Kia's K900 seems to be plagerizing our GS style and features
04-17-14, 10:50 PM
#31
There's a reason why camry is priced the way it is and Lexus is priced the way it its... Two different build qualities IMO.... Everyone says Lexus is just a glorified Toyota but in the end Lexus has better designs, performance, features, and road presence. Period... 
04-18-14, 04:27 AM
#32
I think you may over-estimate the number of people that are this way. $60,000+ is a lot of money to spend on a car. Unless someone is the sort of person that has driven these cars for a long time and the badge no longer does anything for them...the badge plays a big part of it...as does the dealer experience. When someone gets to the station in life where they can drop this sort of coin on a car...its purchase is as much a validation of their own success as it is anything to do with the car. People who aren't car people and aren't focused on that sort of thing in my experience don't place enough value on a car at all to spend that sort of money.
Not that they won't sell them, they will...but they will never really be competitors to "real" luxury cars until they have that brand and that cachet. They'll always be "generic".
I mean, as long as I've been around luxury cars and as much as I would like to say the brand doesn't do much for me anymore...I couldn't bring myself to buy a Genesis over an ES...let alone a GS...and I don't know that I could do it with the Equus either.
Not that they won't sell them, they will...but they will never really be competitors to "real" luxury cars until they have that brand and that cachet. They'll always be "generic".
I mean, as long as I've been around luxury cars and as much as I would like to say the brand doesn't do much for me anymore...I couldn't bring myself to buy a Genesis over an ES...let alone a GS...and I don't know that I could do it with the Equus either.
I can afford the BMW with no problem now, but I retire in five years and will not be as interested in a $75,000 car. I'm comfortable, but not what I would call rich. It is going to be very tempting to buy a Genesis. But I freely admit that I'm a little swayed by the stigma of driving a Hyundai.
04-18-14, 06:49 AM
#33
Lexus Fanatic
Here's the question...would you rather have a V8 Genesis or a 6 cyl 535 or GS for more or less the same money? Personally? The V8 isn't that important.
04-18-14, 11:42 AM
#34
Lexus Test Driver
This is a little bit off topic, but I it kind of made me sad when I was doing a vehicle check recently on the 2015 Camry. It has most of the same features now as the GS but for a much lower price. They vehicles are miles apart in most cases and there is no way I could ever go back to owning a Camry again but it still hurts me to know that such a cheap car in comparison has most of the same technology available (LKA, radar cruise, pre-collision, blind spot monitoring) and even special things like the wireless charging for certain smart phones. I also noticed that the Camry came with Michelin MXM4 tires. My $61,000 Lexus only came with the horrible Dunlops. 
04-18-14, 12:40 PM
#35
Lexus Test Driver
I fully agree with you, and I'm conflicted by it. The pricing of the 2015 Genesis is finally announced. A fully load V8 lists for $55,000. In features and performance it is about equal to my BMW 550 which listed for about $76,000. An I'm sure the Genesis will be heavily discounted. That's a hell of a lot of money to save. And while I know the BMW will still be a little more refined, I think in the real world they will be very comparable….other than the badge.
I can afford the BMW with no problem now, but I retire in five years and will not be as interested in a $75,000 car. I'm comfortable, but not what I would call rich. It is going to be very tempting to buy a Genesis. But I freely admit that I'm a little swayed by the stigma of driving a Hyundai.
I can afford the BMW with no problem now, but I retire in five years and will not be as interested in a $75,000 car. I'm comfortable, but not what I would call rich. It is going to be very tempting to buy a Genesis. But I freely admit that I'm a little swayed by the stigma of driving a Hyundai.
I'm considering replacing my 2012 LS460L with either a loaded V8 Genesis or Equus. I can afford an S550 but I'm finding it difficult to justify the extra money. Maybe I'm becoming more Zen-like
as I move into my mid 40s. Things like a button that might feel a little better if I really think about it - just doesn't matter to me. Why should it?
04-18-14, 02:23 PM
#36
Let me answer this way. If Hyundai built an "M" competitor with 550 hp for $70,000 I'd probably buy it. I'm a serious speed freak.
04-18-14, 02:45 PM
#37
Lexus Test Driver
04-23-14, 12:06 AM
#38
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I've been in S.Korea 10 years ago and set in older models of Equus they are very reliable cars I think Hyundai reliability is better than BMW that's for sure. But down side of Hyundai cars is how it's drives and handles. Interior quality on lower models like Sonata feels really cheap.
04-25-14, 06:07 AM
#39
From roll up windows to power windows and HIDs. The price creeps up each time you add an accessory so eventually they will apply the fuzzy logic of high price equals quality and luxury. LOL. I think they already did that but they were not the first to do it and they won't be the last. Nice commercial for the K900 though.
05-07-14, 10:02 AM
#40
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There was a time when people went shopping for TV, Sony was on top of their list, not anymore, Samsung & LG (both Korean) pretty much dominate the market. There was a time when people went shopping for cell phone, Motorola was on top of their list, not anymore. Samsung is right up there with Apple now. Same thing for kitchen appliances. And a similar thing is starting to happen or has already happened in car market.
