Tom2769

iTrader: (3)

I've been looking closely at GS350 F-Sports, and am leaning toward a '13 or '14 model as my next car purchase (wife's car, primarily, but I'll drive it some too). I own an ISF, so I am familiar with Lexus' reliability. I came to the ISF from a BMW 335i, so I'm also familiar enough with the BMW/Merc lack of reliability as miles accrue - thus I am not considering one of those. I generally buy cars with ~30-40K miles and drive them to (or a bit past) ~100k. A buddy of mine has a Volvo S60 T6 R-Design and loves it. I've never taken it seriously in the past (never driven it), but now that I'm looking for another car, thought I'd consider it. The main point that makes me consider the S60 T6 is the turbocharged I6 engine. I love my ISF, but it's power is made high in the RPM band, and I truly miss the low-rpm torque of a turbo I6. In R-Design trim the S60 makes 325HP and 354TQ, and can be bumped higher with reasonable effort. If the Volvo forums can be believed, they seem to have better reliability than the Germans (though probably not to the level of Lexus). I've yet to drive one - will drive my buddy's next time he's in town, but am interested in whether any of you GS driver have experience owning/driving the S60 T6 AWD (six cylinder only, and preferably an R-Design - their answer to F-Sport). I know this forum will be Lexus biased, but honest feedback/experiences are welcomed.

Riptide711

I just traded my R60 R-design for a GS 350 F sport. The Volvo was fast with very quick throttle response. It made me want to gun it all the time. Overall it was rough and was a wolf in sheep's clothing. 0 to 60 in the low 5's.

The Lexis is still fun to drive but is much more luxurious and much better built. Everything is smoother in the Lexus and a higher overall quality. (radio, gps, electronics, operating the windows and windows etc.) The gas mileage is about the same: 18 mpg.

The Lexus is better designed and built and has an outstanding reputation for quality and dependability.

Tom2769

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for the response, Rip. When you refer to the Volvo being rough and the GS being smooth, are you talking about the ride/suspension, or something beyond that? What model year was your S60?

CouveGS

Volvo is too small...I'm 6'3" and no one can sit behind me in the Volvo. Also im a big fan of Lexus interior materials, Volvo seems somewhat cheap to me (just my opinion). Love Volvo Turbo power though!

er34

I did also cross shop Volvo before unintentionally(dealer was beside Lexus). Build quality/materials is decent but just not to the same level of refinement as GS. Also I did not like the center console design. It feels like an early 2000s Mercedes with the dialer buttons.

CTNYC

I did look into a Volvo S60 Inscription with Platinum package (T5)

The Volvo drives very nicely, the FWD gas mileage was in the high 30s on the hwy for the T5, and the overall quality of the car is very nice and I like that it's an understated car, not a car that necessarily says I drive a $50k car. When I was shopping for new, the S60s had little incentives for purchase, but the lease incentives were unreal.

I negotiated a 2016 S60 Inscription w/ platinum pkg, BLIS, among a few others I don't remember off the top of my head (roughly $48k MSRP) down to around $350/month lease with 15k miles per year. $0 down, only first-month payment due at signing. Also, at the time, the incentives were different by region. The NYC tri-state (NJ/NY/CT) had an extra $2k incentive that the Mid Atlantic did not have.

The residuals were terrible; in the 40% range IIRC, but the incentives made the cap cost before tax on the $48k unit around $33k or so, whereas if you were purchasing, the price was around $40k. If there are deals like that still, go for it. However, if the prices are similar to the GS, I'd opt for the GS. The interior design of the S60 does feel a bit dated and odd to me, although the functions are all ergonomically designed imo.

Dallasguy1

Coming from a 535 I know exactly what you talking about, GS will bore you if drive it on the normal mode, you gotta drive it on the Sports + mode to get some kinda response out of it.

spoogenet

I did that cross-shopping and ended up buying my '14 GS. This was last summer, so the S80 was on the way out and the S90 not out yet. I looked at both the normal S60 and the S60 Inscription, which is the slightly longer wheelbase model made in China. I also have a XC60 and have been happy with it, which has the 3.0L T6 -- a true T6.

When I looked at the S60 last year, I was looking at used models with the T5/T6 before Volvo switched over to the 2.0L 4-cylinder models, which still carry the T5/T6 designations but different power ratings. Indeed with the 6-cylinder T6, Volvo tuned them nicely to have good low-end torque, which I really appreciate. The cars move fairly effortlessly and pair up nicely with their AWD system. The T5 is just too lacking for the weight of the car & AWD drivetrain.

I have not driven the newer ones, but considering the T5 @ 240hp and T6 @ 302hp both start with a 2.0L plant, I wouldn't expect the modern T6 to have as much upward tuning capability. I don't know how their low-end torque is, but the specs imply it's decent.

Volvo's controls are intuitive and ergonomic, generally with a focus on things that can easily be done by a driver without distracting from the road, such as dials instead of small push-buttons, etc. Without cluttering the dash with buttons, there's a button for anything you'll need on a regular basis.

Given I need a car seat, the S60 landed a bit on the small side. The S60 Inscription fixes the size issue a bit, but it's in the R-design.

Now for the ;tldr; summary in alphabetic order.

Dealerships -- Varies in your area. In mine, the Volvo dealers are mediocre at best. Lexus clearly wins here.
Drivetrain -- Lexus RWD/AWD or Volvo AWD. Cannot stand FWD.
Headlights -- Both. Adaptive headlights are the only option for me. Once you have 'em, can't go back.
Interior -- Lexus Volvo is nice, Lexus is nicer. R-design only comes with black interior, I wanted lighter. Lexus Luxury package gives tan headliner.
Made-in -- LexusJapan! I'm good with European-made Volvos, but no interest in a made-in-China car of any brand.
Noise level -- No clear winner. Between the cars I drove, similar. Once I replace my Dunlops, Lexus probably wins.
Ride comfort -- LexusAVS for fun, and pleasant ride. Volvo's slightly stiffer, but still a good ride.
Safety -- Volvo Hands down, Volvo makes the safest range of cars on the road. Good AWD, real-world designed safety (not just for the tests).
Sex appeal -- Lexus. My wife pushed for the Lexus for me.
Sound system -- No clear winner. Mark Levinson vs. Volvo's premium is (for me) not a huge difference. Lexus "premium" sound is no good, IMO.
Ventillated seats -- Lexus. I'm in Texas, y'all. Volvo has good seat heaters.

Love my GS and glad it's the option I chose.

Chiadon

Lexus premium sound system is no good? I definitely have a different opinion on that one. That's one of the best standard systems I have for her in a car

spoogenet

The beauty of sounds systems is no matter how much technical mumbo jumbo, the listener's ear is what determines the listener's opinion.