I hate, and yes that's a strong word, but I hate people like you. (OP)

You clearly have ZERO common sense, they should just take your car back and never allow you to buy a Lexus again. That's how STUPID you sound.

Brake dust? really? All IS' have this issue, LIVE WITH IT!
A button? I'm speechless for this.
A scratch after MONTHS of owning the car?! Should they provide you with a full detail as well to make the car look like new again....

WOW, simply WOW!!

GeorgeR please exit this thread. You can disagree politely without the aggressive name calling.

I'm just sharing my personal experience and how I felt afterwards and I'm ok if you don't agree with my assessment but personal attacks are unwarranted.

This is my first car purchase in 13 years and I have to say it seems I assumed wrong that I could bring these issues during my 6mo checkup and assumed that dealer would trust the owner to tell the truth (to his best knowledge) and address these minor issues without any hesitations. As mentioned brake pads were more of a concern and I was hoping dealer would offer an exchange but that is not my main complaint.

Below are some pictures as people have asked for.

Picture of left side of steering wheel button height I consider normal
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5561/...1f4a9e55_b.jpg

Picture of right side of steering wheel buttons where ACC button is sunk in lower then button above making it hard to press.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5563/...cf0f1e67_b.jpg

Picture of steering wheel scratch from normal driver view. Yeah I know you don't see it. That's the point. While I agree that some people's question of how do I know I didn't cause it is good question, all I can say is to have some event that would cause the plastic trim to be scratched would be something I would definitely notice and I would tell the truth if that was the case and not ask for repair. Fact is nothing like that happened. I'm not sure what type of predelivery inspection dealer does but how can they say for sure this wasn't there or it didn't happen when they took the steering wheel off and installed my fog light stalk?
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3893/...33ce3cf3_b.jpg

Picture of the scratch when zoomed in.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5588/...b9f8872f_b.jpg

SW13GS,

You are making a lot of assumptions and stating things which are not correct. I never disrespected anyone at the dealership. I gave them my list of concerns/issues and waited 1 hour 45 minutes (even though they told me it would be 1 hour wait) for them to get back to me in their waiting room. When I went to check to see if my car was done service manager asked me to show him to scratch because he couldn't find it. I showed him and he told me he would have to check with sales manager and get back to me so I went back to work. When he called next day and told me that they wouldn't do anything is when I contacted Lexus customer service.

I appreciate you contributing to the thread but please do not portray me to be something I wasn't.

I mean...I see what you mean about the button but I wouldn't bother to do anything about that.

You have to see the dealers position about the scratch. You say why shouldn't they believe you, but why should they believe you? You also never addressed my hypothetical question about the door ding. If someone came up to you and said you dinged their door 3 months ago and they never got around to telling you...but could offer no proof...would you fix their door? Bear in mind this is a stranger...not a friend. Be honest.

As for the promised hour being an hour and 45 minutes...have you ever been to a dealership before? Ever been to a doctors office? I have literally never waited in a car at any dealership or mechanic that was ready when they said it would be lol.

You need to adjust your expectations

My common sense and logical thinking is sound thank you!

I'm heart broken that you don't love me! I'm sure I'll be devastated for years to come...

Before the photos, I thought you were being unreasonable with the complaints... After the pics, I'm certain of it.

I'm curious about one thing, in your estimation, were does the dealers responsibility end and yours begin? Apparently, half a year isn't enough, so at what point is the dealer within their right to refuse service for a scratch that was not noticed at the time of purchase? a year? 5 years? Indefinitely?

I see good point and perspective from others in this thread.

Why should dealer believe me?
I guess this is more of hope that we could start a relationship with trust between us. Why should I believe the dealer when they tell me my car has this issue or that? Trust goes both ways. I never ever imagined that Lexus dealers would have hard time trusting their customers base considering who (I'm making some stereo typing here so for give me if not all buyers fit) buys their cars.

Your situation with door ding is completely different because that is not in a controlled area of the car where only you as driver have access to and anything could happen even when you are not present. Also door dings are easily observed when checking the car so I would think both dealer and customer could easily see it when picking up the car.

As for extra 45 min wait, sure that could happen but I would think service rep would tell you at 1 hour promised time or little before that things will go little longer, perhaps even offer a loaner or ride back to work if I needed to get back. Just a thought...

