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2019 Lexus ES 300h - Rear speaker problem

 
Old 10-13-18, 02:36 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by reposado2 View Post
Hmmm only 10-20% of the sound from the back sounds horrible... Lacking the "surround sound" feel in the cabin takes a lot away from the music. I'll need to test it out at the dealership before I commit to buy.
Our RX sound system is pretty much like that as well. The rear passengers dont get great sound.
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Old 10-13-18, 05:42 PM
  #17  
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Simple solution to rear speaker fader issues, just move the steering wheel to the back seat.
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Old 10-14-18, 08:42 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by SuperMido View Post
The ones I've experienced are Infiniti and Benz. Infiniti with its Bose is GARBAGE/JUNK stay away from that if you're looking for Audio quality.

Benz, I've been in the new E class with the $4500.00 Burmester upgrade. That is a whole different experience, and NO other car can even rival it...It blew me away. I sat in the Lexus LS500 with ML 23 speakers and didn't even hold a candle to the E class Burmester. I wonder what the S-class is like with the $6500 Burmester upgrade. Lol
I have the opposite experience lol. I thought the Burmester sounded overly boosted and saturated, after a while my ears git fatigued from all the high frequency.
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Old 12-22-18, 10:01 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by VLexus22 View Post
I also just purchased the 2019 ES 350 and this is my 3rd one in a row, 2011 and 2105 owned before. I was so excited to get this car! Test drove it, without listening to the Stereo, bought it, took delivery and then turned on the radio for the first time...I was really upset that the Fader wasn't working and have made it a huge issue to the dealership. It is going in for service on 10/15 to do a diagonsitc test...but it seems this is actually designed this way, which I am driving around without the radio on because I absolutely hate the sound system.

So the question is how do you upgrade the sound system to allow for rear speakers to work properly for a balanced sound? I was told you can't just swamp out the speakers in the back because of the new digital stereo system. The only advice I have gotten so far is to add a subwoofer box in the trunk with a seperate amp and a bass tuner **** in the front off the console.

The last thing I wanted to do is turn a brand new car into some ghetto street ride! This also does not have a surround sound feel to it either....the other thing i'm thinking about is playing Pandora from my phone and bluetooth to a Bose portable speaker in the car. I really hope Lexus can come up with a way to configure the digital computer to add more fader for the rear.
I found this thread searching Google for rear speaker issues on the 2019 ES 350. Very disappointed to see that Lexus has not acknowledged this... and it was not something I tested before purchasing the car... but the back speakers are basically useless. This is not a matter of "perfection" but on par with broken.

My question for you VLexus22 is in regards to the red highlighted part in your message.

Could you elaborate more on why the digital stereo system would not allow for aftermarket speakers?

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Old 12-23-18, 02:35 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by SciGuy View Post
I found this thread searching Google for rear speaker issues on the 2019 ES 350. Very disappointed to see that Lexus has not acknowledged this... and it was not something I tested before purchasing the car... but the back speakers are basically useless. This is not a matter of "perfection" but on par with broken.

My question for you VLexus22 is in regards to the red highlighted part in your message.

Could you elaborate more on why the digital stereo system would not allow for aftermarket speakers?
If the size of the speaker and ohm loads were the same, the speakers could be swapped.

Digital has nothing to do with swapping speakers.
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Old 12-23-18, 02:38 PM
  #21  
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How is swapping speakers going to help? Correct me if I am wrong It's the lack of power going into the rear speakers that is the problem. If anything either 1)Add speakers to the rear or 2) add power to the existing rear speakers.

Either way its a hot mess and as someone who dislike hassel Id rather not mess with the electrical on a new 50k car.
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Old 12-23-18, 02:55 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by 95bat View Post
If the size of the speaker and ohm loads were the same, the speakers could be swapped.

Digital has nothing to do with swapping speakers.
Originally Posted by reposado2 View Post
How is swapping speakers going to help? Correct me if I am wrong It's the lack of power going into the rear speakers that is the problem. If anything either 1)Add speakers to the rear or 2) add power to the existing rear speakers.

Either way its a hot mess and as someone who dislike hassel Id rather not mess with the electrical on a new 50k car.
My thoughts exactly on both of your posts. It seems like it is a software issue limiting how much power is going to the rear speakers. Even cheap small speakers are louder than this (given the right amount of current).

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Old 12-23-18, 03:12 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by SciGuy View Post
My thoughts exactly on both of your posts. It seems like it is a software issue limiting how much power is going to the rear speakers. Even cheap small speakers are louder than this (given the right amount of current).
Yes. Its either a software and/or electrical type problem. You can get the current rear speakers plenty loud by placing the fader all the way towards the back and turning up the volume. Lexus has the sound system set up where 90% of the sound is either coming from the front OR back, not both, so no matter how you tweak it it'll feel unbalanced and lack immersion. Stupid IMO.

