Oil Change Interval
07-19-17, 08:01 AM
#31
Thanks for the info danielTRLK. Better to be safe than sorry I guess, I wouldn't push a 10k OCI unless I was running the bits you mentioned or I didn't care if the car was going to make it to 100k miles. Maybe this particular forum has more people taking good care of their cars and keeping them for a long time.
Though to tell without UOA, since everyone drives differently, lives in different areas, has different fuel, etc. I think on average 6-7,000 is a good start and with one UOA you can determine what setup you need to run to make it to 10K clean. You don't need to be doing UOA every oil change, once every 2 years for an ES is fantastic just to keep your investment safe. Good UOA will pick up bad spark plugs, timing chains, O2 sensors and a lot more. I can not only pick these things up before a technician can and call them out 30,000 miles before they see them, often time, the techs will never know.
Worst case, I hate to say it, but take my blanket recommendations if you don't have time or interest, it's better than just going blind into the wall.
07-19-17, 09:26 AM
#32
A lot of oil discussions start looking like OCD in certain individuals to me and starts to just become a waste of time and energy.
The few problems in modern cars with oil sludge is almost always a design defect that the manufacture is responsible for. More frequent oil changes is a bandaid that may extend it out, but its not the fault of the oil formulation.
Lexus/Toyota had a problem with sludge in the past, and they settled a class action law suit because they screwed up the engine design with something like the crankcase ventilation But even then, it was like 1% of engines had the problem and I can almost guarantee you most of the time it was probably straight up neglect.
You would be amazed how many individuals would do crazy things like not even change the oil. Period. I had relative that lost an engine this way, just basically went a few years on it until the engine seized.
I still say most of these cars will be rotting in a salvage yard well before any sort of difference between changing it at 7k miles or 10k miles, etc. Maybe a 5k mile oil change theoretically allows the engine to go 400k miles instead of 350k miles, but who cares. You could have bought a new engine with the oil costs savings and almost nobody drives it that long anyway.
I've owned a ridiculous amount of cars with really high miles and I've never had an expensive oil analysis done. It's a waste of money.
The few problems in modern cars with oil sludge is almost always a design defect that the manufacture is responsible for. More frequent oil changes is a bandaid that may extend it out, but its not the fault of the oil formulation.
Lexus/Toyota had a problem with sludge in the past, and they settled a class action law suit because they screwed up the engine design with something like the crankcase ventilation But even then, it was like 1% of engines had the problem and I can almost guarantee you most of the time it was probably straight up neglect.
You would be amazed how many individuals would do crazy things like not even change the oil. Period. I had relative that lost an engine this way, just basically went a few years on it until the engine seized.
I still say most of these cars will be rotting in a salvage yard well before any sort of difference between changing it at 7k miles or 10k miles, etc. Maybe a 5k mile oil change theoretically allows the engine to go 400k miles instead of 350k miles, but who cares. You could have bought a new engine with the oil costs savings and almost nobody drives it that long anyway.
I've owned a ridiculous amount of cars with really high miles and I've never had an expensive oil analysis done. It's a waste of money.
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jollick (07-19-17)
07-19-17, 09:45 AM
#33
Within first 500-1000 miles. try the M1EP, you should be able to pull off at 6-7,000 with a good filter and gas.
Yes, the 10K OCI is feasible, but as mentioned, not on crap fuel, oil and filtration. Well most here have N/A engines which can take much more abuse than the new turbo charged DI engines. Anyone who spends time here is going to take care of their vehicle. I have found the difference of running a clean 10,000 vs. a dirty 10K over the span of 100,000 miles to cost less than $300, which includes one UOA per 100,000 miles. Often times people say, I really don't know if I can afford a better oil, but the following week their signature mentions how they upgraded to $2,000 rims. If you take the cost to "upgrade" your oil, filters and fuel and calculate the fuel economy improvements, it's well over $1,000 over a span of 100,000 miles. If you were to get a valve cleaning at 100,000 miles, you'd be well over what it would have taken to just keep that thing clean in the beginning. Even if you kept for only 100,000, if you spend $300 to save $1000 & increase lifespan & reduce maintenance cost, is it worth it?
