LexFather

Well here at Clublexus, we will will have the 1st in depth 3 vs IS discussion as we did with the 2GS vs Rl vs M45 and also the 2GS vs the European competitors. Leuxs made it clear the next IS will be shot right at the 3 with multiple engines, multiple powertrains and multiple bodystyles.

The G35 may have won a comparison or 2 but the 3 series is still regarded worldwide as THE BENCHMARK. It combines style, fun to drive, quality, space for 4, image, prestige, a solid interior as well as the ability to be tuned. So lets see what the new E90 offers.

On March 23rd, pricing will be revealed but expect the usual bump for a new model as well as paying that "BMW" surcharge We might be talking $29k for an empty 325 to near 50k for a loaded 330! Coupe and Convertible, most likely hardtop convertible are coming

Timeline for E90, ...etc.


March

* Official 3 Series Sport Wagon photos to be released March 21
* US Auto Show Debut - New York March 23
* Official 3 Series Sedan Pricing to be announced March 23
* Denver Auto Show March 30

April

* Atlanta Auto Show April 8
* Dallas Auto Show April 12

May

* 3 Series Sedan Demos arrive at BMW Centers Late April
* Official Retail Launch Date - MAY 6... :-)

September 2005

* MY 2006 325xi and 330xi Sedans begin production
* MY 2006 325xi Sports Wagon begins production
* note: 325i Sports Wagon (non-AWD) does not begin prod. until March 2006
* MY 2006 E46 3 Series Coupe and Convertible production begins

LexFather

Edmunds review is very positive
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=104670
Autoweek
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=101850

LexFather

THe new 3 is getting great press, being on magazine covers already. The IS has a serious battle. Also the IS does offer more choices but the 3 offers maybe too many? Over a dozen here and over 40 choices of a 3 in Europe! What the IS does have going for it is top quality, in Europe the IS is one of the top 3 quality cars the last 3 years and here its considered one of the best built and safest cars.
All the 3 pics you need to compare too here
http://www.germancarfans.com/photos....001/bmw/1.html

LexFather

LexFather

BMW will offer the usual complement of straight-sixes and diesels in the new E90 3 Series, including the advanced technology 320d diesel and 330i petrol engines.

The 330i is the all-new lightweight 3.0-litre Valvetronic petrol engine featured in the BMW 630i 6 Series. In BMW's ongoing pursuit of weight reduction, this engine is the first in large-scale series production to use magnesium which, compared to aluminum, is 30 percent lighter. Magnesium is used in the crankcase, the crankshaft bearings and the cylinder head cover.

The E90 will share its entry-level four-cylinder engines with the 1 Series. Four-cylinder engines will not be available in BMW USA cars.

The Euro news

The new BMW 3 Series .... The fifth generation of the benchmark small executive car

"The new 3 Series faces the daunting task of upstaging what is the defining car of its generation and market sector. With engine technology and a focused design strategy at its core, the new 3 Series looks set to do just that. Once again, the new 3 Series sets a new benchmark for small executive cars and I am confident it will be a great success in both the corporate and retail markets," said Jim O'Donnell, managing director of BMW Great Britain.


The new BMW 3 Series delivers an even more dynamic driving experience than its predecessor, accelerates faster and achieves a higher top speed but not to the detriment of economy, with the new 330i delivering improvements in fuel consumption while the 320i and 320d match their predecessors.

See download document for clear table presentation

Model / Power bhp / Torque Nm / Acceleration / Top speed / Economy

New BMW 320i / 150 / 200 / 9.0 / 137 / 38.2
Current BMW 318i / 143 / 200 / 9.3 / 135 / 38.2
New BMW 320d / 163 / 340 / 8.3 / 140 / 49.6
Current BMW 320d / 150 / 330 / 8.8 / 137 / 49.6
New BMW 330i / 258 / 300 / 6.3 / 155* / 33.2
Current BMW 330i / 231 / 300 / 6.5 / 155* / 31.0

(* Electronically limited to 155mph)

Powering the fifth generation of new BMW 3 Series is a range of engines all married to a standard six-speed manual gearbox (six-speed automatic optional). Topping the range is the BMW 330i featuring the most powerful, yet lightest, six-cylinder engine in its class - the same engine that powers the recently launched BMW 630i Coupe. Delivering 258bhp and 300Nm (221lb-ft) between 2,500 and 4,000rpm, this engine powers the car from zero to 62mph in just 6.3 seconds and on to a limited top speed of 155mph. However, this is not at the expense of economy, with the new 330i delivering 33.5mpg combined fuel consumption.

