Newlexuser

Just bought my first Lexus (ES 350) from a dealer in SF bay area. Without mentioning it during price negotiation, they charged me $189 for nitrogen in the final bill in addition to the tax, registration fee,etc. Is this standard practice? Thanks for your feedback.

bc6152

Were they wearing a mask and holding a gun? Get your money back and find another Lexus dealer. First, it's not necessary for your tires, secondly, if it's supplied it's usually gratis. Amazes me how these dealers add on fluff charges without informing the buyer. It's simply underhanded and deceitful.

FYI - The (free) air that you're currently breathing contains 78% Nitrogen and about 21% Oxygen. The rest is water vapor.

On the other hand, I wish you Good Luck with your new car and welcome to the forum.

LexBob2

That does seem high. It should at least be optional or negotiated out of the final price. M 2010 was delivered with nitogen, but no charge.

atoyota

As bc6152 says, i would protest. And if they said anything I would make them put the free stuff in your tires. The dealership I go to includes it for free and in the routine service and I can tell you I see no benefit or even notice any difference. I definitely would be looking for another dealer for service in the future since if they are sticking you now, they will likely only continue to do so in the future.

don1

Nitrogen is a waste of time, energy and money. It only benefits the dealer. Refuse to accept it. I had a dealer talk me into nitrogen back in 2005 but I discovered when I needed a top up it was necessary to go back to the dealer and they always found some other reason to charge me for some minor thing. I quickly changed to doing my own top ups with regular air and never had a tire problem.

Newlexuser

Thank you so much for you guys' prompt input. I really appreciate it! My purchasing process today went through perfectly until I caught this. I will followup with them. I hope this is some kind of mistake, and they will be able to correct. Will let you guys know how it goes.

By the way, it feels great in this new family:-)

Cheers

lesz

When I was buying my ES and when I was with the dealer's business manager doing the final paperwork, I noticed that there was a $100 charge for a nitrogen tire fill. When I told the business manager that I would not be buying the car if that charge was there, he immediately removed the $100 charge, and the nitrogen was left in the tires.

The $180 that you were charged was definitely a pure profit generator for the dealership. Once the dealership has bought the equipment used to fill the tires with nitrogen, filling tires with nitrogen costs that dealership nothing. I would certainly complain about the charge, but, if you are doing it after the fact and not at the time when you actually were buying the car, I would think that the dealer has no legal obligation to give you a refund, but I would hope that they would do so on a good-will basis.

If you do an internet search on the benefits of nitrogen tire fills, you will find that the nitrogen fill should reduce but not eliminate changes in pressure that come with changes in ambient air temperature. The numbers that I've seen say that changes in tire pressure should be reduced by about 30%, but you will still need to add or remove air or nitrogen as the seasons change to maintain proper tire pressure, and, as others have pointed out, when you do need to raise the tire pressure, you need to add nitrogen to maintain the benefits of the nitrogen. Having to make regular trips to the dealer and having to wait to have them add a few pounds of nitrogen pressure is something I have no interest in dealing with. Further, many/most dealers will charge for topping off the nitrogen every time you need it. I'm sure that, even though I started out with nitrogen in the tires of my ES, it only took a couple of times, as I added plain air when the temperatures dropped, for any supposed benefits of the nitrogen to be completely gone.

lesz

It is even worse than that because, before they add the pure nitrogen, they have to try to remove as much of the plain air as possible from the tires. If they do it right, which is not a given, they will remove as much plain air as possible, add nitrogen, and, then, repeat the process multiple times based on the theory that, each time they do so, more of plain air should be removed. Even if they do it right, their goal is still only that there will be no more than about 7% oxygen left in the tires.

Dave Mac

That is a shameful practice. As bc6152 said the regular air that goes into tires contains 78% Nitrogen and about 21% Oxygen plus some water vapor. And the idea of going back to dealer to top off your nitrogen filled tires is crazy. I would tell the person that you are dealing with that he/she should be embarrassed and if the charge doesn't come off ask to talk to the general manager. Even then I would probably make a call to Lexus to express your displeasure with this practice.

Not that it matters, but when I got my last Lexus and the salesman that I have purchased from for 20 years expressed surprise that I was declining the nitrogen filled tires - he knew I would decline everything else - and I explained that "regular" air was already 78% nitrogen he was a little embarrassed that he had been mislead by the company.

Dave Mac

ElliotB

There are many benefits to nitrogen. And it is probably worthwhile having in your tires. But not at a cost or $100 or $200.

Newlexuser

Thank you all so much for the additional comments, really appreciated! Still waiting for the response from the dealer.

bunka

It's probably too late as it sounds like you already have the car so you also already signed agreeing to it. About the only thing you (might) get now is for them to give you some "give aways" like merchandise but if it was me I'd make them give me something I valued (like 3M clear film protection) for the OBVIOUS overcharge.

As others have pointed out, there really is NO DIFFERENCE between 100% nitrogen & 78% nitrogen of the "free stuff". That won't stop the dealer from trying to "pad" his profit margins (essentially ZERO cost with $189 sales price).

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

For the average Joe, I can't think of one reason why it would benefit. Even if they offered it for $20, I'd still say no.

Newlexuser

Received an email from the sales lady, apologized for the unintentional mistake, and said they will send me a refund check for the full amount. She is nice and professional. The mistake happened at Finance for the final billing.

In my initial email to the dealer, I have cited the information you guys provided in response of my initial question. Obviously, that really helped a lot! As some of you predicted it would be a tough situation to deal with, since the deal is already done, I'm just so glad the sales person and dealer are nice enough to make the correction. It can't happen without your help! Thank you so much! You Guys Rock!!!

Dave Mac

I believe (hope) that you will find this a typical response from your Lexus dealer - they try to make you happy. The "Finance" guys are a different breed however and their only function is to try to sell you these add-on products, warranties etc. Really the only distasteful part of the buying process.

Now enjoy your new car.

Dave Mac