Such a shame especially since I feel the speakers itself is decent quality and produces nice clear sounds. I just dont want to hear all of it from 1 foot in front of my face.
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Old 12-24-18, 08:52 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by reposado2 View Post
Yes. Its either a software and/or electrical type problem. You can get the current rear speakers plenty loud by placing the fader all the way towards the back and turning up the volume. Lexus has the sound system set up where 90% of the sound is either coming from the front OR back, not both, so no matter how you tweak it it'll feel unbalanced and lack immersion. Stupid IMO.

Such a shame especially since I feel the speakers itself is decent quality and produces nice clear sounds. I just dont want to hear all of it from 1 foot in front of my face.
I've been saying it all along... the system is working as designed and as many "audiophile" systems operate, with a front sound stage. Cars that compete for sound quality awards don't have rear speakers at all most of the time. The system is far from unbalanced because all the speakers aren't blasting as loudly as they can. All of these people are just learning an expensive lesson--they should have listened to it before they bought it.
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Old 12-24-18, 11:06 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by 95bat View Post
I've been saying it all along... the system is working as designed and as many "audiophile" systems operate, with a front sound stage. Cars that compete for sound quality awards don't have rear speakers at all most of the time. The system is far from unbalanced because all the speakers aren't blasting as loudly as they can. All of these people are just learning an expensive lesson--they should have listened to it before they bought it.
I've been listening to the USB stick and have to see the sound quality is the best I've ever heard in a car. Perhaps I haven't been around enough but doesn't bother me one bit.
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Old 12-24-18, 01:49 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by 95bat View Post
I've been saying it all along... the system is working as designed and as many "audiophile" systems operate, with a front sound stage. Cars that compete for sound quality awards don't have rear speakers at all most of the time. The system is far from unbalanced because all the speakers aren't blasting as loudly as they can. All of these people are just learning an expensive lesson--they should have listened to it before they bought it.
I partly agree about there being a lesson in the sense that going forward in life, I will always check the audio and balance in future vehicles... but I disagree that we should have listened to it before purchasing because of how obscure the issue is. Checking the rear speakers is not something most people would think to do, so while there is a lesson for the future, it is not a lesson that should have been learned beforehand.

Using that logic of "should have" is essentially using hindsight as 20/20... we can apply that logic to every random issue we have in life no matter how obscure... that does not make it fair. There is only so much research we can do before we make a decision.

Also using cars that compete in audio competitions is an invalid point. The people sitting in the back seat of the car are not entering a competition, and they want to listen to music equally with the people in the front.

By your logic, perhaps Lexus should have removed the seat belts in the back seats, maybe the seats themselves... and might as well remove the air vents back there too since "front stage" air is all that is needed for the driver... forget about the passenger.

And lastly... you say that the car is far from imbalanced and that people only think something is wrong because the speakers aren't blasting at max volume. This is an unfair statement as well.

The speakers have hardly any sound coming out at all when faders are balanced on the screen. No one is looking for max volume from the back speakers, they are looking for balance or some sound...
When imperceptible sound is coming from the back, that is completely imbalanced.

I wrote this long message because I feel your post does a disservice to the problem people are having and undermines legitimate complaints with a bit of "should have known" and "people are exaggerating". Perhaps I should make a Youtube video displaying my personal experience with the audio so that there is no misunderstandings or assumption of exaggeration.
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Old 12-24-18, 02:27 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by SciGuy View Post
I partly agree about there being a lesson in the sense that going forward in life, I will always check the audio and balance in future vehicles... but I disagree that we should have listened to it before purchasing because of how obscure the issue is. Checking the rear speakers is not something most people would think to do, so while there is a lesson for the future, it is not a lesson that should have been learned beforehand.

Using that logic of "should have" is essentially using hindsight as 20/20... we can apply that logic to every random issue we have in life no matter how obscure... that does not make it fair. There is only so much research we can do before we make a decision.

Also using cars that compete in audio competitions is an invalid point. The people sitting in the back seat of the car are not entering a competition, and they want to listen to music equally with the people in the front.

By your logic, perhaps Lexus should have removed the seat belts in the back seats, maybe the seats themselves... and might as well remove the air vents back there too since "front stage" air is all that is needed for the driver... forget about the passenger.

And lastly... you say that the car is far from imbalanced and that people only think something is wrong because the speakers aren't blasting at max volume. This is an unfair statement as well.

The speakers have hardly any sound coming out at all when faders are balanced on the screen. No one is looking for max volume from the back speakers, they are looking for balance or some sound...
When imperceptible sound is coming from the back, that is completely imbalanced.

