Gt-R or Is-F?
01-01-09, 03:42 PM
#16
Lead Lap
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 599
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Like everyone said, it'd going to depend on what your looking for. Are you looking for ***** to the walls performance or luxury with a little kick? The GTR, like said, is all out performance while the F has some but maintains the luxury aspect of being, well, a Lexus. Would you give up your F for the GTR or would you keep them both?
I'm personally going to wait a few years, enjoy the F, and then consider the 2010 GTR Spec-V
I'm personally going to wait a few years, enjoy the F, and then consider the 2010 GTR Spec-V
Colin.
01-01-09, 05:11 PM
#17
i think i'm the same as above. right now, this is by far the most expensive thing (shy of my house) that i have ever purchased. that said, the F is one hell of a car for the money. no way i would consider a vette or a GT-R a daily driver... and i plan to use the IS-F for just that - a daily driver....
as for the above "the IS-F's suspension is too firm" WOWOWOWOWOW!!!
what do you think the GT-R's suspension is like? SOFT and SUBTLE? HAHA!
(btw, i think the IS-F sounds/rides better on rippled pavement than my 2007 TL-S)
I think the cars serve two very different groups... should I ever own a GT-R, it would definately NOT be a daily driver.. more like a weekend fun car.
as for the above "the IS-F's suspension is too firm" WOWOWOWOWOW!!!
what do you think the GT-R's suspension is like? SOFT and SUBTLE? HAHA!
(btw, i think the IS-F sounds/rides better on rippled pavement than my 2007 TL-S)
I think the cars serve two very different groups... should I ever own a GT-R, it would definately NOT be a daily driver.. more like a weekend fun car.
01-02-09, 01:40 AM
#18
Lexus Test Driver
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,534
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's funny... I'm also in the same boat as above. My wishful thinking is that in a few years, if things go very well, I might want to upgrade to a GT-R, but definitely as a weekend car only. However, I think timeToy made a good point about Nissan dealers being a bit shady, and I think that extends beyond just the sales and onto the service dept as well. The bottom line is that they are simply not equipped to deal with the clientele associated with the GT-R.
Back when I had my Z, it was modified, and I brought it into service. The service guy takes it and drives it to the back lot. As I walked out, I realized that I forgot something in the car, so I decided to stroll into the back lot. Lo and behold, there were no less than 4 guys surrounding my car with the hood up, checking out my car from top to bottom. I smiled and didn't say anything to confront them, and I didn't think it was a huge deal, but it just seemed a bit unprofessional to me. I'm not saying that this only goes on at Nissan, but that was my experience.
Back when I had my Z, it was modified, and I brought it into service. The service guy takes it and drives it to the back lot. As I walked out, I realized that I forgot something in the car, so I decided to stroll into the back lot. Lo and behold, there were no less than 4 guys surrounding my car with the hood up, checking out my car from top to bottom. I smiled and didn't say anything to confront them, and I didn't think it was a huge deal, but it just seemed a bit unprofessional to me. I'm not saying that this only goes on at Nissan, but that was my experience.
01-02-09, 08:18 AM
#19
Pole Position
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 295
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Personally I wouldnt get a vspec at 100k +. It may be lighter, have more carbon fiber and a overboost function but to me is not worth the extra money unless you want to have a special model. A regular GTR can be upgraded to perform probably better than it.
01-02-09, 12:50 PM
#20
Driver
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 197
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
kickhard, are you saying the ISF is more comfortable than the GTR?
For my part, I agree that ISF and GTR are not in the same ball park, like comparing a 335i to an F. I yet have to see a GTR but so far I have not been impressed by the look. It's REALLY too bad the GTR does not look as good as a Porsche.
As for performance, the GTR is obviously way more optimized than the F: small engine w/twin turbos versus a big V8 that's not even producing 100 HP per liter. It's obvious that very complex thing may have reliability issues the F may never experience. So as an every day car you want to put a lot of miles on it I am not sure that would be the wisest choice.
If I wanted a 500HP+ car I would skip the GTR and look at a Z06 or ZR1. Even though the GTR is said to compete with the Porsche Turbo, to me it's kind of an "in between" car, faster than the F but no quite yet as fast as it should. In other words when you have a F there might be 50 cars faster than you, when you have a GTR there will still be 45 cars faster than you. However, with a ZR1 there might only 5 cars faster so it's a better investment for those who care exclusively about performance (that's what we are talking about here, performance, and not luxury).