These levels of performance are made possible by a number of significant developments in engine design and construction. The engine sees BMW use magnesium in its construction process for the first time in large-scale series production. The crankcase jacket, bedplate and cylinder head cover are all made from magnesium, which weighs 30 per cent less than aluminium.

Additionally, the new 3.0-litre unit is the first six-cylinder engine to feature BMW's patented VALVETRONIC induction system. First seen on BMW's V8 engines and more recently offered as standard on the Hams Hall four-cylinder petrol engines, VALVETRONIC infinitely varies the intake valve opening times and, when combined with Bi-VANOS variable camshaft timing, delivers the optimal fuel efficiency and engine response.

Also joining the six-cylinder model range in spring 2005 will be the 325i, delivering 218bhp at 6,500rpm and 250Nm (184lb-ft) at 2,750 - 4,250rpm.

The new 3 Series range will also feature a two-litre diesel and a two-litre petrol variant at launch. The BMW 320d, currently the UK's most popular 3 Series model, features second-generation common rail diesel technology and a variable vane turbocharger to deliver 163bhp and 340Nm (251lb-ft) of torque. This provides the car with the best of all worlds. Acceleration to 62mph is achieved in 8.3 seconds with a top speed of 140mph. While delivering this level of performance, it also achieves 49.6mpg on the combined cycle and, as an additional benefit to the company car driver, is EU4 compliant.

The engine in the new 320i is based on that of the outgoing 318i, but with enhancements to the induction and exhaust systems. Also benefiting from BMW's VALVETRONIC and Bi-VANOS systems, the new 320i offers 150bhp at 6,200rpm, with a maximum torque of 200Nm (147lb-ft) achieved at 3,600rpm. This enables the car to accelerate to 62mph from standstill in 9.0 seconds, achieve a top speed of 136mph yet still delivering a frugal 38.2mpg.

Further four-cylinder 3 Series variants will follow during the course of 2005.

Ensuring that the power and torque remain in check is the responsibility of the new DSC+ system (on six-cylinder models - standard DSC on four-cylinder models). Effectively an evolution of the familiar DSC traction control system, DSC+ offers a range of benefits, including Brake Standby that pre-tensions the brakes when the driver quickly removes the pressure from the accelerator pedal. Soft Stop is also incorporated which modulates the brake application to prevent the nose of the car from 'diving' when travelling slowly. Also included in DSC+ is a Start-Off Assistant that uses the clutch to prevent the car from rolling back on a hill-start and a brake detector that ensures the discs are kept dry and responsive on wet roads.

Also assisting the car's agility is BMW's Active Steering system, available for the first time in a car of this class. Previously only available on larger 5 and 6 Series models, Active Steering is offered as an option on six-cylinder models and resolves the conflict between low-speed agility and higher-speed stability by delivering a speed-proportional steering ratio. Active Steering also brings a number of key safety benefits. In conjunction with the DSC+ system, if the car detects oversteer, Active Steering applies a small amount of positive steering angle to bring the rear of the car back into line. Additionally on the new 3 Series, when applying the brakes on a surface with differing grip levels such as snow or ice, Active Steering intervenes to stabilise the car more precisely and quickly than the driver is able to do manually.

Supporting these steering and traction control systems is a chassis that has been tuned to deliver optimal driving dynamics on all road conditions. With BMW's trademark front engine - rear-wheel-drive layout and near-perfect 50:50 weight distribution, the new 3 Series feels nimble and agile on the road. Its double-joint spring strut front axle is made completely of aluminium, minimising the unsprung mass of the car and reducing road noise. The new five-arm rear axle, first seen on the new BMW 1 Series, delivers excellent ride comfort.

The new 3 Series body is stiffer yet lighter than that of the outgoing model. Thanks to a new joint and crossbar arrangement for the car's load-bearing structure, the bodyshell stiffness is increased by 25 per cent over its predecessor.