I wrote this long message because I feel your post does a disservice to the problem people are having and undermines legitimate complaints with a bit of "should have known" and "people are exaggerating". Perhaps I should make a Youtube video displaying my personal experience with the audio so that there is no misunderstandings or assumption of exaggeration.
Before I ordered my 2019 ES I test drove several times and listened to both the Pioneer and Mark Levinson systems. I didn't test from the backseat but from the front seat I didn't notice any imbalance between the front and back. Maybe it wasn't perfectly balanced but it wasn't enough for be imperceptible. I absolutely heard music from the back on both systems.

I ended up getting the Mark Levinson mainly because of how much better XM sounded compared to the Pioneer system. I'll do more testing and try from the backseat when my car is delivered in February.
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Old 12-24-18, 03:03 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by jimv1983 View Post
Before I ordered my 2019 ES I test drove several times and listened to both the Pioneer and Mark Levinson systems. I didn't test from the backseat but from the front seat I didn't notice any imbalance between the front and back. Maybe it wasn't perfectly balanced but it wasn't enough for be imperceptible. I absolutely heard music from the back on both systems.

I ended up getting the Mark Levinson mainly because of how much better XM sounded compared to the Pioneer system. I'll do more testing and try from the backseat when my car is delivered in February.
I will do a recording this week (Wednesday most likely) of the back seat speakers, hopefully I can properly display the problem through video.
If I had to guess, it sounds like the back speakers have around 5% sound, maybe 10% sound when faders are balanced.
Also not sure if this is a widespread issue or only with certain cars, so that may lead to further confusion.
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Old 12-24-18, 06:22 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by SciGuy View Post
I partly agree about there being a lesson in the sense that going forward in life, I will always check the audio and balance in future vehicles... but I disagree that we should have listened to it before purchasing because of how obscure the issue is. Checking the rear speakers is not something most people would think to do, so while there is a lesson for the future, it is not a lesson that should have been learned beforehand.

Using that logic of "should have" is essentially using hindsight as 20/20... we can apply that logic to every random issue we have in life no matter how obscure... that does not make it fair. There is only so much research we can do before we make a decision.

Also using cars that compete in audio competitions is an invalid point. The people sitting in the back seat of the car are not entering a competition, and they want to listen to music equally with the people in the front.

By your logic, perhaps Lexus should have removed the seat belts in the back seats, maybe the seats themselves... and might as well remove the air vents back there too since "front stage" air is all that is needed for the driver... forget about the passenger.

And lastly... you say that the car is far from imbalanced and that people only think something is wrong because the speakers aren't blasting at max volume. This is an unfair statement as well.

The speakers have hardly any sound coming out at all when faders are balanced on the screen. No one is looking for max volume from the back speakers, they are looking for balance or some sound...
When imperceptible sound is coming from the back, that is completely imbalanced.

I wrote this long message because I feel your post does a disservice to the problem people are having and undermines legitimate complaints with a bit of "should have known" and "people are exaggerating". Perhaps I should make a Youtube video displaying my personal experience with the audio so that there is no misunderstandings or assumption of exaggeration.
I'm not here to argue with internet champions, just trying to help. If you're looking for a quick fix for 'imperceptible sound' from rear speakers, there isn't one. As I said before, working as designed. Scroll up to the graphic of the speaker size/location in the ES. There is a 3.5" speaker in each rear door and that's it. If you were wanting something louder for rear passengers, you won't get that from a little 3.5" speaker. The 'little brother' Toyota Avalon JBL system put 6" speakers in the rear instead of 3.5" speakers. Maybe that car could have been an option for you if more rear sound is that important.

Go ahead and make your video, hope that makes you feel better about your purchase.
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Old 12-25-18, 08:56 AM
  #30  
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It's my opinion, after having the new car for about three weeks, that the ML audio system is about on par with the Pioneer system I had in my 2013 ES. I expected more and would not have ordered the upgraded ML audio if I knew it's quality. Alas, one must take it if buying an UL model Lexus. I am disappointed in the sound but agree that it is operating as designed.
I don't hear the crisp and clean music that I expected. I tried CD's, a flash drive, and XM. The best sound is from a CD IMO. I turned off the surround as a suggestion from Mike 728 but still don't hear what I believe should be coming from all those speakers. I must say that I did expect more from Lexus in a new generation redesigned vehicle. Unfortunately, I didn't have the opportunity to sit and listen to a ML system before I ordered the car as none were available. I took the pros and cons from this forum and decided to go ahead. I would also add that the measurement of sound quality, IMO, is a subjective thing and is different to various people.

Merry Christmas to all the members of CL and a healthy, happy New Year...
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