Anyone care to speculate on the MSRP or MPG on the GS450h
03-18-05, 04:52 PM
#31
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Originally Posted by AmethySC
It's a V6 hybrid, not a V8 hybrid, so it'll probably be a few thousand $'s over a fully loaded GS3. 
Originally Posted by flipside909
Speaking of Denny, he has a nice office at Lexus HQ in Torrance. When I visited there a couple weeks ago, his office view is the front of the facility overlooking the parking lot. He can park anywhere he pleases too! 
How come you got to go to his office?
03-18-05, 10:23 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by flipside909
The 3.5L 2GR-FSE will share the same block and other technologies, but the intake/header routing will obviously be different, transversely mounted and mated to a different tranny and horsepower. Regardless, it's not a matter of where it will come from, the engine is the same period but w/the obvious differences. The Avalon's 2GR-FSE is also direct injection w/Dual VVT-i.
03-19-05, 06:48 AM
#33
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Someone speculated the price of the GS Hybrid to be 55,000 - coming as a pretty much fully loaded car. They claimed the ML/Nav combo would be the only optional equipment, as well as the PCS. If you add the prices up the total comes to $61,800. (4000 for ML/NAV, 2800 for PCS)
If you take the current 06 GS430 and fully load it including ML/NAV, and PCS.... the vehicle price is $61,000.
Doesnt make sense.
So theres no way the fully loaded GS450H is going to be anything close to the 1000 dollar more range. I think that between the fully loaded GS430, and GS40H the price difference is 6-8K more.
If you take the current 06 GS430 and fully load it including ML/NAV, and PCS.... the vehicle price is $61,000.
Doesnt make sense. So theres no way the fully loaded GS450H is going to be anything close to the 1000 dollar more range. I think that between the fully loaded GS430, and GS40H the price difference is 6-8K more.
03-19-05, 07:30 AM
#34
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Originally Posted by GS3rdwow
Someone speculated the price of the GS Hybrid to be 55,000 - coming as a pretty much fully loaded car. They claimed the ML/Nav combo would be the only optional equipment, as well as the PCS. If you add the prices up the total comes to $61,800. (4000 for ML/NAV, 2800 for PCS)
If you take the current 06 GS430 and fully load it including ML/NAV, and PCS.... the vehicle price is $61,000.
Doesnt make sense.
So theres no way the fully loaded GS450H is going to be anything close to the 1000 dollar more range. I think that between the fully loaded GS430, and GS40H the price difference is 6-8K more.
If you take the current 06 GS430 and fully load it including ML/NAV, and PCS.... the vehicle price is $61,000.
Doesnt make sense. So theres no way the fully loaded GS450H is going to be anything close to the 1000 dollar more range. I think that between the fully loaded GS430, and GS40H the price difference is 6-8K more.
03-19-05, 10:27 PM
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Taking the rest of the lineup into account....
I'm by no means a veteran Lexus watcher, but I gotta think the pricing of the GS450h will be more relative to what the lineup will look like at the end of next year, not when it's released.
According to what we've seen on other threads, they have the GS450h planned for May '06, the GS350 planned for Sep. '06, and the GS460 planned for Sep. '06. I'm guessing the GS350 and GS460 are replacements for the GS300 and GS430, so by the end of next year the lineup would be GS350(RWD/AWD?), GS450h, and GS460.
So what, you ask? Well, while it seems they will be marketing the GS450h as more powerful than the current GS430, it will be presumably marketed as less powerful than the new GS460 (although it will still have the better gas mileage going for it). How much more will the GS460 be than the current GS430? I'll guess about $2k. That would put the GS460 around $63k (loaded). As for the GS350, I'll give that a $2k bump as well over the GS300. That puts the GS350RWD at $55k (loaded), and the GS350AWD at $57k (loaded).
So where does that leave the GS450h? Good question. Almost as powerful as the GS460, far better gas mileage. I gotta think they'll position it at the top, even though the V8-heads will view it as an imposter. I'll say $65k (loaded).
GS350RWD $55k
GS350AWD $57k
GS460 $63k
GS450h $65k
According to what we've seen on other threads, they have the GS450h planned for May '06, the GS350 planned for Sep. '06, and the GS460 planned for Sep. '06. I'm guessing the GS350 and GS460 are replacements for the GS300 and GS430, so by the end of next year the lineup would be GS350(RWD/AWD?), GS450h, and GS460.
So what, you ask? Well, while it seems they will be marketing the GS450h as more powerful than the current GS430, it will be presumably marketed as less powerful than the new GS460 (although it will still have the better gas mileage going for it). How much more will the GS460 be than the current GS430? I'll guess about $2k. That would put the GS460 around $63k (loaded). As for the GS350, I'll give that a $2k bump as well over the GS300. That puts the GS350RWD at $55k (loaded), and the GS350AWD at $57k (loaded).
So where does that leave the GS450h? Good question. Almost as powerful as the GS460, far better gas mileage. I gotta think they'll position it at the top, even though the V8-heads will view it as an imposter. I'll say $65k (loaded).
GS350RWD $55k
GS350AWD $57k
GS460 $63k
GS450h $65k
03-19-05, 10:54 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by longjohn
I'm by no means a veteran Lexus watcher, but I gotta think the pricing of the GS450h will be more relative to what the lineup will look like at the end of next year, not when it's released.
According to what we've seen on other threads, they have the GS450h planned for May '06, the GS350 planned for Sep. '06, and the GS460 planned for Sep. '06. I'm guessing the GS350 and GS460 are replacements for the GS300 and GS430, so by the end of next year the lineup would be GS350(RWD/AWD?), GS450h, and GS460.