Is that because you think the scratch is not major enough? Assuming we agree that defect came with the car I would assume Lexus/Dealer repair/replace the part for the duration of bumper to bumper warranty.

We aren't agreeing that it came with the car at all. You didn't even notice it until recently, and we've already established cases where things can get damaged without your knowledge despite your assertion to the contrary. But that isn't what I'm asking. Again, at what point does your responsibility begin? How long after your driving the car away should the dealer be responsible for scratches you "didn't notice"?

It's a very simple question, not sure why you're avoiding it.

Since if the scratch came with the car is important in this matter it would be unreasonable to answer your questions without that info.

I have no expectation for them to repair/replace scratches that would be caused by me. But I can say with 100% certainty that scratch on the steering wheel trim didn't come from me or my wife who are the only two drivers in our home.

No, you cannot. You don't know that it came with the car. You can't prove that it came with the car, you didn't even notice it when you got the car, so therefore, it is impossible to be 100% certain.

That, by it's very inference, means you cannot be 100% certain unless you have never even sat in the car since taking delivery, which we know isn't the case

The dealer is right, you're wrong. Did you get excellent service? No, did you get bad service? Absolutely not. Them addressing your complaints would be going above and beyond what they should be doing and it sets a bad precedence for them when it comes to customers like you.

There's a reason why no one here is agreeing with you, and it's not because we all work for Lexus.

By the way if that was one of the button I seldom used perhaps I probably wouldn't care but that is the button I press the most because default is to be at longest radar distance and I like it shortest distance and to get to the shortest I have to press it 3 times everything I start the car. If Lexus had a personalization setting for that I wouldn't even need to press that button at all. ;)

Any event that would cause plastic trim to be scratched would be definitely known by the driver. It would require some hard object to hit that part of the trim in particular angle to scratch but not dent. I or my wife would definitely know if that event happened.

How does dealer 100% be certain that that didn't come with the car or they caused the issue when they took my steering wheel off to install the LED fog lights and stalk?

I think most people are disagreeing because they think I'm making big deal out of minor issue but my complaint is more about dealer making an assumption and treating me like I'm lying about the scratch when in fact they can't say for sure it wasn't there when I got the car.

This is where your maning up to your own responsibilities comes in. If it came with the car, it should have been reported when you took delivery. You have an exceptionally high sense of entitlement and seemingly no sense of responsibility it seems. It's your car, it's you throwing the accusations around, its you that has the burden. Period.

I don't want to keep repeating after myself but I assumed minor issues like this could be addressed at upcoming 6mo checkup. Why not? It doesn't impact any feature or drivability of the car. Also as you saw in the photo that minor scratch is very hard to see. Are you even reading my posts?

Look, the bottom line is this. If you are going to claim someone damaged your car you need to bring it to their attention as soon as it happens. Ever valet parked a car? Ever read the little claim ticket? It says any damage claim has to be made before you drive away with the car, it's just reasonable, it's just common sense. Had you showed it to the dealer before you took delivery, or right after, it would be different. But, you waited several months and now it's too late. You're just going to have to deal with that.

Why not? Because after this length of time there's no way to prove that the damage was there originally. People try and get away with stuff like this all the time, the dealer is not going to replace an entire steering wheel for some admittedly nearly invisible mark when you've owned the vehicle for several months and are just as likely to have caused the damage yourself.

I'm not sure why you're repeating yourself either since what you said changes nothing and has already been addressed.

Perhaps you are right but even then I don't think I saw this after 2 or 3 months after I got the car. By that time I probably only had 1500 miles on it and who's to say they wouldn't have said the same thing.

You analogy with valet is different and yes I would say that is common sense because valet is only in your car for 1 specific instance and that would be only time you could prove it. To say that owner has to find all defects within first week or first month seems unreasonable especially they have these 6mo checkups for things like this.

I'm moving on and will use another dealer in town.

Thank you.

Not to beat a dead horse, but you'll just be disappointed with two dealers instead of one.

If you find a dealer that's going to cover scratches for the duration of the warranty so long as you didn't notice them and cross your heart that it wasn't you that caused it, please to let us know which dealer that is.

Ramon, Thanks for your posts! You may be right also but let's see how they treat me as person. Another owner IM'd me and told me service quality can vary and be inconsistent among dealers.