Though to tell without UOA, since everyone drives differently, lives in different areas, has different fuel, etc. I think on average 6-7,000 is a good start and with one UOA you can determine what setup you need to run to make it to 10K clean. You don't need to be doing UOA every oil change, once every 2 years for an ES is fantastic just to keep your investment safe. Good UOA will pick up bad spark plugs, timing chains, O2 sensors and a lot more. I can not only pick these things up before a technician can and call them out 30,000 miles before they see them, often time, the techs will never know.
Worst case, I hate to say it, but take my blanket recommendations if you don't have time or interest, it's better than just going blind into the wall.
Yes, the 10K OCI is feasible, but as mentioned, not on crap fuel, oil and filtration. Well most here have N/A engines which can take much more abuse than the new turbo charged DI engines. Anyone who spends time here is going to take care of their vehicle. I have found the difference of running a clean 10,000 vs. a dirty 10K over the span of 100,000 miles to cost less than $300, which includes one UOA per 100,000 miles. Often times people say, I really don't know if I can afford a better oil, but the following week their signature mentions how they upgraded to $2,000 rims. If you take the cost to "upgrade" your oil, filters and fuel and calculate the fuel economy improvements, it's well over $1,000 over a span of 100,000 miles. If you were to get a valve cleaning at 100,000 miles, you'd be well over what it would have taken to just keep that thing clean in the beginning. Even if you kept for only 100,000, if you spend $300 to save $1000 & increase lifespan & reduce maintenance cost, is it worth it?
Though to tell without UOA, since everyone drives differently, lives in different areas, has different fuel, etc. I think on average 6-7,000 is a good start and with one UOA you can determine what setup you need to run to make it to 10K clean. You don't need to be doing UOA every oil change, once every 2 years for an ES is fantastic just to keep your investment safe. Good UOA will pick up bad spark plugs, timing chains, O2 sensors and a lot more. I can not only pick these things up before a technician can and call them out 30,000 miles before they see them, often time, the techs will never know.
Worst case, I hate to say it, but take my blanket recommendations if you don't have time or interest, it's better than just going blind into the wall.
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Coulter (07-19-17)
07-19-17, 04:02 PM
#34
A lot of oil discussions start looking like OCD in certain individuals to me and starts to just become a waste of time and energy.
The few problems in modern cars with oil sludge is almost always a design defect that the manufacture is responsible for. More frequent oil changes is a bandaid that may extend it out, but its not the fault of the oil formulation.
Lexus/Toyota had a problem with sludge in the past, and they settled a class action law suit because they screwed up the engine design with something like the crankcase ventilation But even then, it was like 1% of engines had the problem and I can almost guarantee you most of the time it was probably straight up neglect.
You would be amazed how many individuals would do crazy things like not even change the oil. Period. I had relative that lost an engine this way, just basically went a few years on it until the engine seized.
I still say most of these cars will be rotting in a salvage yard well before any sort of difference between changing it at 7k miles or 10k miles, etc. Maybe a 5k mile oil change theoretically allows the engine to go 400k miles instead of 350k miles, but who cares. You could have bought a new engine with the oil costs savings and almost nobody drives it that long anyway.
I've owned a ridiculous amount of cars with really high miles and I've never had an expensive oil analysis done. It's a waste of money.
The few problems in modern cars with oil sludge is almost always a design defect that the manufacture is responsible for. More frequent oil changes is a bandaid that may extend it out, but its not the fault of the oil formulation.
Lexus/Toyota had a problem with sludge in the past, and they settled a class action law suit because they screwed up the engine design with something like the crankcase ventilation But even then, it was like 1% of engines had the problem and I can almost guarantee you most of the time it was probably straight up neglect.
You would be amazed how many individuals would do crazy things like not even change the oil. Period. I had relative that lost an engine this way, just basically went a few years on it until the engine seized.
I still say most of these cars will be rotting in a salvage yard well before any sort of difference between changing it at 7k miles or 10k miles, etc. Maybe a 5k mile oil change theoretically allows the engine to go 400k miles instead of 350k miles, but who cares. You could have bought a new engine with the oil costs savings and almost nobody drives it that long anyway.
I've owned a ridiculous amount of cars with really high miles and I've never had an expensive oil analysis done. It's a waste of money.
