Question for IS250 F Sport owners!
08-08-13, 04:41 PM
#16
The pursuit of F
Right guys, heres something to spice it up a little. The car is definitely going to be an F Sport and my lady cant drive a manual, damn, she doesnt even know how paddles work so its useless for her.
The main problem is, that I have driven 2 different IS300h's. One on a track where i noticed no lag, and another on the road where lag was there. My RXh is instant, so this pissed me off pretty badly as i was expecting the same, especially after driving the ISh on a track prior to release. Is the lag affecting only some cars? or all?
I will also be driving the car in the winter months (wife keeps crashing rwd cars into walls in snow)
and depreciation isnt an issue and neither is the road tax. She wants a Lexus, says other cars cant match the refinement but also wants something fun to drive. The GS is too big, CT is not to her tastes and its too small for the family so IS250 would be ok then?
The main problem is, that I have driven 2 different IS300h's. One on a track where i noticed no lag, and another on the road where lag was there. My RXh is instant, so this pissed me off pretty badly as i was expecting the same, especially after driving the ISh on a track prior to release. Is the lag affecting only some cars? or all?
I will also be driving the car in the winter months (wife keeps crashing rwd cars into walls in snow)
and depreciation isnt an issue and neither is the road tax. She wants a Lexus, says other cars cant match the refinement but also wants something fun to drive. The GS is too big, CT is not to her tastes and its too small for the family so IS250 would be ok then?
Last edited by corradoMR2; 08-08-13 at 04:45 PM.
08-09-13, 06:45 AM
#17
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
08-09-13, 06:58 AM
#18
The lag is not there for saving fuel. It just that the HSD works like that. It takes a second to combine the power from the Atkinson engine and the electric motor via the planetary gear. You can't get rid of the lag from standstill and at slow speed in Sport mode + paddler. It has to wake up the petrol engine, combine the power and then take off.
Once you run out of battery power, which you do, after a few accelerations or if you have been in a stop and go traffic for a while, it relies on the 4 cylinder petrol engine only, before the battery charges up. The acceleration will be decreased before the battery has enough juice to boost the acceleration.
So yes, you will have to adapt to how it works to get most out of it.
Just curious, why did Lexus remove the B mode from IS300h and GS450h?
Once you run out of battery power, which you do, after a few accelerations or if you have been in a stop and go traffic for a while, it relies on the 4 cylinder petrol engine only, before the battery charges up. The acceleration will be decreased before the battery has enough juice to boost the acceleration.
So yes, you will have to adapt to how it works to get most out of it.
Just curious, why did Lexus remove the B mode from IS300h and GS450h?
yes you can... and yes you are wrong on all of those points :-).
Even in Prius you dont get left out of acceleration, and IS300h is a lot more powerful car.
I cant believe that someone would chose IS250 over IS300h... thats just not understandable.
08-09-13, 12:45 PM
#20
@Spwolf
You should go read about how HSD works before you denying it. The HSD in 300h is no different than others. And you should definitely test drive the 300h as well. I drive my 250 everyday and I feel the difference immediately when I drove the 300h. And its a heavy car too (heavier compares to 3gen 250, and more heavier than 2gen 250). It feels more under powered than 250.
About the decreased acceleration, of course it will still accelerate when battery is low and charging. But it will rely on the petrol engine only until the battery is charged. Which is slower than both combined.
@Ianp
did you ever test drive the 250 and tried to floor it in sport mode or toss it around on back roads and accelerate out from corners? You mentioned you last car was a Volvo S80. That car drives like a boat and is very thirsty, I understand that your are very happy about the 300h.
You should go read about how HSD works before you denying it. The HSD in 300h is no different than others. And you should definitely test drive the 300h as well. I drive my 250 everyday and I feel the difference immediately when I drove the 300h. And its a heavy car too (heavier compares to 3gen 250, and more heavier than 2gen 250). It feels more under powered than 250.
About the decreased acceleration, of course it will still accelerate when battery is low and charging. But it will rely on the petrol engine only until the battery is charged. Which is slower than both combined.
@Ianp
did you ever test drive the 250 and tried to floor it in sport mode or toss it around on back roads and accelerate out from corners? You mentioned you last car was a Volvo S80. That car drives like a boat and is very thirsty, I understand that your are very happy about the 300h.
Last edited by UpSideDown; 08-09-13 at 12:53 PM.
08-09-13, 03:18 PM
#21
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Too right
By the way, the S80 is a seriously underestimated car, especially pre-reg fully loaded as I had it. But you are right, I was on 30mpg (UK) while going around corners about half the speed I now do getting 55mpg!
By the way, the S80 is a seriously underestimated car, especially pre-reg fully loaded as I had it. But you are right, I was on 30mpg (UK) while going around corners about half the speed I now do getting 55mpg!
08-10-13, 05:33 AM
#23
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Well the IS250 is £3k cheaper? and feels more responsive (ill have to check this out properly though), and I can get a bigger discount on it than the 300h and it has 2 big exhausts at the back, and sounds awesome 
08-10-13, 05:44 AM
#24
The pursuit of F
Rayaans, as surely you know, the 3k initial savings will diminish from the double fuel costs of the 250.
For me, the "0.5 seconds" longer response time from the 300h is a non-issue and that's what I'd buy if it were available in N.America since I'm fine with this "lag" in my CT as it's well worth saving over 100$ in fuel costs per month, but after that initial lag, the CT surges very well and feels very torquey. It felt even more torquey (naturally) with the Camry hybrid I drove a few times which feels very similar to the 250's V6 once the power is engaged. It's comes down to initial response where in the majority of driving situations there's a slightly longer delay with the Lexus Hybrid Drive. But as you know, happy wife, happy life so if 0.5 seconds is a deal breaker, again, my vote for you is the 250.
