CHECK ENGINE light comes on, Check VSC (Vehicle Stability Control) comes on, and the traction control light is on as well. This was the first time something like this happened where all all those lights came on, no engine power, car revs up and down, then when you come to a stop, the engine won't rev over 2000 RPMs.
This also happened once when I approached a freeway interchange, one of the loop ones, the car loss all engine power (dropped to idle) half way up, luckily no one behind me, and the car coasted to the top. I put the car back in park, then back in drive, and it drives away fine...W T H?!?
Here's what usually happens...
Again, 25-30mph, RIGHT turn, gas mid corner, engine revs to about 5000, then the tires chirp as they grab traction. But you'll notice, no warning lights come on at all this time.
BTW...notice how I wrote "RIGHT" both times capitalized...this ONLY happens in right turns. Left turns are fine.
What could be wrong? I'll leave it up for discussion and I'll check back later with you guys.
05-16-14, 06:34 PM
#3
It doesn't do this in a straight line at all? All the auto trans that I have ever seen go back would flare really bad between shifts or just lose gears all together.
I dont know if I'm making this up, but I swear I remember reading that the car has a yaw sensor that knows when you are turning and will keep the car in gear if you are in sport mode.
Or unless you ATF is low and when you are turning it is sloshing away from the return pump intake and the lines are gulping air. It happened to my '06 GTO after I hurriedly put aftermarket trans cooler on it and crossed the lines up...hard shifts and flares like crazy between shifts.
I dont know if I'm making this up, but I swear I remember reading that the car has a yaw sensor that knows when you are turning and will keep the car in gear if you are in sport mode.
Or unless you ATF is low and when you are turning it is sloshing away from the return pump intake and the lines are gulping air. It happened to my '06 GTO after I hurriedly put aftermarket trans cooler on it and crossed the lines up...hard shifts and flares like crazy between shifts.
05-16-14, 08:13 PM
#5
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05-16-14, 08:24 PM
#6
The same thing happened to me, and it was ATF low fluid, when cornering the pump picks up air (as MisterSKiz says)
It may be more serious but I had the car towed back to the dealer. The fluid fill is really difficult on these cars. In my case I had just had a transmission sensor replaced as it was leaking, and the dealer had left the fluid level low after servicing.
I would also get it up on a hoist and check for an fluid leak, as the time and mileage difference between the rebuild and this symptom is significant. I would have thought if they left the level low during the rebuild you would have noticed something before now.
In my case, I had no VSV or CEL lights - just high RPM without response....it also corrected itself after cornering when the pump could pick up the fluid pressure again.
Digger08
It may be more serious but I had the car towed back to the dealer. The fluid fill is really difficult on these cars. In my case I had just had a transmission sensor replaced as it was leaking, and the dealer had left the fluid level low after servicing.
I would also get it up on a hoist and check for an fluid leak, as the time and mileage difference between the rebuild and this symptom is significant. I would have thought if they left the level low during the rebuild you would have noticed something before now.
In my case, I had no VSV or CEL lights - just high RPM without response....it also corrected itself after cornering when the pump could pick up the fluid pressure again.
Digger08
05-16-14, 08:31 PM
#7
Lexus Fanatic
ISF that BS !!! I would have dumped that car a long time ago. Thats sucks bro. Sorry to hear about the drama. Move on buddy. Time to start looking for another car
Last edited by I8ABMR; 05-17-14 at 12:45 PM.
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05-17-14, 12:47 PM
#9
Lexus Fanatic
05-18-14, 12:43 AM
#10
Hey buddy, really sorry to hear you are having these issues again. I'm that guy from Australia who got his transmission replaced. I've since done a lot of track days, motorkhanas, mountain runs, etc. and the issue hasn't cropped up again. Unlike you, I lost everything except first gear. But it exhibited the same behavior, check engine and check VSC came on, and the engine wouldn't rev past 2,000 rpm.
As mentioned, these transmissions have been known to be really reliable. The probability of having 2 fail in a row is quite low. Could it be that the install wasn't done correctly, or there is another underlying problem?
As mentioned, these transmissions have been known to be really reliable. The probability of having 2 fail in a row is quite low. Could it be that the install wasn't done correctly, or there is another underlying problem?