The inherent rigidity of the steel bodyshell enhances the new 3 Series' class leading safety levels. With the addition of six airbags as standard, including curtain head airbags for front and rear occupants, the car is expected to receive a five-star Euro NCAP rating. It is also one of the first cars in the world that is fully prepared for the rigorous side impact requirements in North America as well as the US high-speed rear impact test.

Also supporting these high standards of safety are a number of familiar systems from other BMW models. Brake Force Display is standard for the first time on 3 Series Saloon models, offering two stage brake lights. Brake lights illuminate normally in average driving conditions but during an emergency stop or when the ABS braking cuts in, the area of brake light illumination increases to warn those travelling behind of the situation ahead.

Adding further to safety levels are Run-flat tyres, available for the first time on 3 Series models. Like the 1, 5 and 6 Series models, Run-flat tyres are offered as standard, and with the recent developments in Run-flat technology, the car can now be driven for an astonishing 150 miles at 50mph with up to four punctured tyres. This allows the driver to complete almost any journey before replacements need to be sought.

Like the levels of standard and safety equipment, the proportions of the car have also grown over its predecessor. Measuring 4,520mm (+49mm) in length, 2,760mm (+35mm) in wheelbase, 1,817mm (+78mm) in width and 1,424mm (+9mm) in height, the new BMW 3 Series offers a spacious and light cabin. With occupants cosseted by their surroundings, a driver-orientated dashboard layout places all the primary controls at the driver's fingertips while the secondary controls are conveniently and ergonomically accessible. Rear occupants benefit from an increase in head, shoulder, elbow and leg room.

For those customers opting for either Business or Professional navigation systems, BMW's iDrive operating concept comes as standard for the first time in a car of this class. Replacing the conventional single hood dashboard layout, the display screen sits centrally on the dashboard in a second binnacle to deliver navigation information alongside on-board computer information, entertainment and climate control adjustments and Check Control messages.

Also available for the first time on a BMW in this class is Comfort Access. All cars receive a newly designed key that replaces the conventional blade-type key but with Comfort Access the key contains an ID Sensor that the car recognises from a short distance away. On recognition, the doors are unlocked automatically and the car can be started with one push of the starter button. The Comfort Access system also works in tandem with BMW's familiar key memory system to ensure that the seating position, door mirrors, personalised air conditioning settings and radio reception are automatically adjusted to the current drivers' settings before they enter the car.

Text and photos: BMW
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BMW 3-Series E90



10.08.04
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The new BMW 3-Series E90: first photos

In spite of the fact that company BMW did not publish neither official photos, nor characteristics of the following generation of the third series, we can acquaint you with the information on this model.


This information is received from the dealer brochure, the file which "has flowed away" from Slovenian dealer company. The submitted data cannot be considered official till the moment of publication of the information on the given model by BMW. However, sources in BMW AG informed that characteristics and the photos submitted in the brochure are final.

New BMW 3-series E90 sizes: length of 4520 mm (+49 mm), width - 2013 mm (+274 mm), height - 1424 mm (+9 mm), a wheelbase - 2750 mm (+25 mm).
The shape of the automobile became prompter. Thus, the forward part of the automobile has same shapes as the previous generation had and something from the new fifth series. 325i and 330i are equipped with a chromeplated radiator enclosure and big mirrors. It will be possible to order xenon adaptive headlights for all versions.

Sedan will be equipped with one of four base engines. Base version BMW 320i will receive the 2-liter engine, 150 h.p. at 6.200 rev/min. Top speed is 219 km/h. The two-liter diesel engine develops 163 h.p. Acceleration till 100 km/h will take only 8,2 sec., and the top speed is 225 km/h. 325i with the modernized 6-cylinder engine develops 218 h.p. 0-100 km/h takes 7 seconds. The top version is BMW 330i. The automobile with 3-liter flat-six engine develops 258 h.p. at 6.600 rev/min. 0-100 km/h takes 6.3 seconds, and his top speed is electronically limited at 250 km/h. All base versions are equipped with a mechanical 6-gear box, and for an additional payment it will be possible to order 6-gear Steptronic with an opportunity of a manual gear shift.

