Am I the only one that thinks the Mark Levinson system in our car sucks?
06-20-14, 06:53 PM
#93
Lexus Test Driver
I mean, it's no Audio Research system that's in my 3rd Bentley, custom made by David Johnson, full tube amp setup, but hey, for a cheap lux sedan, it's alright.
06-20-14, 08:39 PM
#94
Lexus Fanatic
06-21-14, 11:05 PM
#95
Here are some pages from my Lexus 3GS350 Manufacturer's 6 Volume Workshop Manual.
The simplist fix is to bypass the manufacturer's Mark Levinson amplifier under the boot lining, and install a much more powerful aftermarket amplifier.
Remember that loudness is proportional to the Wattage, to the power of three!
Thus, we must increase the Wattage 8 times, just to double the volume!
Hence, we want something many times greater than the OEM's 300 odd Watts.
900 Watts RMS would be good, considering that the 4GS has 835 Watts.
And don't worry about blowing up your speakers!
We will never crank the signal to its maximum.
The powerful amps work by not having to work hard, therefore less distortion.
The big amps work by working effortlessly to produce their power, hence no, or little distortion.
It's like comparing a lazy V8, versus a raucous in-line four working its guts out.
In the world of audio, the max output of the amp must be much higher than the max output of the speakers, so that the amp can work "effortlessly", at a fraction of its max capacity - free from distortion, to produce its power.
Of course, if you do really crank up the volume dial to generate a stronger millivoltage signal from the head unit, you will get more amplification from the amplifier in the boot, that can damage your speakers, but no one cranks the volume dial up to that level.
You could purchase a genuine 2012-19 4GS 835 Watt Mark Levinson amp from Lexus Sewell, but it would probably cost you an arm and a leg, and it will most probably not fit under your 3GS boot.
Best buy an aftermarket amplifier - many makes and models to choose from, but 900 Watts from a reputable manufacturer would be good.
Bolt the new aftermarket amp to the back of the rear seat back rest, in the boot.
You could change the speakers, but much more labor.
If you weren't satisfied with the amp upgrade, then the next step is to change all the speakers, but I'm sure most will be happy with a much more powerful aftermarket amplifier.
The Mark Levinson 300 Watt OEM amplifier under the boot lining is tiny.
Look at these photocopies from my Workshop Manual...
I do notice that you have a 2013 4GS with 835 Watts of power; it should sound wonderful.
Get it checked out.
Bring along your favorite 2-channel stereo CD and 5.1 channel surround DVD with music recorded in genuine Dolby Digital 5.1, and play it back to back, and side to side with another 2013 4GS at the dealership.
Compare your 4GS with the 4GS at the dealership.
If your 2013 4GS has no fault, and you still don't like the sound, then perhaps you are very picky/discerning, and you will need to actually change the speakers first.
The speakers are the weakness in the GS, because Mark Levinson does not really make speakers.
Mark Levinson does not specialize in speakers.
The GS will most probably use a generic brand of speakers.
And if not happy with the aftermarket speakers, then upgrade the 835 Watt 2013 4GS Mark Levinson amplifier.
The head unit of the GS with the digital radio, DVD player etc, normally puts out a very clean signal - just as well, because it isn't really upgradeable, without a lot of aftermarket modifications...
The simplist fix is to bypass the manufacturer's Mark Levinson amplifier under the boot lining, and install a much more powerful aftermarket amplifier.
Remember that loudness is proportional to the Wattage, to the power of three!
Thus, we must increase the Wattage 8 times, just to double the volume!
Hence, we want something many times greater than the OEM's 300 odd Watts.
900 Watts RMS would be good, considering that the 4GS has 835 Watts.
And don't worry about blowing up your speakers!
We will never crank the signal to its maximum.
The powerful amps work by not having to work hard, therefore less distortion.
The big amps work by working effortlessly to produce their power, hence no, or little distortion.
It's like comparing a lazy V8, versus a raucous in-line four working its guts out.
In the world of audio, the max output of the amp must be much higher than the max output of the speakers, so that the amp can work "effortlessly", at a fraction of its max capacity - free from distortion, to produce its power.
Of course, if you do really crank up the volume dial to generate a stronger millivoltage signal from the head unit, you will get more amplification from the amplifier in the boot, that can damage your speakers, but no one cranks the volume dial up to that level.
You could purchase a genuine 2012-19 4GS 835 Watt Mark Levinson amp from Lexus Sewell, but it would probably cost you an arm and a leg, and it will most probably not fit under your 3GS boot.
Best buy an aftermarket amplifier - many makes and models to choose from, but 900 Watts from a reputable manufacturer would be good.
Bolt the new aftermarket amp to the back of the rear seat back rest, in the boot.
You could change the speakers, but much more labor.
If you weren't satisfied with the amp upgrade, then the next step is to change all the speakers, but I'm sure most will be happy with a much more powerful aftermarket amplifier.
The Mark Levinson 300 Watt OEM amplifier under the boot lining is tiny.
Look at these photocopies from my Workshop Manual...