My 2 cents.
For my part, I agree that ISF and GTR are not in the same ball park, like comparing a 335i to an F. I yet have to see a GTR but so far I have not been impressed by the look. It's REALLY too bad the GTR does not look as good as a Porsche.
As for performance, the GTR is obviously way more optimized than the F: small engine w/twin turbos versus a big V8 that's not even producing 100 HP per liter. It's obvious that very complex thing may have reliability issues the F may never experience. So as an every day car you want to put a lot of miles on it I am not sure that would be the wisest choice.
If I wanted a 500HP+ car I would skip the GTR and look at a Z06 or ZR1. Even though the GTR is said to compete with the Porsche Turbo, to me it's kind of an "in between" car, faster than the F but no quite yet as fast as it should. In other words when you have a F there might be 50 cars faster than you, when you have a GTR there will still be 45 cars faster than you. However, with a ZR1 there might only 5 cars faster so it's a better investment for those who care exclusively about performance (that's what we are talking about here, performance, and not luxury).
My 2 cents.
01-02-09, 01:02 PM
#22
Driver
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You are somewhat mistaken. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordsch...test_lap_times
IS-F, great car. But, the GTR and the ZR-1 are so damn close. Not sure exactly why you think the ZR-1 is so much faster and track oriented than the GT-R.
The IS-F is slower. And, I have driven both, and I think the F is stiffer. I believe the GT-R has an adjustable suspension. I sometimes wish the F did as well. I could always go JIC or TEIN to get adjustability and a softer everyday ride for when I have the family with me.
But, I would trade my F for a GT-R in a heartbeat.
IS-F, great car. But, the GTR and the ZR-1 are so damn close. Not sure exactly why you think the ZR-1 is so much faster and track oriented than the GT-R.
The IS-F is slower. And, I have driven both, and I think the F is stiffer. I believe the GT-R has an adjustable suspension. I sometimes wish the F did as well. I could always go JIC or TEIN to get adjustability and a softer everyday ride for when I have the family with me.
But, I would trade my F for a GT-R in a heartbeat.
01-02-09, 01:44 PM
#23
Driver
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 197
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You are somewhat mistaken. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordsch...test_lap_times
IS-F, great car. But, the GTR and the ZR-1 are so damn close. Not sure exactly why you think the ZR-1 is so much faster and track oriented than the GT-R.
The IS-F is slower. And, I have driven both, and I think the F is stiffer. I believe the GT-R has an adjustable suspension. I sometimes wish the F did as well. I could always go JIC or TEIN to get adjustability and a softer everyday ride for when I have the family with me.
But, I would trade my F for a GT-R in a heartbeat.
IS-F, great car. But, the GTR and the ZR-1 are so damn close. Not sure exactly why you think the ZR-1 is so much faster and track oriented than the GT-R.
The IS-F is slower. And, I have driven both, and I think the F is stiffer. I believe the GT-R has an adjustable suspension. I sometimes wish the F did as well. I could always go JIC or TEIN to get adjustability and a softer everyday ride for when I have the family with me.
But, I would trade my F for a GT-R in a heartbeat.
But that was not really my point, if I wanted to spend 80K-100K for a sports car in the 500HP ballpark, I would not necessarily "automatically" pick the GTR. If its look was better, perhaps, since I pay a lot of attention to design. But, who knows, I might be driving one in 1-2 years...
The "Nordschleife_fastest_lap_times" table is certainly puzzling, it puts the 2009 GTR up in the stratosphere well ahead of the Z06, 911 Turbo, Ferraris and Lambos...
01-02-09, 03:08 PM
#24
Tech Info Resource
iTrader: (2)
The GTR vs. the IS-F? Not even a fair comparison. Different design objectives, different build philosophies, completely different execution. Do I personally want a GTR? No, I have a Supra that I can build to easily outrun a GTR if I want to do that, and I won't ever have to be concerned about the gearbox being an issue. IMHO, Nissan made some compromises I wouldn't want to live with, especially in the gearbox. Will most GTR owners have issues? Probably not. Will some? For sure.