05-19-14, 07:35 PM
#11
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
So just to continue on with the discussion, what some of you have mentioned is exactly right. The transmission was low on ATF. I replaced the radiator myself a couple weeks ago because it exploded on me, and the transmission has lines that go to the radiator. I saved what came out, and filled it with fresh Toyota WS fluid + a little more. Well...that wasn't enough.
The code that finally came up was P2714, which is said in the Lexus Service Manual as "Pressure Control Solenoid "D" Performance".
About a week before this I took the car to the dealer and left it there overnight as they checked what was wrong because I brought it in for all the problems I mentioned before (minus the CEL + CHECK VSC lights). At the time, they said that the fluid was clean and that the amount of fluid was correct. However, this time around, they said there wasn't enough. I read the instructions on how to change the fluid and I suppose it's a complicated process as it wants you to do it at very specific temperatures.
In the end, not sure how many hours the tech actually worked on the car, but they gave me a loaner car for a day and kept my car over night and they did this twice and in the end they only charged me $140 to fix it.
For the first time in my life, I'm actually happy with the service I received from a dealership.
The code that finally came up was P2714, which is said in the Lexus Service Manual as "Pressure Control Solenoid "D" Performance".
About a week before this I took the car to the dealer and left it there overnight as they checked what was wrong because I brought it in for all the problems I mentioned before (minus the CEL + CHECK VSC lights). At the time, they said that the fluid was clean and that the amount of fluid was correct. However, this time around, they said there wasn't enough. I read the instructions on how to change the fluid and I suppose it's a complicated process as it wants you to do it at very specific temperatures.
In the end, not sure how many hours the tech actually worked on the car, but they gave me a loaner car for a day and kept my car over night and they did this twice and in the end they only charged me $140 to fix it.
For the first time in my life, I'm actually happy with the service I received from a dealership.
05-19-14, 08:06 PM
#14
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Your owners manual says to never replace the fluid. I talked to a number of dealers back in the day when I was around 80k miles asking "when should I replace the fluid" and most dealers say you should do it at 100k miles. It's an expensive service because they can't drain all the fluid out. They pretty much run the car and drain the fluid while pumping fluid in until the fluid comes out "cleaner" but it will never be brand new fluid. Just a mix of old and new.
When I had my car there the first time, I asked to have a tech do a ride along with me, he drove the car and found nothing wrong. Of course we were just cruising, no 25 mph turns like what I was doing before. I told him my story about how I had the transmission replaced at 87k miles. He told me that if it was his car, he would replace the fluid every 30-50k miles at most, but the service consultants recommend 100k miles. Lexus owners manual says to never replace...hmmm..
When I had my car there the first time, I asked to have a tech do a ride along with me, he drove the car and found nothing wrong. Of course we were just cruising, no 25 mph turns like what I was doing before. I told him my story about how I had the transmission replaced at 87k miles. He told me that if it was his car, he would replace the fluid every 30-50k miles at most, but the service consultants recommend 100k miles. Lexus owners manual says to never replace...hmmm..
05-19-14, 08:24 PM
#15
Your owners manual says to never replace the fluid. I talked to a number of dealers back in the day when I was around 80k miles asking "when should I replace the fluid" and most dealers say you should do it at 100k miles. It's an expensive service because they can't drain all the fluid out. They pretty much run the car and drain the fluid while pumping fluid in until the fluid comes out "cleaner" but it will never be brand new fluid. Just a mix of old and new.
When I had my car there the first time, I asked to have a tech do a ride along with me, he drove the car and found nothing wrong. Of course we were just cruising, no 25 mph turns like what I was doing before. I told him my story about how I had the transmission replaced at 87k miles. He told me that if it was his car, he would replace the fluid every 30-50k miles at most, but the service consultants recommend 100k miles. Lexus owners manual says to never replace...hmmm..
When I had my car there the first time, I asked to have a tech do a ride along with me, he drove the car and found nothing wrong. Of course we were just cruising, no 25 mph turns like what I was doing before. I told him my story about how I had the transmission replaced at 87k miles. He told me that if it was his car, he would replace the fluid every 30-50k miles at most, but the service consultants recommend 100k miles. Lexus owners manual says to never replace...hmmm..
i wasted 6 cans of ATF on my race car
to get it nice
the oil is purple when i pulled it out
we kept pumping untill there the colour was the same as the bottle
though they are a sealed for life unit
i recomend changing everything 40-50K kms if you drive your ISF hard