Versions with two-liter engines (both petrol and diesel) will receive 16-inch light-alloy wheels with tires of dimension 205/55, the version 325i - 16-inch light-alloy wheels with tires 205/55, and the most powerful version - 17-inch wheels with tires 225/45.
DSC is included in a standard complete set of all versions of the automobile. The system unites work ABS, CBC (Cornering Brake Control) and DTC (Dynamic Traction Control).

However, the most fantastic changes have touched a passenger compartment. All versions of a sedan has keyless card system and button Start/Stop Engine. As an option it will be offered the navigating system with iDrive controller. Base versions of automobiles will be equipped with audio system BMW Business with a CD player. And for an additional payment it will be possible to a Hi-Fi system with 6CD-box.

The volume of a trunk is 460 liters (+20 litres). BMW 3-series can be painted in 11 colors - three usual and 9 metallic. It will be possible to order fabric (three variants) or leather (five variants) interior.

Incendiary

Sick, I think you're right that the IS is targeting the 3, but what do you mean by "battle for the throne"? Do you have a yardstick by which to measure who wins? If you're talking sales, no way the IS will beat it. In terms of handling, no way the IS will win either. Even if the IS is actually more fun to drive and handles better, the magazines won't admit it. I'd probably buy an IS over an E90 3-series if the IS handling is there and it's cheaper, though.

I have to say that I do like the current IS looks more than the 2nd gen IS's. It's definitely a big improvement over the 3rd gen GS, which I still very much dislike, but something about it is just really bland and Scion-like. Whatever, that's okay, I like the Audi A4's looks for the most part, and that's also really bland and conservative, so maybe the IS will grow on me.

LexFather

"battle for the throne" i thought was a catchy ttitle and they are battling for the top compact luxo sports sedan. The previous IS has won against the 3 in a comparo (Road and Track) and people raved over the cars handling but did wish for more punch in the engine.
I agree the 3 bias is there, its won so long its hard to believe it can be beat. But the IS then G35 showed it can happen.
As for sales, yeah the 3 has too many varients. But I am sure this next IS will really sell well, as many as they can import.
I figure a IS 350 will cost the price of a 325 with similar equipment. 330s are basically 40k cars! And that point people may think 525, M35 or GS 300.

Incendiary

I dunno about the 3 having too many variants. I think in terms of company profit, it's a good idea, because you don't have to design a totally new chassis for each "offspring," if you will. Different chassis for sedan/wagon and coupe/cab can be expensive, and larger companies like DCX and Toyota can do that, but BMW is, like Honda, a relatively small (but profitable) company. I wouldn't be opposed to Lexus having a different chassis for their coupe/convertible line, but I also wouldn't mind if it were based off the same as the sedan.

In any case, it'll be interesting to see the battle in the entry lux sports sedan market. In terms of luxury image (and even profit for Lexus), maybe the GS and LS market is more important, but in terms of the younger sport lux crowd that Toyota wants, this IS will be important. In that regards, I wish they'd made the design a little more aggressive, but maybe they want to raise the median buyer age from 29. I dunno. The interior is a nice luxury interior, although not driver oriented enough for me, and no stick = no sale in the 350 (again, for me).

You know, bimmerfest and other BMW boards have this guy (or is it a gal?) named vatkens who monitors complaints and asks for feedback to the company. It'd be nice if a Lexus rep would actually surf boards like CL and mention that they're looking at what we're doing. As much as the Cadillac "VIP feedback" thread was being trashed over in Car Chat, I thought it was a smart move on their part. I'm sure car companies are monitoring some of the enthusiast boards anonymously, but it'd be nice if they'd actually take part more actively...

RohithT

The E90 is getting more press right now because BMW has already done a press intro, the car is due out by April or May in some markets, and they sent out publicity photos a while ago. Plus, spyshots of the new 3 have been floating around for at least a year now, so it's been in people's consciousness more. Lexus, however, has done its usual supernatural job of keeping all test vehicles from being photographed (there are exceptions, such as the Toyota super car being photographed, of course). The new IS will be out in the fall, and people have just seen their first real photos.