Most people because they have little knowledge of oil and engine design, building and tuning, don't understand oil is a seal in the engine, it is not just a lubricant. When you start to understand that oil is a major seal in the engine you start to grasp why it has the effect it does today. 9 years ago, we didn't have nearly the overlap or EGRing that we have today. The EGR's of the past are nothing like the one's of today.
I suppose saving money in fuel costs and maintenance is a waste of money too? What's expensive about $80 to save hundreds? You remind me of the Mercedes guys I deal with, buying expensive cars and then balk when they have to spend a few bucks. If you can save $1,000 by spending $80, what are you saying?
What you're not grasping with what I've said here, is I'm not focused on preventing a major failure, although this is a component of it. I'm focused on maximizing efficiency over the long term and saving money in fuel and oil costs. Your N/A can be severely abused before it has issues, you don't have things like DI, turbo's or waste gates on these ES'. But just wait, all of that is changing.
I like my analogy, of two people. One eats healthy and the other eats poorly, living their entire lives as such. The healthy one can in old age do everything he wants, run, swim, and ski. The one who ate poorly has trouble running, can't go skiing, etc. It has little to do with actual duration of life and more so, quality of life. I also, point out, it's possible the healthy one gets hit by a bus, but does that mean that one should live unhealthy because of the possibility of an early death?
Gekko, in doing thousands of UOA, many of which were for Toyota and Lexus I may add, ES' are amongst the hardest on oil. When you take a look at the oil on the typical IS F/RC F/GS F and Look at a typical ES, the ES destroyed the oil. This is because most performance drivers understand the significance of warming up and engine, not taking short trips which is possible since many have other daily drivers and other factors. The typical ES is heavily involved in stop and go, which hammers oil, is turned on and off due to short trips and is not driven much(meaning an owner won't change his oil much over time causing it to oxidize). Once an oil is up to temp, you're not going to experience much wear. Which is why the RC F's have almost the same amount of wear as the ES'.
I won't banter any further, I've truly enjoyed the conversation with some of you, Coulter and Gekko included. I think I have shown that simply selecting the proper oil and filters are just a few dollars more than what you're paying now. Due to my NDA, I can't name the client some of you can probably guess who, but I was paid to consult on an internal study of oil selection and we found a 7-8% fuel economy difference between a lot of oils. This was due to the combustion dynamic efficiency rising drastically and properly sealing the piston ring cylinder interface during combustion. If you care about nothing else, I would merely ask what would 7-8% savings over the life of the vehicle mean to you? For some of you drawing 7 perpendicular lines to each other may just be easier.
Also, I don't sell UOA for those that have asked, sorry.
Edit: I wanted to add, it's not that you can't go 10K on OCI's, its just its not as easy as taking any oil off the shelf and going 10K. You have to know what you're doing or leave it to guys who can give you the answer.
Last edited by danielTRLK; 07-19-17 at 04:06 PM.
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lji (03-28-21)
07-19-17, 04:29 PM
#35
In my experience, the people that really want obsess about oil are usually selling something like AmWay. I mean Amsoil 
Just sayin.
I guess I missed the huge amount of Lexus ES owners that lost their engines as a result of following the owners manual and not getting a $150 oil analysis done on a regular basis.
Just sayin.
I guess I missed the huge amount of Lexus ES owners that lost their engines as a result of following the owners manual and not getting a $150 oil analysis done on a regular basis.
07-19-17, 05:21 PM
#36
In my experience, the people that really want obsess about oil are usually selling something like AmWay. I mean Amsoil
Just sayin.
I guess I missed the huge amount of Lexus ES owners that lost their engines as a result of following the owners manual and not getting a $150 oil analysis done on a regular basis.
Just sayin.
I guess I missed the huge amount of Lexus ES owners that lost their engines as a result of following the owners manual and not getting a $150 oil analysis done on a regular basis.
Brad, I never mentioned nor recommended any of y'all to get a $150 UOA on the regular, I said one per 100,000K set and forget. With all kindness, are you a warranty rep? customer service rep? I also, never said your engine will blow up, it seems you guys can't listen or read. I said this has less to do with failure and more to do with saving money in fuel economy and maintenance.