As has been said previously, if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. Same with the IS=F, and even the same with the Supra. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less than any of these cars, and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. If you need four seats for four adults, then the F is a great choice. So is the AMG C63, and so is the M3 sedan. Each has it's pluses and minuses, you just have to decide for yourself what is really most important.
As has been said previously, if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. Same with the IS=F, and even the same with the Supra. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less than any of these cars, and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. If you need four seats for four adults, then the F is a great choice. So is the AMG C63, and so is the M3 sedan. Each has it's pluses and minuses, you just have to decide for yourself what is really most important.
01-02-09, 04:57 PM
#25
Pole Position
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 295
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes of course the ISF is more comfortable. Its suspension is a bit softer but the GTR is comfortable also but it is of course more performance oriented. The seats in the GTR I think are better though. ISF is not as loud in the cabin either. The GTR can and has been a DD for alot of people so its reliability has been proven so far with some at 15000 miles already.
The GTR looks much better in person. Pics really dont do it justice.
I dont get your fast as it should thing. Name any cars that are faster than the GTR at its price point? Only 1 I can think of and its the ZO6. Name any cars that are faster than the GTR period? And you might be able to come up with 25 and most are exotics. The ZR1 is a beast also but to most is going to be seen as just another vette unless you are a car person. The ZO6 is probably the best bang right now and is a fine car
LOL a car as an investment? Maybe the ZR1 now only because its production is under threat(even the GTR is). A lot of performance cars are under the ax or have been axed(NSX, LFA). We might be going through another muscle car ression.
The GTR looks much better in person. Pics really dont do it justice.
I dont get your fast as it should thing. Name any cars that are faster than the GTR at its price point? Only 1 I can think of and its the ZO6. Name any cars that are faster than the GTR period? And you might be able to come up with 25 and most are exotics. The ZR1 is a beast also but to most is going to be seen as just another vette unless you are a car person. The ZO6 is probably the best bang right now and is a fine car
LOL a car as an investment? Maybe the ZR1 now only because its production is under threat(even the GTR is). A lot of performance cars are under the ax or have been axed(NSX, LFA). We might be going through another muscle car ression.
kickhard, are you saying the ISF is more comfortable than the GTR?
For my part, I agree that ISF and GTR are not in the same ball park, like comparing a 335i to an F. I yet have to see a GTR but so far I have not been impressed by the look. It's REALLY too bad the GTR does not look as good as a Porsche.
As for performance, the GTR is obviously way more optimized than the F: small engine w/twin turbos versus a big V8 that's not even producing 100 HP per liter. It's obvious that very complex thing may have reliability issues the F may never experience. So as an every day car you want to put a lot of miles on it I am not sure that would be the wisest choice.
If I wanted a 500HP+ car I would skip the GTR and look at a Z06 or ZR1. Even though the GTR is said to compete with the Porsche Turbo, to me it's kind of an "in between" car, faster than the F but no quite yet as fast as it should. In other words when you have a F there might be 50 cars faster than you, when you have a GTR there will still be 45 cars faster than you. However, with a ZR1 there might only 5 cars faster so it's a better investment for those who care exclusively about performance (that's what we are talking about here, performance, and not luxury).
My 2 cents.
For my part, I agree that ISF and GTR are not in the same ball park, like comparing a 335i to an F. I yet have to see a GTR but so far I have not been impressed by the look. It's REALLY too bad the GTR does not look as good as a Porsche.
As for performance, the GTR is obviously way more optimized than the F: small engine w/twin turbos versus a big V8 that's not even producing 100 HP per liter. It's obvious that very complex thing may have reliability issues the F may never experience. So as an every day car you want to put a lot of miles on it I am not sure that would be the wisest choice.
If I wanted a 500HP+ car I would skip the GTR and look at a Z06 or ZR1. Even though the GTR is said to compete with the Porsche Turbo, to me it's kind of an "in between" car, faster than the F but no quite yet as fast as it should. In other words when you have a F there might be 50 cars faster than you, when you have a GTR there will still be 45 cars faster than you. However, with a ZR1 there might only 5 cars faster so it's a better investment for those who care exclusively about performance (that's what we are talking about here, performance, and not luxury).
My 2 cents.