One thing I don't get is why doesn't Lexus advertise more? Perhaps I just don't watch the right TV (I don't watch much, really), but I have yet to see a commercial for the GS, while I've seen several for the 5 series in the last month. It's not that they can't do great ads– the RX's Halloween themed ad was really cool–*but I just don't see Lexus ads as much as I do BMW, Infiniti, Caddy, Jaguar, MB, or Acura. TV is still the best way to reach people (it's only a small percent of the buying population who frequent enthusiast sites such as da Club), and if they want the IS to really take on the 3, they're going to have to start a media blitz.

candyman99

i agree w/ you, only bmw is out of there mind charging 40k for a car thats doesnt worth 40k but its name. japanese pricing is more reasonable and affordable. g35 sold 70,000 cars in 04. if IS is around the same price. im sure it will do much better than the g35. but on the other hand, lexus has changed there price so much. buying a new gs feels like buying the new 5 series and E class. which to some it just aint worth it. japanese cars need to stay low price in the market in order to be success i think. lexus is already well known for their affordable luxary car, why change the plan to charge wha bmw or benz charging when their company is going down fall.

amy011079

Great post Mike! Only you could pull off a comparison thread like this.

I'm all over the new IS. It's all me, I love it in everyway. I still love a bmw for some reason but my heart is with Lexus and always will be. The new IS just blows away the 3 series in many areas for me. The interior especially. BMW has done hardly any updating to the interior. If you look at the E36, the E46 and now the E90 the interiors look so similar it doesn't even look like a redesign. Now the IS on the other hand looks like a redesign and I like that. Makes it worth while to be driving a second gen car. It's DIFFERENT.

tron1043

This is going to my last post, in my very brief membership at club Lexus.

Since August I have been waiting for the 2006 3 series, however recently while my mother was at the dealership checking out an 06 GS300, I got to playing around with the NAV system... simply put the best system available. So good, I started thinking that I might be interested in the 06 IS250/350 based on how much I loved the gadgets in the GS.

A month ago I did a very intensive demo in a BMW with iDrive Nav spec. It was painful to use the navigation system, not to mention it didn't seem that it offered any POI data. Since NAV is so important for next car, I started considering Lexus more and more... again.

I say Lexus again, because I had an IS300 the third week it was available and before that my first car was my father's SC300 (which by the way was the best car anyone in my family has ever owned). The IS was a very fun car, but it was not a $35K car. The interior was miles away from Lexus (the trim covering the transmission tunnel flexing like a Ford Focus comes to mind), no LED ambient lighting, no "exotic" trim pieces (wood, carbon fiber, aluminum), no steering wheel audio controls, you probaly know what I am talking about. Having had my fill of my IS300, I got a BMW 3 series, and it is simply sublime, from the comfort to the plethora of accessories available, my favorite car.

fast forward to last week the specs/quality info and pics of the IS come out, it was looking like I would be going to the dealership to literally have the first IS in Michigan.

Then, after getting some words of encouragement from BMW boards to try the iDrive navigation again, BUT WITH A LIST OF THE VOICE COMMANDS, I went today.

In a nut-shell, the voice command is so 'all-encompassing'... it's like techno-shock.

How would you like to adjust, the actual 'fan speed', temp in deg.s,, select a specific CD track, a radio station frequency i.e. say "FM 8 8 . 7", scale the map by saying "scale 1 mile", "scale 400 feet", etc... Even my Father, who has a moderate Irish accent had no problem with the system recognizing all of his commands as well.

Everything I hated about iDrive was evaporated after hald an hour playing around with the voice commands.

So, I have thought about the merits of each cars and here is what I think.

Exterior: I like them both =, however BMW's Sparkling Graphite Metallic is just all types of sexy.

Interior:
BMW: The E90 3-series, is disappointing, however the feel of the materials (also bear in mind that the plastics used in the new 3 are actually a step up from the current 5 [which is also getting some upgraded plastics]), the ablility to switch the trim with tons of OEM variants, aluminium, carbon fiber (black and silver), woods, etc..., and the best looking steering (IMO) in just about any car, etc.., should make up for it.

Lexus: Looks great at first... take a look at the doors. The door pulls, seem completely out of place and give the door a disjointed look. The lower middle cushion of the seats protrude in an awkward way, that could easily be made adjustable 'ala' BMW thigh support feature on their sport seats. The dials for the seat heater/ventialtion controls are completely out of place and seem like an after thought. Also, isn't it about time that Lexus ditches the staggered tranmission gate for a leather gaiter like BMW, Audi, Mercedes, etc..., it looks so dated, especially with all the high technology in the car.

