2tonekarma

Hi all,

First post on the forum here, and all in all likely to be an ES350 owner by the end of the week (women, eh)

Have driven Volvos for the past 12 years. Prefer how they feel on the pedal (heavier, less pedal-press-speed increase transition, good control, great in winter). Tried Subaru, Toyota, Honda, Acura, and Lexus, with the latter being the most comfortable ride and the Subaru being the worst on the pedal (too responsive).

Been offered an ES350, 2013, Dark Grey and Ultra Luxury Package (navigation etc.) with 51000 miles for $24k from a non-Lexus dealer. Seems like a decent enough deal when looking around at dealers, who are charging at least a couple of thousand more for the Luxury package only, though generally with significantly less miles.

Here's my issues, and I'm hoping that you nice folks can help me out.

• We're having our first child in 6 months. Trunk space is good, but no fold-down seats worry me if Ineed to get crap from Ikea or Costco or what-have-you. Also, safety is a factor. A sexy Lexus seems like a little indulgence.
• 51k seems high for a 3 year car. Guy selling says clean carfax and "all highway miles" (whatever that means). Was bought in MD and moved up to NYC.
• I don't necessarily need the extras from the Ultra-Luxury package, such as navigation. I honestly think we're more likely to use our phones as the wife likes Waze and things of that nature.
• I'm concerned about warranty. We are likely to keep our next car for at least 5 years, more likely around 8 years. I've seen some conflicting information that the car is under a 60k drivetrain warranty for 7 years already because of the ultra luxury package, but other places where I've seen no warranty past 50k miles and no ability to purchase a Lexus warranty or service after 50k miles. I was able to do some basic maintenance on our Volvo S70 but certainly don't feel comfortable doing the same on an ES350.

So, should I bide my time, look for a Lexus-certified dealer instead, or consider something else?

lesz

The Lexus new car warranty is a bumper-to-bumper 4 year, 50,000 mile warranty. So, with 51,000 miles, that would no longer apply. The power train warranty is 6 years or 70,000 miles. Thus, you would still have some of that left.

These cars are quite reliable, and, if the car has been maintained properly, the likelihood of major repairs is not high.

Depending on the condition of the car, the $24,000 price is probably just a bit below what I'd expect for a 2013 ES with 51,000 miles and the UL package. If you were buying a 2013 UL ES with, say, 25,000 miles and in very good condition from a Lexus dealer as a CPO vehicle, I'd expect the price to be somewhere around $30,000, and the price without the CPO designation would likely be a little lower. So, even though expensive repairs are not likely, the approximately $6000 saved on the vehicle that you are looking at could pay for several repairs, should they be needed.

2tonekarma

Thanks for the insight, it really helps. Are there any options for purchasing a bumper-to-bumper warranty at this point with this car? If something that isn't drivetrain related goes, it sounds like it could be expensive. Good to know the drivetrain is still good though, I don't expect we'll drive more than 3-4k a year.

The car itself looked in great shape - like it had been kept in a garage with no scratches and such.

lesz

I'm not sure whether Lexus would still sell you a Lexus extended warranty after the factory bumper-to-bumper warranty has expired. My guess is that they would, but you should be able to confirm that by calling a Lexus dealer. In any case, the extended warranties are very high mark-up items. While there is the possibility you could have covered repairs whose cost exceeds the cost of the extended warranty, the likelihood of that happening is not great. In any case, I would consider buying an extended warranty only if it was offered with pricing that was significantly discounted.

2tonekarma

Just looking at the pictures again and it doesn't have a panoramic sunroof, just a regular sun/moon roof. Does that mean it is only the Luxury package? The guy kept telling me how much it is better than the luxury package (his words: "If you're going to compare it, please do, just make sure you compare it to the one above the luxury, not the luxury")

I know it has, for example, front and rear beeping when something is close, and the rain sensing wipers, but its not clear from the brochure if this is available only to ultraluxury

lesz

If it is an UL, it would have the pano roof. Other "tells" that it is an UL would be the seat extender at the front of the driver's seat and memory buttons for the front passenger seat on the front passenger door.

Features like the parking sensors, blind spot monitor, etc. were available on models other than the UL.

If the car doesn't have the UL package, the $24,000 price is probably okay, but it isn't great for a car with 51,000 miles. I just traded in my 2013 ES with the Luxury package last week. It had just under 25,000 miles on the odometer, and I expect that the dealer will end up selling it for somewhere between $26,000 and $27,000.

What is the condition of the tires? If they are still the original tires, they are likely going to need to be replaced very soon. Also, at 60,000 miles a bigger maintenance is called for, including doing things like changing the brake fluid.

amphiprion

You listed this as your first concern and I think it's a huge one for a young family. Hauling luggage and groceries from Costco and small items from Ikea is not an issue. BUT not being able to fold the seats down will outright prevent you from even trying to fit longer and large items in the trunk. You will need to use another vehicle or have them delivered, seriously consider that given your situation and think about the stroller while you're at it.

What about the RX? =)

2tonekarma

I suspect the tires have not been changed. I looked at the service history using the VIN:

• serviced at lexus dealers every 5k miles (every 4 months like clockwork)
• no issues other than a fog light out so far
• tire rotations but no replacements

Definitely no panoramic roof, so strike one on the "one above the luxury" comment.

2tonekarma

Aside from the RX being a little out of our price range, wifey doesn't really like SUVs (her late father preferred sedans or wagons - hated SUVs and lamented their proposensity for roll-overs, and it stuck with her I guess).

We had a large trunk in the S70 which had a 60/40 split rear seat. Honestly, we ended up using a roofrack more than we put the seat down, but I don't like options being taken away from me when I'm paying more for it!

JDR76

Does the ES have a pass through in the seat back?

My IS had folding rear seats, but I never used them because the kids' car seats prevented them from being folded down. However my GS has the small pass through in the middle. While that seems like a compromise, it works well for us, as I can leave my two car seats in place, in the outboard positions, yet still stick a longer 2x4, skis, etc. through.

We are fortunate enough, however, to have the Highlander for hauling duty if we need something more than the GS can provide.

2tonekarma

Yep the ES has a ski-hatch passthrough

Brent1944

Why not ck the Lexus dealer for a Certified Used ES? When I bought used cars, I always bout them from a dealer that sold that car new...

2tonekarma

None of those local to me (NYC) will match 24k for a 2013 ES350 premium, never mind luxury (and of course, certainly not an ultraluxury now that I know that this one isn't either)

They have a couple of 2011 ES350s at ~20k with 15k miles on certified preowned
2013/2014 are 26ish, though granted with about half the miles (25k or less)
Called lexus dealer today who verified that he cannot sell me an extended warranty past 50k but could refer to me to third parties

I guess the question now is take a 2011, take this one at 51k and hope it doesn't blow up, or look to get 10% more credit to get me a 2014 with 25k miles

modad

I know you are not asking for 'new parent' advice, but here goes: Get a hatchback or a wagon or even a mini van. You will be hauling bags, toys, and most importantly STROLLERS! Yes, it will fit in my ES trunk, but in the hectic world of real-life parenting, you really want as easy in/out as possible. And if you by chance have another child fairly soon..... well it gets even worse... I mean better

2tonekarma

I'll take any advice I can get

Thanks Mo'dad'