01-02-09, 05:23 PM
#26
The GTR vs. the IS-F? Not even a fair comparison. Different design objectives, different build philosophies, completely different execution. Do I personally want a GTR? No, I have a Supra that I can build to easily outrun a GTR if I want to do that, and I won't ever have to be concerned about the gearbox being an issue. IMHO, Nissan made some compromises I wouldn't want to live with, especially in the gearbox. Will most GTR owners have issues? Probably not. Will some? For sure.
As has been said previously, if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. Same with the IS=F, and even the same with the Supra. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less than any of these cars, and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. If you need four seats for four adults, then the F is a great choice. So is the AMG C63, and so is the M3 sedan. Each has it's pluses and minuses, you just have to decide for yourself what is really most important.
As has been said previously, if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. Same with the IS=F, and even the same with the Supra. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less than any of these cars, and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. If you need four seats for four adults, then the F is a great choice. So is the AMG C63, and so is the M3 sedan. Each has it's pluses and minuses, you just have to decide for yourself what is really most important.
01-02-09, 06:37 PM
#27
Rookie
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: ca
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was very dissapointed when I learned about nissan policy regarding LC. Personally I do consider this a cheating from nissan. Every magazine used LC to get better times than 911turbo, z06, etc. It was mentioned here that using LC on all-wheel drive car is very stressful for trans and Lexus would not allow this either. This is very right however I am not aware about any other car that would have a build in feature just to get impressive numbers from reviews while customers could not use it unless they are ready to have the warranty to be void.
01-02-09, 07:18 PM
#28
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: TX
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was very dissapointed when I learned about nissan policy regarding LC. Personally I do consider this a cheating from nissan. Every magazine used LC to get better times than 911turbo, z06, etc. It was mentioned here that using LC on all-wheel drive car is very stressful for trans and Lexus would not allow this either. This is very right however I am not aware about any other car that would have a build in feature just to get impressive numbers from reviews while customers could not use it unless they are ready to have the warranty to be void.
IMHO, the viper and the Corvette are not even in the same league. These are crude and dull instruments compared to the razor sharp surgical tool that is the GT-R. The GT-R is heavier than these cars. So what, it handles better. It is better put together. It has great fit and finish and it is made with a passion and attention to detail that is amazing even for a Japanese car. To learn more about the legend and its history and making, I invite you to visit this site. I promise that your time will not be wasted and you will come away better informed and greatly respecting one of the greatest, if not the greatest, automobiles ever to come out of the land of the rising sun.
http://www.gtrnissan.com/index.html##
01-02-09, 07:28 PM
#29
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: TX
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do I personally want a GTR? No, I have a Supra that I can build to easily outrun a GTR if I want to do that, and I won't ever have to be concerned about the gearbox being an issue. IMHO, Nissan made some compromises I wouldn't want to live with, especially in the gearbox. Will most GTR owners have issues? Probably not. Will some? For sure.
if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. .
if I were in the market for a two seater and money was capped at $100k, I'd be looking at a Z-06 or hoping for a Viper ACR on sale. Both have psychotic potential, and both are really incredible right off the showroom floor. Both have their own issues, but the resources available to deal with those issues are, IMHO, greater than the GTR.
Had Nissan built a lighter car, I'd like it a lot more. The Corvette and the Viper both weigh quite a bit less and when it gets down to brass tacks, light weight is your friend and mechanical complexity is not.
If you want the GTR because it's badass on paper and don't plan to abuse the car, you'll probably have made a great choice. If you want it because you plan to flog it, don't expect to operate with a small budget. .
01-02-09, 07:30 PM
#30
Driver
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gtr is nice but the interior looks like garbage (in my opinion), that was the deciding factor for me, also it's a Nissan (so forget about reliability ....http://www.nissantireproblems.com/class-action.html) The ISF has some ***** but most importantly it's a LEXUS, and it comes with all the remarkable things that LEXUS stand behind. But as Loxboxracer said... it's like comparing apples to oranges they were both designed for different tasks.
I'm happy with the ISF, mines still brand new at 000300kms, today I heared this crazy roar as I was speeding in third gear, never heard it before..crazy!
I'm happy with the ISF, mines still brand new at 000300kms, today I heared this crazy roar as I was speeding in third gear, never heard it before..crazy!
Last edited by dana_daen; 01-02-09 at 07:34 PM.