In regards to alluding that I am a con/scam artist, that really blows that you'd go that low. I have never sold anything on CL, you guys couldn't afford my time even if you wanted, LOL. I get nothing by trying to help out and give out free information, not one dime. I actually lose $$$. In regards to the "OCD" and other remarks, understand what you're seeing is professionalism that many other jobs don't require. When I look at a UOA on a turbine, I have 300+ lives on a spec of paper. It is not a joke or game for me, these are quite possibly your relatives, an engine failure could mean that plane kills everyone plus more on people on the ground. A hydraulic failure could easily crash the plane. I routinely have to deal with low level techs in airlines that just say, "eh, doesn't really matter" or the "well Boeing knows what they're doing the manual says we can do this with the oil, etc". For me, whether it is an ES engine, a train or a plane, I take these matters seriously. I don't know your financial situation but I always do my best to save you money and prevent you from having to spend $$$ on repairs, I have not asked you to send me $$$$. You're also getting information from experience in many aspects and valuable information that brings answers that few if any will ever want to publicly answer. Bringing highly technical insider information for free has brought me nothing but a whole lot of scorn on CL. I hope you merely consider what I have posted here and if you think it doesn't apply to you, then don't use the info!
07-20-17, 02:21 AM
#37
1,000,000 mile 2007 Toyota Tundra V8: original engine that had 117 oil changes (10,000 mile oil change intervals) and not a dime spent on a specialty engine oil or used oil analysis. Only engine parts replaced were two timing chains, one water pump and one alternator:
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BradTank (07-20-17)
07-20-17, 09:18 AM
#38
Ha! LOL, Amsoil's higher end oil is good stuff, the low to medium grade is nothing special. I have never understood why they use the model they have.
Brad, I never mentioned nor recommended any of y'all to get a $150 UOA on the regular, I said one per 100,000K set and forget. With all kindness, are you a warranty rep? customer service rep? I also, never said your engine will blow up, it seems you guys can't listen or read. I said this has less to do with failure and more to do with saving money in fuel economy and maintenance.
In regards to alluding that I am a con/scam artist, that really blows that you'd go that low. I have never sold anything on CL, you guys couldn't afford my time even if you wanted, LOL. I get nothing by trying to help out and give out free information, not one dime. I actually lose $$$. In regards to the "OCD" and other remarks, understand what you're seeing is professionalism that many other jobs don't require. When I look at a UOA on a turbine, I have 300+ lives on a spec of paper. It is not a joke or game for me, these are quite possibly your relatives, an engine failure could mean that plane kills everyone plus more on people on the ground. A hydraulic failure could easily crash the plane. I routinely have to deal with low level techs in airlines that just say, "eh, doesn't really matter" or the "well Boeing knows what they're doing the manual says we can do this with the oil, etc". For me, whether it is an ES engine, a train or a plane, I take these matters seriously. I don't know your financial situation but I always do my best to save you money and prevent you from having to spend $$$ on repairs, I have not asked you to send me $$$$. You're also getting information from experience in many aspects and valuable information that brings answers that few if any will ever want to publicly answer. Bringing highly technical insider information for free has brought me nothing but a whole lot of scorn on CL. I hope you merely consider what I have posted here and if you think it doesn't apply to you, then don't use the info!
Brad, I never mentioned nor recommended any of y'all to get a $150 UOA on the regular, I said one per 100,000K set and forget. With all kindness, are you a warranty rep? customer service rep? I also, never said your engine will blow up, it seems you guys can't listen or read. I said this has less to do with failure and more to do with saving money in fuel economy and maintenance.
In regards to alluding that I am a con/scam artist, that really blows that you'd go that low. I have never sold anything on CL, you guys couldn't afford my time even if you wanted, LOL. I get nothing by trying to help out and give out free information, not one dime. I actually lose $$$. In regards to the "OCD" and other remarks, understand what you're seeing is professionalism that many other jobs don't require. When I look at a UOA on a turbine, I have 300+ lives on a spec of paper. It is not a joke or game for me, these are quite possibly your relatives, an engine failure could mean that plane kills everyone plus more on people on the ground. A hydraulic failure could easily crash the plane. I routinely have to deal with low level techs in airlines that just say, "eh, doesn't really matter" or the "well Boeing knows what they're doing the manual says we can do this with the oil, etc". For me, whether it is an ES engine, a train or a plane, I take these matters seriously. I don't know your financial situation but I always do my best to save you money and prevent you from having to spend $$$ on repairs, I have not asked you to send me $$$$. You're also getting information from experience in many aspects and valuable information that brings answers that few if any will ever want to publicly answer. Bringing highly technical insider information for free has brought me nothing but a whole lot of scorn on CL. I hope you merely consider what I have posted here and if you think it doesn't apply to you, then don't use the info!