So what, you ask? Well, while it seems they will be marketing the GS450h as more powerful than the current GS430, it will be presumably marketed as less powerful than the new GS460 (although it will still have the better gas mileage going for it). How much more will the GS460 be than the current GS430? I'll guess about $2k. That would put the GS460 around $63k (loaded). As for the GS350, I'll give that a $2k bump as well over the GS300. That puts the GS350RWD at $55k (loaded), and the GS350AWD at $57k (loaded).
So where does that leave the GS450h? Good question. Almost as powerful as the GS460, far better gas mileage. I gotta think they'll position it at the top, even though the V8-heads will view it as an imposter. I'll say $65k (loaded).
GS350RWD $55k
GS350AWD $57k
GS460 $63k
GS450h $65k
According to what we've seen on other threads, they have the GS450h planned for May '06, the GS350 planned for Sep. '06, and the GS460 planned for Sep. '06. I'm guessing the GS350 and GS460 are replacements for the GS300 and GS430, so by the end of next year the lineup would be GS350(RWD/AWD?), GS450h, and GS460.
So what, you ask? Well, while it seems they will be marketing the GS450h as more powerful than the current GS430, it will be presumably marketed as less powerful than the new GS460 (although it will still have the better gas mileage going for it). How much more will the GS460 be than the current GS430? I'll guess about $2k. That would put the GS460 around $63k (loaded). As for the GS350, I'll give that a $2k bump as well over the GS300. That puts the GS350RWD at $55k (loaded), and the GS350AWD at $57k (loaded).
So where does that leave the GS450h? Good question. Almost as powerful as the GS460, far better gas mileage. I gotta think they'll position it at the top, even though the V8-heads will view it as an imposter. I'll say $65k (loaded).
GS350RWD $55k
GS350AWD $57k
GS460 $63k
GS450h $65k
Those ain't cheap numbers. Right there with the 5 series. BTW, the 545i will become the 550i next year, with the 4.8 V8 making 360 hp / 360 torque.
03-20-05, 09:19 AM
#39
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I don't sell Avalons but direct injection and direct ignition are different things
Direct "injection" places the injector inside the combustion chamber which is pretty bold. Direct "ignition" places a dedicated coil over each spark plug which has been a very reliable system and plug fouling is unheard of nowdays. Was this a typo? The GS450h version and the under development GS350 version will have much higher output than the Avalon, ES350, and RX350 transverse applications. I hope they can tame that engine in time for the IS350 in October.
03-20-05, 10:10 AM
#40
Right, Avalon's engine is not direct injection - it is 2GR-SE.
As to the pricing, I would expect 5k-6k difference from similary equipped V6 engine NOT V8 engine, so it should be actually less than GS V8, which will be GS460 by the time GS450h comes out.
I also dont think there will be raise of prices when new engines come out, makes no sense - at least not for significant difference - right rockvville?
As to the pricing, I would expect 5k-6k difference from similary equipped V6 engine NOT V8 engine, so it should be actually less than GS V8, which will be GS460 by the time GS450h comes out.
I also dont think there will be raise of prices when new engines come out, makes no sense - at least not for significant difference - right rockvville?
03-20-05, 10:52 AM
#41
Lexus Test Driver
I hope that Spwolf is correct again
The advancements have development costs and the new all aluminum V6 surely costs more to produce than the cast iron/aluminum I6 that it replaced. That being said the 3.5 liter version should cost a little more but not much I hope. The GS450h is a variant of the GS350 but I'm not sure yet how different it will be. The MSRP has to be taken from a market context also and not just the production costing especially if Lexus wants to be aggressive in capturing market share from BMW. The fact that the GS450h is unique will give Lexus some prestige in techno prowess. The new BMW engines will come into play just before the Lexus versions so there will be a lot of jockeying for position. All of this development foreshadows a much higher priced LS460 or LS500h when it arrives eventually. In some ways a raise in price adds value if you can substantiate the quality level and performance. The LFA could be a bargain at $150,000 yet so could the new Corvette.
Last edited by Rockville; 03-20-05 at 11:08 AM.
03-20-05, 10:59 AM
#42
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Originally Posted by spwolf
Right, Avalon's engine is not direct injection - it is 2GR-SE.
03-20-05, 11:41 AM
#43
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I made this point in another thread, but thought it might be worth including here, too...
This isn't meant as an insult, but US buyers historically haven't had to be too concerned about emissions. Here in the UK, where drivers are taxed based on the CO2 emissions of their cars, we have to think a little deeper about the issue, regardless of whether you believe vehicular emissions are contributing to the various climatic patterns that are unfolding.
The RX400h produces 194g of CO2 per km. The petrol (sorry, gas) powered RX300 produces 288g/km. The hybrid driver will be taxed on 25% of the vehicle's list price, whereas the driver of the petrol RX will be taxed on the full 35%. That's quite a sizable difference.
It's not entirely inconceivable that other countries may begin to adopt a similar method of taxation. Then suddenly hybrid vehicles look a lot more useful.
This isn't meant as an insult, but US buyers historically haven't had to be too concerned about emissions. Here in the UK, where drivers are taxed based on the CO2 emissions of their cars, we have to think a little deeper about the issue, regardless of whether you believe vehicular emissions are contributing to the various climatic patterns that are unfolding.
The RX400h produces 194g of CO2 per km. The petrol (sorry, gas) powered RX300 produces 288g/km. The hybrid driver will be taxed on 25% of the vehicle's list price, whereas the driver of the petrol RX will be taxed on the full 35%. That's quite a sizable difference.
It's not entirely inconceivable that other countries may begin to adopt a similar method of taxation. Then suddenly hybrid vehicles look a lot more useful.
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