I do notice that you have a 2013 4GS with 835 Watts of power; it should sound wonderful.
Get it checked out.
Bring along your favorite 2-channel stereo CD and 5.1 channel surround DVD with music recorded in genuine Dolby Digital 5.1, and play it back to back, and side to side with another 2013 4GS at the dealership.
Compare your 4GS with the 4GS at the dealership.
If your 2013 4GS has no fault, and you still don't like the sound, then perhaps you are very picky/discerning, and you will need to actually change the speakers first.
The speakers are the weakness in the GS, because Mark Levinson does not really make speakers.
Mark Levinson does not specialize in speakers.
The GS will most probably use a generic brand of speakers.
And if not happy with the aftermarket speakers, then upgrade the 835 Watt 2013 4GS Mark Levinson amplifier.
The head unit of the GS with the digital radio, DVD player etc, normally puts out a very clean signal - just as well, because it isn't really upgradeable, without a lot of aftermarket modifications...
Anyone have wiring diagram for the ML amp? I'm planning on getting a sub... 10" sub is terrible.
06-21-14, 11:25 PM
#96
can someone explain the input range? I may replace these speakers and match the impedence but don't know what the input range means. Also, is the ML speakers special?... if I put a matching ohm aftermaket speakers in there, will the amp oem amp push it to equal levels?
Last edited by sam430; 06-21-14 at 11:29 PM.
06-22-14, 05:34 PM
#98
If the 5LS do get an upgraded amp, we can probably use it. Just need to upgrade the power and ground. Hopefully the use the same amount of speakers to match current system.
The sub is the weakest point in our system. The door midbass sounds good enough. The tweet is too bright for my taste.
The sub is the weakest point in our system. The door midbass sounds good enough. The tweet is too bright for my taste.
07-02-14, 08:40 PM
#101
I'm a retired audiophile (meaning I have a home theater system that is designed around listening to stereo music first, and cost me more than my 20% down payment on my car).
I found the sound system in the car is surprisingly good. Normally when I get in a car I automatically lower the treble, bump the base a notch or two and maybe drop the mids a notch as well. I did this without thinking after a phone call and my experience with my SC430 ML system.
After throwing on some quality music I realized the sound was distorted, so I undid all tweaks I'd added. Turns out that the system sounds best without any mods, and sounds fantastic. If you think yours sounds bad, either you have a bad car, or your idea of 'good/great' isn't anywhere near what an audiophile is looking for in a sound system. Nothing wrong with that, but like most Americans you probably want more base and a brighter sound from the tweeters.
I found the sound system in the car is surprisingly good. Normally when I get in a car I automatically lower the treble, bump the base a notch or two and maybe drop the mids a notch as well. I did this without thinking after a phone call and my experience with my SC430 ML system.
After throwing on some quality music I realized the sound was distorted, so I undid all tweaks I'd added. Turns out that the system sounds best without any mods, and sounds fantastic. If you think yours sounds bad, either you have a bad car, or your idea of 'good/great' isn't anywhere near what an audiophile is looking for in a sound system. Nothing wrong with that, but like most Americans you probably want more base and a brighter sound from the tweeters.
Last edited by Christobol; 07-02-14 at 09:54 PM.
07-02-14, 10:48 PM
#103
nah,...I think it's ok. Not that great. He's not the only one lol. The Lows are truely missing...mids are great. I thought about slapping an MS-8 for the front channels... for sure, I'm adding the lows. My BM MKIV just came in (I didn't want to add too much weights).
07-02-14, 11:11 PM
#104
......Turns out that the system sounds best without any mods, and sounds fantastic. If you think yours sounds bad, either you have a bad car, or your idea of 'good/great' isn't anywhere near what an audiophile is looking for in a sound system. Nothing wrong with that, but like most Americans you probably want more base and a brighter sound from the tweeters.
And to answer your question, no you are not alone. Main stream consumer will think ML sucks. I dont think it sucks but I did get what I paid for.
My audio-video system (as audio BW and as video Pioneer) costed as much as my lux 450H. Thats why I cant complain based on what I have achieved in what I subjectively selected and assembled in my homes ecosystem.
A car is an ecosystem as well, on wheels. Your appreciating depends on how much time you spend in this ecosystem. I would say someone driving 4 hours a day differs from someone with 30 min a day. Thus perception of what audio can achieve differs as well.
07-03-14, 09:44 AM
#105
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I found the sound system in the car is surprisingly good. Normally when I get in a car I automatically lower the treble, bump the base a notch or two and maybe drop the mids a notch as well. I did this without thinking after a phone call and my experience with my SC430 ML system.
After throwing on some quality music I realized the sound was distorted, so I undid all tweaks I'd added. Turns out that the system sounds best without any mods, and sounds fantastic. If you think yours sounds bad, either you have a bad car, or your idea of 'good/great' isn't anywhere near what an audiophile is looking for in a sound system. Nothing wrong with that, but like most Americans you probably want more base and a brighter sound from the tweeters.