Or even the fact that a jet engine is a completely different animal than a car engine and any comparison is ridiculous. And yes, I would say the manufacture and engineers know more about their product than most mechanics that works on it.
People are going to have different opinions on this.
07-20-17, 09:46 AM
#39
danielTALK for the most part ,is correct in his statements regarding UOA and wear analysis. Prior to retiring, I worked for 2 major oil companies in Canada and used oil analysis for most facets (lawn mowers to Waukeshau large stationary engines and turbines) played a big part in my scenario (over 25 years). There are many different parameters that will affect the useful life of your engine oil as stated by danielTALK. In my experience (northern Canada), I found that most of the people (home use) who encountered crankcase oil problems emanated from oil showing a low tbn (alkalinity), After interviewing these people, it became obvious in most cases that the car or light truck was used for short trips very often and the odometers showed very low mileage for the year of the vehicle. Every time you shutoff vour engine, humidity starts to form in the crankcase. The next time you start and run your engine, if it doesn't run long enough to evaporate this humidity, what happens is that the sulfur and other chemicals introduced thru blow by are dissolved. H2O and Sulfur (from The fuel) will form a mild acid which will lower your tbn. (all lubricant additives are alkaline formulated) Acid will deteriorate your additive pack if this happens quite often. A longer drive will evaporate this humidity out thru Pcv. therefore eliminating the acid formation and extending the life of your oil. In the example above (Tundra), This fellow was driving 12,500 miles@month. Being a hot shot driver, he may have done a lot of idling but it never caused any problems whatsoever because most of his drives were long ones. Highway miles are the easiest on a crankcase lubricant. Remember one thing, that just because you engine temp gauge shows your engine has achieved operating temp, your oil hasn`t. A longer drive is desired to achieve this and a still longer drive is required to evaporate that humidity. A lot of us ES350 owners are retired and our average drives have shortened considerably and could lead to and does, to this problem. regardless of what a lot of people think, UOA is a very useful tool in both industry and home. Once you have your parameters defined and the objective (changing oil prior to increased engine wear or tbn value(no less than 1/2 of original value) achieved, your good to go. No more UOA should be required unless major changes occur in driving or weather patterns change. A credible service manager with a fleet of any kind, stationary or mobile, uses oil analysis to establish a useful OCI. In case of large stationary engines (eg Waukeshau) and turbines, ongoing UOA is their bible to monitor any increase in metal wear. If your not comfortable with UOA, stick to your manual!
Last edited by Tetguy; 07-20-17 at 09:55 AM.
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danielTRLK (07-20-17)
07-20-17, 01:42 PM
#40
You're honestly going off the deep end here, and I really don't understand while airline safety is even involved in this discussion. Obviously a jet airliner has a maintenance and repair regime that would be completely ridiculous on a passenger car.
Or even the fact that a jet engine is a completely different animal than a car engine and any comparison is ridiculous. And yes, I would say the manufacture and engineers know more about their product than most mechanics that works on it.
People are going to have different opinions on this.
Or even the fact that a jet engine is a completely different animal than a car engine and any comparison is ridiculous. And yes, I would say the manufacture and engineers know more about their product than most mechanics that works on it.
People are going to have different opinions on this.
Not in my professional experience, LOL. if you knew what these airlines were doing, you'd be shocked. Most of these issues are never made public until an accident happens.
If recommending a good filtration setup and oil combo that is available at Walmart is overboard, then you probably don't care about this engine to begin with.
While people are entitled to opinions, I don't have any, I have facts, science and data to back everything I claim or say. I'd be glad to post UOA's and explain values for some if anyone would like. Again, I don't sell anything, strictly for educational purposes.
