DRivera250

iTrader: (6)

My dad informs me that my car is not running as efficiently. His reason is because the mufflers or tailpipes are dirty and they should not be dirty. If he is right what should I be changing out?

06isDriver

our cars burn an unusual amount of oil that is within "spec"....thats why the tailpipes look dirty. Also check your oil levels regularly....

I bought mine used at 42k miles so I cant vouch for how it was broken in, but Im runnin 13.2's in 80 degree weather....so its gotta be running well.

My pipes were INCREDIBLY dirty before my first oil change. But since I've switched to a mobile1 syntheic with a touch of Marvel mystery oil in the crankcase and gas for treatment, I've noticed a considerable increase in the time it takes to accumulate said soot. It used to be within 2 days of a wash...now its more like a week.

So i must be doin somethin right....

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

MMO? Why?

BTW, you're a little late to the party with the air conditioner driven intercooler. Guys were doing this 10 years ago, and even had a company with a number of domestic applications. Haven't seen them in a long time though. I was looking at the idea of using Peltier coolers for this, but after looking at the engineering info it was clear they don't have enough capacity for the power they draw.

Also BTW, Ford has already received a patent for a refrigerated intercooler system. It's dated 2004.

edgeucated

iTrader: (4)

^^ What he said

but yes our cars do burn alot of carbon producing the effect of having a dirty tailpipe. Ever since i started using royal purple, i have it takes about two weeks before i start to notice any change in color in my exhaust tips

iRock

iTrader: (12)

I was wonderin if anyone used royal purple oil in their lex... so better oil = cleaner tail pipes

ScKcBc

iTrader: (2)

all cars have black muffler tips on the inside, I hope this thread is a joke

lilbluu

iTrader: (2)

i want to use that on my next oil change.

llamaboiz

LOL... omg you have black soot coming out from the tailpipe... hahaha

06isDriver

Although I can appreicate your ignorant arrogance but Peltier coolers are nowhere NEAR efficient enough for this purpose....

As well....your five minute google search did indeed find a system designed by ford motors. However, that system can only store a charged amount and is not designed nor could it run continously.

Your attitude is not new to me...the doubters, the naysayers, the parade pissers, but its too late. Its already done. Designed, tested, documented, and proofed patent applied.

So the next time you try to brood intelligence over a person you do not know and insult their hard work, be prepared for a similar rebuttal.

mitsuguy

iTrader: (2)

um, hate to butt in here, but do you realize the amount of energy it is going to take to lower the temperature of the amount of air that is going to continuously flow through the intake by 35 degrees???

at a modest 3500 rpm, the average 3.5 liter engine needs 120 cfm of air, double that at 7000 rpm, on average still... to get a delta temp of 35 degrees for that amount of air is going to be ridiculous... lets say the average outside temperature (since we are going to this extent, we are at least going to start with outside temp air, not underhood heated air, right?), and we'll say that its 80 degrees (lets face it, any cooler than that and it doesn't make sense for this mod)... so, to lower the temperature of 120 cfm worth of air 35 degrees, we are going to need 4,536 btu/hr to make this happen... That's 1328 watts... at 12 volts, that is 111 amps... This is all considering 100% efficiency, which just doesn't happen when we talk about air conditioning systems, which, at best, in a vehicle environment, might run 80% efficient... so, add 20% to our current draw, and we're closer to 133 amps worth of current...

now, to produce that 133 amps worth of electrical current, we are going to need an alternator / generator capable of it... that has to be driven by something, namely, the engine that also powers the drive wheels, I would imagine... ok, so, how much power does it take to turn that alternator (you did know that alternators sap energy from the engine as well right??? thats why some old vehicles have such high HP ratings - they were rated without accessories)??? automotive alternators typically are in the 60% efficiency range, so, to power our 1328 watts, we would need 3 horsepower to turn the alternator alone (assuming zero mechanical loss due to drive belts and friction that we will leave out)...

ok, so, you want to make horsepower by this mod correct??? lets see, general rule of thumb is 1 horsepower per 10 degree F drop in intake temperature... so, you gain 3.5 horsepower, but you lose 3 horsepower, for a net gain of .5 horsepower... sounds like a lot of work for half a horsepower at 3500 rpm... lets do it again at 7000 rpm... now, we need double the energy, but our horsepower gain is still the same, because our delta temp is still the same - so, now, we gain 3.5 horsepower from the cooler air, but lose 6 horsepower do to current draw...