On the positive side, I love the screen placement.

Engine:
BMW: simply power is up alot, engine weight down, fuel efficiency up, nice. However, something that only people in cold climates will appreciate, the new BMW inline 6s use an electric water pump, which besides freeing up more HP, makes the car warm up faster in cold starts and allow for 'REST' heating (using residual engine heat to heat the interior without the motor running). To anyone in a cold climate this is a big deal.

Lexus: Fool me once shame on you (215 HP 7.3 0-60 in $35K car), fool me twice shame on me (204 hp + AWD [in my case], weight up on the whole, plus I am sure the weight used in the tech specs, are with the 16" wheels, no ventilated seat fans, heavier Levison speakers & amp, plus a spare tire ---- BMW is using the brand new Pirelli Euforia run-flats, thus no spare.

The IS250 will be no faster than an Audi A4 2.0 quatro (new engine for 06), in fact the IS250 will most likely be sluggish with AWD and all the toys.

Toys: This is easy, Lexus in a landside. However, unless your an audio snob (which I was, but thankfully I have shaken that vice), the BMW Logic 7 system is very, very good, no Levinson, but very good. Also, big for me, BMW is Sirius and their antena is built in, meaning you would never know the antena is there by looking at the car.

PRICE:

BMW: I can get the BMW I want, probaly for under $38K w/ 6 speed auto, leather, cold weather pkg (3 zone - 3 stage heated seats, fold down rear seats, and head light washers), Logic 7, Navigation w/iDrive, Sport package (sport seats, sport susp., the sexiest steering wheel in any non-exotic, 17" wheels), Sirius, adaptive Xenons with Angel eyes, and metaillic paint. Also, sunroof, real aluminum or wood trim, LED variable intensity brake lights, are now standard.

Also, BMW mark-up is nowhere near Lexus, 2005 invoive on 325i $26,825, msrp $29,300, plus dealers make next to nothing on options/pkgs. Since, niether a new IS or 3 series will be discounted anytime soon, there is just something more appealing of giving less money to the dealer, kind of like your getting more car for the money even if its more expensive.

Lexus: What's the base on a 2006 GS300? $42,900 very well equiped. What's cheapest you see them at dealers for? $49,999. You can't seem to get a base spec Lexus. Let's say that the base for the IS250 is $28,500. With moonroof, auto, heated/ventilated seats, adaptive xenons, the NAV/Levinson pkg (which will be EXACTLY THE SAME PRICE as it is the GS, as has been the case of nav/levinson prices across Lexus range) and it would not be any stretch to say the cars hitting the showrooms in the fall will be $34K low spec and $36.5 full spec, add $1900 for AWD.

I am ordering a 2006 BMW 325i.

Without meaning to offend anyone, the IS250 (until it gets the 245hp GS300 in two model years you can set your watch by it) is set to be the black sheep of the Lexus family, however, it not surprise me if the IS350 wins a few comparison test v. the new 330i. Keep in mind though, I think like 80% of 3 series are of 325 variety.

I really enjoyed this forum,
James

biker

It's sad to see so many early adopters make such a huge buying decision on paper facts.

Itsuki_23

Funny. All your judgement is made on press photos and preliminary specs. My friend was in Geneva and he saw the new IS and E90 both in person. First I have to say he is not a luxury or hi-tech car fanatic, his passion is off-road. BUT he said that new IS looks absolutely stunning in person, most beautiful car in the whole show. Jaw-dropping sexy. Pictures don't do it justice at all.

E90 design in below average, especially the rear end. It gets so much press only because it's a beamer. And all the review's are say neutral at least about it's design.

I recommend to wait for the full official IS specs, US launch in New York will give us lot more detailed info. Go to New York Auto Show and see the new IS in person.

Evene better, when IS is launched, test drive it and the E90. Then you have direct comparison.

LexFather

tron1043 just because you chose the 3, doesn't mean u can't hang around. Congrats on your 325, the IS won't be sold until September and I believe the 3 goes on sale in April, so you can't drive the 2 sadly. Neither is a bad car, both are tops of the class looking at specs we have thus far, and pictures thus far.

My gut feeling is if you don't have to get a new car, at least wait for drive the new IS.