They would have said the same thing. They don't cover cosmetic issues...and once you've had possession of the car for 2 or 3 months and 1500 miles...theres no way to prove that they caused the issue and you did not. If you're going to blame cosmetic damage to the car on the dealer that sold you the car, you need to bring it to their attention when you take delivery, or maybe the next day. After that you're on your own.

Its no different. The 6 month checkups are for scheduled maintenance, cosmetic issues are not covered under the warranty.

No dealer would have handled this any differently.

After watching the pics I get what you mean . If you are having problems with the button try explaining to the dealership the situation ( check new cars in the dealership before going to the service to make sure a problem exists only in your car ) .

I also agree with you about the dealer treating you as a liar which is not a good way to go , but don't expect them to replace your break pad either since break dust is just normal ( if they replaced it then it is very excellent service , and if not then you cannot hold any thing against them since break pads are already used and there is nothing on the warranty rules about replacing it ).

Finally I read some of the comments and they seem to be harsh and disrespectful to be honest and this is unfortunate since they are coming from clublexus members .

+ 1 on this one. Thumbs up!
I do believe that OP was not unreasonable and belligerent. OP brought up some concerns with the subject dealer even though they seem to be small issues, some perhaps were unwarrantable. I am not saying that the dealer should have fixed all three issues but doing so would mean in fact excellent customer service. One example, when I owned Audi A6 I had a small tear on the door panel (in fact I caused the issue) I brought to my dealer's attention. They without any questions asked replaced the entire door panel with new leather and genuine wood on it. I am assuming it was a pricy part. Did they have to do that? Hell no, but they did and I was extremely satisfied so I gave the best reviews to that dealer.

As for other members attacking OP - please don't forget not everyone here are fellow 3IS owners but many work for Lexus dealers.

This is Lexus people, if the problem was yours instead of SonyHome's, you too would want exceptional service, big or small. If we wanted mediocre service, we would've settled for a non luxury brand. Ask yourselves why did you pay the premium for your car?

I would not expect the dealer to repair cosmetic damage that happened when I bought the car 6 months ago.

Paying a premium for a luxury car doesn't mean that the dealer owes me any sort of unreasonable service. That request is the one I take issue with.

Just stop with the paranoia crap. Nobody here works for dealers or are plants from dealers.

6 month is a long time to complain about issues to a dealer, but obviously the real issue is that people have different definitions of what's reasonable. Different dealers and different service reps will react differently to situations like this. If they have any business sense, a small fix for a customer can go a long way. Customer is always right. Piss off a customer, you may lose a customer for life.

[QUOTE=salvadorik;8635523please don't forget not everyone here are fellow 3IS owners but many work for Lexus dealers.[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure if you're joking or didn't clearly think about what you just said before posting. Are you telling me if we take a poll asking

1) Do you own a 3IS
2) Do you work for Lexus

That more Lexus employees than 3IS owners?

Nobody is saying here that OP was unequivocally entitled to the service that he requested. Yes the dealer justified their position very clearly and yes we all know that dealers are in the business of making money. But agreeing to fix those three issues would not have been the end of the world for the dealer. In fact they would have demonstrated that they are willing to go extra mile to keep the customers happy. Let me tell you something. I am a CPA myself and I deal with a variety of customers. I have some easy going clients and of course some clients that require very special treatment. Quite a few of them are not willing to pay the taxes at all! Rather frequently I just charge only enough to cover my overhead and sometimes completely write it off. So I believe that keeping clients happy is the key in providing service. Lexus can and should do the same. Dealers know how to charge tons of money for simple services. Sometimes there are those customers where losing little money will further bolster your reputation that inevitably results in more customer retention and even switching from competitors. The bottom line is I am not very impressed with Lexus. It is a good brand but so far I have not seen or experienced the type of the service that is known for. And please keep your personal attacks for yourself we want to see more discussions that are subject centered.

Having a dealership remove your steering wheel to install an accessory is risky. Your scratch likely happened at that time, but it appears that many of the interior surfaces of the IS are fragile...especially the dash. I would recommend that you attempt to use a non-abrasive car polish on the scratch. If you search the IS thread, note that there are several posts for steering wheel damage due to rings and other items.