1,000,000 mile 2007 Toyota Tundra V8: original engine that had 117 oil changes (10,000 mile oil change intervals) and not a dime spent on a specialty engine oil or used oil analysis. Only engine parts replaced were two timing chains, one water pump and one alternator:
This is honestly a publicity stunt by Toyota, as they acted all shocked when they saw everything was in good shape. Of course it would be, This thing was blasting through 3,000 miles a week while we were driving 100 in our cars. Also, highway driving is so easy on vehicles. I do an uber driver every once in a while and even Toyotas with Uber need BJ's, Tie rods, shocks, sway bar links driving less than 20,000 miles a year. That's city/suburban streets and driving for you.
I have a customer with a V-6 camaro, older gentlemen that takes lots of cross country road trips. He's averaging 23,000 miles on his oil with no issues.
07-20-17, 04:57 PM
#41
Lead Lap
Whew! This thread is out of control. On and on it goes and it seems to be growing a life of its own. If I were to guess what percentage of car owners sent their oil in for analysis it would probably be about.0001 of vehicle owners. I never heard of it until I joined this forum.
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
Last edited by bc6152; 07-20-17 at 05:43 PM.
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Mike728 (07-20-17)
07-20-17, 06:05 PM
#42
Lead Lap
Whew! This thread is out of control. On and on it goes and it seems to be growing a life of its own. If I were to guess what percentage of car owners sent their oil in for analysis it would probably be about.0001 of vehicle owners. I never heard of it until I joined this forum.
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
I suspect that anyone who was okay with 10,000 mile oil change intervals on an ES and who was open to changing his/her mind gave up on reading the extended technical posts in this thread several dozen posts ago.
Of the 40+ cars that I've owned, only 3 have been owned by me for over 100,000 miles. With each of those 3, I changed the conventional oil at 5000 mile intervals, and, on the day when I sold them or traded them in, the engines ran as well as they did on the day when I bought them. Of the cars that I've owned other than those 3, most have been kept for under 50,000 miles, and many were kept for well under 50,000 miles.
The two Generation 6 ESs that I've owned are the first vehicles that I've owned for which full synthetic oil was being used. When I traded my 2013 ES, it had 25,000 miles on the odometer, and I suspect that the 2017 ES that I now own will be gone well before there is any significant chance of damage to the engine because I used 10,000 mile oil change intervals (or else I could be long gone before that time).
Thus, I suspect that the reality is that my chances of ever harming an engine by following Lexus' recommended service intervals is, for practical purposes, not much greater than my chances of being struck by lightning. I suspect that the same is true for most others, and I have no interest in worrying about or being bothered to spend unnecessary time or money to insure that my engine will survive for decades after I no longer own the car.
07-20-17, 09:25 PM
#43
I agree 100%.
I suspect that anyone who was okay with 10,000 mile oil change intervals on an ES and who was open to changing his/her mind gave up on reading the extended technical posts in this thread several dozen posts ago.
Of the 40+ cars that I've owned, only 3 have been owned by me for over 100,000 miles. With each of those 3, I changed the conventional oil at 5000 mile intervals, and, on the day when I sold them or traded them in, the engines ran as well as they did on the day when I bought them. Of the cars that I've owned other than those 3, most have been kept for under 50,000 miles, and many were kept for well under 50,000 miles.
The two Generation 6 ESs that I've owned are the first vehicles that I've owned for which full synthetic oil was being used. When I traded my 2013 ES, it had 25,000 miles on the odometer, and I suspect that the 2017 ES that I now own will be gone well before there is any significant chance of damage to the engine because I used 10,000 mile oil change intervals (or else I could be long gone before that time).
Thus, I suspect that the reality is that my chances of ever harming an engine by following Lexus' recommended service intervals is, for practical purposes, not much greater than my chances of being struck by lightning. I suspect that the same is true for most others, and I have no interest in worrying about or being bothered to spend unnecessary time or money to insure that my engine will survive for decades after I no longer own the car.
I suspect that anyone who was okay with 10,000 mile oil change intervals on an ES and who was open to changing his/her mind gave up on reading the extended technical posts in this thread several dozen posts ago.