If it means anything, I've never given much thought about Lexus GS. Actually when I was driving BMW or MB, Lexus just seemed...Japanese cars at most to put it mildly. After driving GS for a while, my perception of Lexus has changes quite a bit. But I still don't think Lexus has the kind of prestige that BMW or MB commands. And it will be matter of time Korean car makers catch up to that semi-prestige status, IMO.
If it means anything, I've never given much thought about Lexus GS. Actually when I was driving BMW or MB, Lexus just seemed...Japanese cars at most to put it mildly. After driving GS for a while, my perception of Lexus has changes quite a bit. But I still don't think Lexus has the kind of prestige that BMW or MB commands. And it will be matter of time Korean car makers catch up to that semi-prestige status, IMO.
05-07-14, 04:46 PM
#41
Lexus Fanatic
The difference is you don't have a differential between "luxury" and "mainstream" brands in the TV market. I have every confidence that the Koreans could be successful in the luxury market...but to have meaningful success in that market in the US they need a luxury nameplate and brand. Thats just a reality. Elsewhere in the world its not as much of an issue, but for brand focused and image conscious America...it is.
05-07-14, 06:02 PM
#42
From roll up windows to power windows and HIDs. The price creeps up each time you add an accessory so eventually they will apply the fuzzy logic of high price equals quality and luxury. LOL. I think they already did that but they were not the first to do it and they won't be the last. Nice commercial for the K900 though.
reminds me of samsungs marketing. Koreans sure know how to market their product
05-07-14, 07:17 PM
#43
Lexus Champion
I know exactly what you mean. Yes, a top tier luxury car is going to be a little more refined and it's going to get you more respect on the road (that's just the way life is) but a fully loaded 2015 V8 Genesis is a very tempting proposition. That V8 comes with a few extras that the V6 doesn't come with (19 inch wheels, adjustable suspension, led fog lights, quad tipped exhaust and a few other minor details).
I'm considering replacing my 2012 LS460L with either a loaded V8 Genesis or Equus. I can afford an S550 but I'm finding it difficult to justify the extra money. Maybe I'm becoming more Zen-like as I move into my mid 40s. Things like a button that might feel a little better if I really think about it - just doesn't matter to me. Why should it?
I'm considering replacing my 2012 LS460L with either a loaded V8 Genesis or Equus. I can afford an S550 but I'm finding it difficult to justify the extra money. Maybe I'm becoming more Zen-like
as I move into my mid 40s. Things like a button that might feel a little better if I really think about it - just doesn't matter to me. Why should it?There is a reason Hyundai can sell their cars more cheaply. They haven't invested in the dealership experience and support that come with establishing a separate, upscale brand. My Lexus dealer is in a decent part of Dallas, along with MB, BMW, Audi and Infiniti. I know that when I go there I will be treated as a valued customer and will be with like-minded people. Conversely, the closest Hyundai dealer is in Mesquite (not the same demographics), along with Mazda, Ford, etc. So for me, it's not just the car but the entire experience that comes with owning it. If you can get past being shoved into the waiting room by service people who treat you the same as Accent and Sonata owners, I'm sure the Genesis will be a great choice.
One other supporting point... I actually built a 2015 Genesis to my liking and sent the request for a test drive via the Hyundai website to Hyundai of Mesquite. Along with that, a Kelly Black Book estimate for my trade was generated from that same site. Wouldn't you think they would want to snag a Lexus owner? Well, that was last weekend, and I've yet to hear from anyone at Hyundai. I did the same when the new IS350 was introduced and received a reply from the Lexus salesperson the next day asking me to come in for a test drive. If that is any indication of the support and responsiveness that can be expected of Hyundai, they still have a long way to go to earn my business.
Last edited by dseag2; 05-07-14 at 07:24 PM.
05-07-14, 07:47 PM
#44
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This is a little bit off topic, but I it kind of made me sad when I was doing a vehicle check recently on the 2015 Camry. It has most of the same features now as the GS but for a much lower price. They vehicles are miles apart in most cases and there is no way I could ever go back to owning a Camry again but it still hurts me to know that such a cheap car in comparison has most of the same technology available (LKA, radar cruise, pre-collision, blind spot monitoring) and even special things like the wireless charging for certain smart phones. I also noticed that the Camry came with Michelin MXM4 tires. My $61,000 Lexus only came with the horrible Dunlops.
05-07-14, 07:49 PM
#45
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I fully agree with you, and I'm conflicted by it. The pricing of the 2015 Genesis is finally announced. A fully load V8 lists for $55,000. In features and performance it is about equal to my BMW 550 which listed for about $76,000. An I'm sure the Genesis will be heavily discounted. That's a hell of a lot of money to save. And while I know the BMW will still be a little more refined, I think in the real world they will be very comparable….other than the badge.
I can afford the BMW with no problem now, but I retire in five years and will not be as interested in a $75,000 car. I'm comfortable, but not what I would call rich. It is going to be very tempting to buy a Genesis. But I freely admit that I'm a little swayed by the stigma of driving a Hyundai.
I can afford the BMW with no problem now, but I retire in five years and will not be as interested in a $75,000 car. I'm comfortable, but not what I would call rich. It is going to be very tempting to buy a Genesis. But I freely admit that I'm a little swayed by the stigma of driving a Hyundai.