I also detail my cars prior to service visits and ask the SA to inspect the car for damage. I also wait at the dealership while having service performed. The local BMW dealership has a glass wall where you can watch as your car is serviced, and I miss that arrangement at my local Lexus dealership. BMW technicians are for the most part highly compensated for their knowledge. It's interesting that the Lexus dealership has mechanic openings advertised paying 13 - 17 bucks an hour and will train the right person. A thorough walk around is completed prior to driving away from the dealership. I have experienced damage during service visits but will immediately point out the damage. With that said, sometimes no repair is requested, as the more they mess with your car, the more cosmetic damage will result.

Brake dust is minimal compared to BMW. I really enjoy not having a heavy, and I do mean to the extreme, brake dust on my IS. Brake dust is normal for BMW and Audi.

After reading your button alignment issue, I checked my IS and 2013 ES buttons. One of my buttons is more recessed than the others, and the ES buttons are not perfectly aligned. They look okay and function perfectly. If your ACC button is functioning properly, you will run into the scenario of fix a thing, break a thing, if the dealership attempts a repair.

The great thing about buying a new car is the warranty, new car smell and knowing the history of your car. You mentioned that it's been 13 years since you purchased your last new car. I can understand why you want everything to be perfect and perhaps the reason for your anger is the dealership making you feel like a liar.

Perhaps there is a third option - you misinterpreted me. My post did not imply any number comparison neither did it refer to the fact that majority members here represent Lexus. I was simply replying to the CL member that it should not be surprising to see that the attacks addressed to the OP were coming from Lexus dealer employees. It just appeared to me that the attacks were very aggressive and they generally come from people who take the underlying issues personally. This is just my opinion.

You said there are not many 3IS owners but many Lexus employees around here. That to me suggests you're saying one is greater than the other. Specifically more Lexus employees than 3IS owners in the forum. The third option appears to be that you didn't say what you think you said.

Someone either is or is not an employee. The pretense that the replies are from Lexus employees is not a matter of opinion. Your accusation is either right or wrong. I won't presume to speak for everyone as you attempted to do so, but I will say that as far as I'm concerned, your accusation is wrong and without merit.

lol I am not sure what your objective is here. You are trying to undermine my credibility? Nobody accused here anybody, period. You completely misinterpreted me. Dude, lets get back to the topic and stop personal attacks. We are here to discuss the car related issues and we want unbiased and honest discussions, period.

Never take your car to the dealership.

This is a public forum, if you don't like to be criticized then don't post anything on public forums.

Being nitpicky and posting your misadventures on a public forum? Flame suit up! :D

lol, what personal attack? You make a bold and baseless statement towards members who have posted in this thread, which includes me, get challenged on it by myself and SW13GS then turn around and accuse both of us of personal attacks where there was none. I didn't undermine your credibility, you're doing that on your own. If you wanted to simply discuss car related issues, you'd have kept your initial comments to yourself, instead you decided to fuel a dying fire with the off-topic remark, and then play the victim.

You want to get back on topic an discuss cars and service, fine by me, lets do that. I'll start by saying I fully agree with what you said here:

It indeed would have been great customer service if the dealer had performed the repairs requested by the OP, a point I even eluded to earlier in this thread. However, that is not the same thing as "bad" customer service if they decide not to, given the circumstances.

Lets not forget, OP did not go to the dealer hoping to get lucky, he went with expectations. Expectations that extend to wanting the dealership to cover any scratches for the extent of the warranty period so long as he promises they weren't caused by himself. Let me put that in perspective. He expects to be able to walk into the dealer ship with 49,999 miles on the odo, and say "Hey Mr service manager, fix this scratch. I didn't notice it for nearly 50k miles, but I know it came with the car because I'd have known if something I did caused it"

Sometimes it pays to be assertive to get what you want, other times it pays to be humble to get what you want. This is a case where being humble may very well have went further with the dealership. Something OP may have recognized if he didn't drive up there with an unreasonable sense of entitlement.

Good, I am glad that we are making a progress here.

Actually his comment was clear . He said not every one is a fellow 3IS owner ( true ) , and many ( not the majority he said ) are working for the lexus dealers .

Guys lets keep this on issue resolution for the op and not continuing to pick at semantics please