Of the 40+ cars that I've owned, only 3 have been owned by me for over 100,000 miles. With each of those 3, I changed the conventional oil at 5000 mile intervals, and, on the day when I sold them or traded them in, the engines ran as well as they did on the day when I bought them. Of the cars that I've owned other than those 3, most have been kept for under 50,000 miles, and many were kept for well under 50,000 miles.
The two Generation 6 ESs that I've owned are the first vehicles that I've owned for which full synthetic oil was being used. When I traded my 2013 ES, it had 25,000 miles on the odometer, and I suspect that the 2017 ES that I now own will be gone well before there is any significant chance of damage to the engine because I used 10,000 mile oil change intervals (or else I could be long gone before that time).
Thus, I suspect that the reality is that my chances of ever harming an engine by following Lexus' recommended service intervals is, for practical purposes, not much greater than my chances of being struck by lightning. I suspect that the same is true for most others, and I have no interest in worrying about or being bothered to spend unnecessary time or money to insure that my engine will survive for decades after I no longer own the car.
Then why comment? You're on a forum spending time discrediting free technical information. You barely drive your car, so maybe this forum is a social avenue for you like FB is to others. It's great and live your life as you should, but why comment on things others may find useful? I understand from your post you may not be around before you need the oil change, I may add I may die by then too, but it doesn't mean there isn't someone on here with an ES300 that they plan on keeping and then passing down to a grandchild, etc. I won't start smoking just because I might get hit by a bus tomorrow.
Whew! This thread is out of control. On and on it goes and it seems to be growing a life of its own. If I were to guess what percentage of car owners sent their oil in for analysis it would probably be about.0001 of vehicle owners. I never heard of it until I joined this forum.
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
I've owned the '66 Corvette pictured on the left since 1985 and have changed the oil regularly with DINO oil. 32 years of DINO oil and still going strong. A GM 327/300 HP.
For some people it seems that it is a very big deal and extremely important. For others, like me, I'll just go along with the program and change my oil every 10k miles and forget about it. One rarely hears about engine failure due to oil deterioration and I truly believe that the schedule recommended by Toyota is just fine. And I'm not blowing $20.00 for an oil analysis either. Geez, put it to bed...
Ton's of engine failures due to oil, not oil deterioration, get your facts straight. But you've never heard of oil analysis, so what would you know. Can you explain all the GDI's, Ecoboosts and DI/FI engines popping left and right at 100,000 miles? Yep, thought so.
You strike me of the pastor neighbor I had who opted out of chemo and surgery at 37 with stage 2 cancer because he believed God would save him. He completely ignored the God believing doctors that were telling him to get treatment.
Stop spreading misinformation and get off this thread if you're going to spread your useless opinions. You've countered not one of my claims with anything remotely scientific, pure opinions based on emotions and BS speculation.
07-20-17, 11:20 PM
#44
Lexus Test Driver
Now, let's not get personal...
Anyway, I think the big unstressed lump in the ES350 could probably make it to 100k miles on crap oil. No turbos, DI, less worries. Just do a 10k OCI and you'll be fine when it comes time to trade up.
For owners who want to keep their cars going beyond 100k, a shorter OCI would make sense, along with regular UOAs. I used to run small high-RPM motors with and without forced induction so taking care of every piece of the engine was important. A UOA lets you see which components are on the way out - maybe overkill at 20k miles but a good idea at 50k.
And DanielTLRK, don't forget VW TSI and TFSI engines. Not really the most reliable lumps out there too.
Anyway, I think the big unstressed lump in the ES350 could probably make it to 100k miles on crap oil. No turbos, DI, less worries. Just do a 10k OCI and you'll be fine when it comes time to trade up.
For owners who want to keep their cars going beyond 100k, a shorter OCI would make sense, along with regular UOAs. I used to run small high-RPM motors with and without forced induction so taking care of every piece of the engine was important. A UOA lets you see which components are on the way out - maybe overkill at 20k miles but a good idea at 50k.
And DanielTLRK, don't forget VW TSI and TFSI engines. Not really the most reliable lumps out there too.
07-21-17, 04:57 AM
#45
You really should stop with the personal attacks. We've all heard your "educated" opinion. Now please leave us poor stupid souls to ourselves, so we can ruin our ES's by following the manufactures recommended procedures.