So, if you stood with me through the mechanics of it, you will see that your little invention probably won't work at all, and if it were able to cool the intake charge, it won't keep up at higher rpm where it matters most...

now, I'll stop your other argument before it starts - you want to do this using air conditioning technology..... most of the same mechanics apply, though there is a lot more math involved - long story short, to run it full time, you are going to require more energy from the engine than you will gain by lowering intake temps 35 degrees... the average a/c compressor on a vehicle, while running, can draw anywhere from 10-15 hp...

remember, 3.5 horsepower, on average, from the cooler air, thats it... I've seen dyno pull to dyno pull vary more than that, with zero changes to the vehicle between pulls...

the only way to do something like this and make it worthwhile in a performance minded aspect, is to charge some sort of battery or capacitor, or store some energy some other way, that only uses power from the engine while charging, then when performance is needed, it stops drawing power, and starts its cooling cycle... thats what Ford essentially did, if I recall, they used the a/c system and diverted air for the intercooler when called upon... this took time to recharge (get cold), and while it was running in performance mode, the a/c was completely turned off to save horsepower that way (every vehicle I can think of disengages the a/c compressor above a certain throttle percentage or rpm)...

wanna get technical even more, you could shave more time off the 1/4 by removing your subs, then even more by changing from your heavy Falken wheels to a lightweight drag wheel... general rule is a tenth of a second for every 100 lbs, and I've seen numerous 13 second cars drop .3-.5 seconds off of their 1/4 mile time by going to a drag wheel/tire setup (fat rears, skinny fronts)

mitsuguy

iTrader: (2)

oh, and one last thing - the black soot in the tailpipe is almost exclusively carbon buildup from the combustion process... the richer your car runs, the more there is... the heavier your foot is, the richer it runs (every car dumps fuel to lower combustion chamber temps and reduce knock / detonation) when at full and almost full throttle...

a very very very insignificant amount of that soot is actually oil that has seeped past the piston rings...

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

Umm. Right. The guys doing this were selling it in 1998. It surely isn't rocket science. No, not from a five minute Google search, from their website 10 years ago when I was thinking of building an active intercooler for my Supra.

But hey, your response clearly indicates your panties are in a bunch so I'll just leave it alone.

Oh, yeah, not PATENT APPLIED FOR, but PATENT GRANTED.

Best of luck with your "new" method.

And you still didn't answer the question I wanted to know most - what's with the Marvel Mystery Oil?

I'm just guessing here, but it sounds like you're not familiar with BITOG and the MMO wars.

06isDriver

I STILL appreciate yall's arrogance, but it isnt becoming of either of you.

I will give you this though, your btu calculations are spot on but thats assuming conventional cooling. For what its worth, I'm able to produce these temperatures at only 546 watts. And judging by the amount of technical data you spit out, you will know thats only about 2/3 horsepower to run the system.

Impossible you say?? no...cause I dont need 4000 btus. You have failed in you ASSUMPTIONS! Of course it is impossible to make horsepower based on the math you provided. However, I've redesigned the ENTIRE SYSTEM. I didnt just throw an airduct from the current ac system into the intake. Thats just ridiculous.....

But save your holier than thou technical attitude for someone else. Have you done your due diligence for this specific application? Or are you the arm chair engineer here to tell me what will work based on your own engineering expertise?

I'm beggining to think so. Theory and Actuality are two very different things.....I have actuality on my side with flow charts and benchtesting. What do you have?

Also, I havent heard of the MMO wars. I use it because of multiple real life observations in badly running vehicles. Thats what I know. Now if youd like to enlighten me on why using MMO isnt necessary Id be glad to hear it, but dont feign experience or expertise on MY project that has already proven its worth.

BTW....35 degrees was the average. The system is able to reduce throttle body air temps from 128.2 degrees to 68.7......on 650 watts. Thanks for playing.

06isDriver

also....your general rule of thumb about temp and horsepower is incorrect. for every 10-13 degree drop you net 1% (PERCENT) efficiency. so that would be roughly 3 horsies per 10-13 temp drop for this application. And you arent even considering humidity decreases or pressure increases.

Anything else?

06isDriver

I will have to thank you though....because your bad attitudes and hole poking tendencies have given me an idea for even more improvement at wide open thottle and I can appreciate that. I was wondering how to overcome the high cfm requirements at 6700 rpm....maybe the problem could be solved.

Hey and I tell you what, so that you dont hold any ill-will towards me or my product, I'll give each of you a hell of a discount as a tester when that phase rolls out. hows that sound?