Keep us posted on your impression of it if you go for the test drive.
08-10-13, 08:41 AM
#25
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Worth repeating also that the 250 is £20 more per month in road tax; plus it's much more expensive in business use taxes (e.g. only 85% reclaimable against tax versus 100%). Indeed, after road tax and rental reclaim, my 300h was *already* cheaper than the 250 even before fuel (and servicing) differential.
It's a classic case of people going too much on the actual price and too little on the actual overall cost-to-own.
That said, the differential isn't that marked for those buying privately over a relatively short period, and some people will just prefer the 250. Each to their own. But it pays to do *all* the sums!
It's a classic case of people going too much on the actual price and too little on the actual overall cost-to-own.
That said, the differential isn't that marked for those buying privately over a relatively short period, and some people will just prefer the 250. Each to their own. But it pays to do *all* the sums!
08-10-13, 06:02 PM
#26
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Worth repeating also that the 250 is £20 more per month in road tax; plus it's much more expensive in business use taxes (e.g. only 85% reclaimable against tax versus 100%). Indeed, after road tax and rental reclaim, my 300h was *already* cheaper than the 250 even before fuel (and servicing) differential.
It's a classic case of people going too much on the actual price and too little on the actual overall cost-to-own.
That said, the differential isn't that marked for those buying privately over a relatively short period, and some people will just prefer the 250. Each to their own. But it pays to do *all* the sums!
It's a classic case of people going too much on the actual price and too little on the actual overall cost-to-own.
That said, the differential isn't that marked for those buying privately over a relatively short period, and some people will just prefer the 250. Each to their own. But it pays to do *all* the sums!
I worked out theres a £270 difference in road tax and because the mileage is low, about 2500 miles a year. With current price of petrol at £1.40 a litre, itll be about £300 difference in fuel costs every year between the IS300h and IS250. Overall this works out at £570 cheaper if going for the IS300h every year. However, when taking to account the price differences, itll take about 8 years to theoretically make even.
BUT, as we all know, the residual value of the IS250 will undoubtedly be weaker than the IS300h so all in all, in 5 years it wont make too much off a difference between the two. Now obviously, if my wife decided to keep the car for a longer period, id be losing out but no one knows whats going to happen in 5 years so if we like the 250 over the 300h, we will ultimately be going for that.
Dont get me wrong, we liked the IS300h. Its a smooth powertrain and IMHO suits the car pretty well. I also wasnt wanting for power, I thought it accelerated very well and sure did feel torquey. The only gripe was the throttle response which is essentially something you can get used to and tbh my wifes current car suffers from turbo lag which gives pretty much the same sensation. Its NOT a deal breaker, but if the IS250 is better, then why get the 300h
Last edited by rayaans; 08-10-13 at 06:11 PM.
08-10-13, 07:34 PM
#27
The pursuit of F
All sums have been done and dusted. I worked out that with the discounts my dealer is currently offering me, there is about approx £4,5k difference between the IS250 and IS300h. Buying privately mainly because we are both self employed and if I get the company to buy it, ill have to pay BIK tax as well as extra national insurance.
I worked out theres a £270 difference in road tax and because the mileage is low, about 2500 miles a year. With current price of petrol at £1.40 a litre, itll be about £300 difference in fuel costs every year between the IS300h and IS250. Overall this works out at £570 cheaper if going for the IS300h every year. However, when taking to account the price differences, itll take about 8 years to theoretically make even.
BUT, as we all know, the residual value of the IS250 will undoubtedly be weaker than the IS300h so all in all, in 5 years it wont make too much off a difference between the two. Now obviously, if my wife decided to keep the car for a longer period, id be losing out but no one knows whats going to happen in 5 years so if we like the 250 over the 300h, we will ultimately be going for that.
Dont get me wrong, we liked the IS300h. Its a smooth powertrain and IMHO suits the car pretty well. I also wasnt wanting for power, I thought it accelerated very well and sure did feel torquey. The only gripe was the throttle response which is essentially something you can get used to and tbh my wifes current car suffers from turbo lag which gives pretty much the same sensation. Its NOT a deal breaker, but if the IS250 is better, then why get the 300h
I worked out theres a £270 difference in road tax and because the mileage is low, about 2500 miles a year. With current price of petrol at £1.40 a litre, itll be about £300 difference in fuel costs every year between the IS300h and IS250. Overall this works out at £570 cheaper if going for the IS300h every year. However, when taking to account the price differences, itll take about 8 years to theoretically make even.
BUT, as we all know, the residual value of the IS250 will undoubtedly be weaker than the IS300h so all in all, in 5 years it wont make too much off a difference between the two. Now obviously, if my wife decided to keep the car for a longer period, id be losing out but no one knows whats going to happen in 5 years so if we like the 250 over the 300h, we will ultimately be going for that.
Dont get me wrong, we liked the IS300h. Its a smooth powertrain and IMHO suits the car pretty well. I also wasnt wanting for power, I thought it accelerated very well and sure did feel torquey. The only gripe was the throttle response which is essentially something you can get used to and tbh my wifes current car suffers from turbo lag which gives pretty much the same sensation. Its NOT a deal breaker, but if the IS250 is better, then why get the 300h
08-11-13, 07:45 AM
#28
Lexus Test Driver
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