Considering es 350 -what benefits over camry?
#16
Rather than everyone sharing assumptions, guesses and subjective analysis, does anybody know the actual differences? A body-man friend of mine mentions that there are significant differences in bracing, brackets, etc which contribute to the solid feel of the ES over the Camry. I hear about sound deadening glass. Folks also mention sound insulation materials being different. What else is there. I would be interested to see an actual, factual list of the differences.
#17
here's a comparison- not the best, but covers the basics- base model es350 to an avalon limited.
http://cars.findthebest.com/compare/...Avalon-Limited
http://cars.findthebest.com/compare/...Avalon-Limited
#18
Lead Lap
here's a comparison- not the best, but covers the basics- base model es350 to an avalon limited.
http://cars.findthebest.com/compare/...Avalon-Limited
http://cars.findthebest.com/compare/...Avalon-Limited
#19
Rather than everyone sharing assumptions, guesses and subjective analysis, does anybody know the actual differences? A body-man friend of mine mentions that there are significant differences in bracing, brackets, etc which contribute to the solid feel of the ES over the Camry. I hear about sound deadening glass. Folks also mention sound insulation materials being different. What else is there. I would be interested to see an actual, factual list of the differences.
#20
Thanks for the comparison and comments. I was actually asking more about structural, mechanical and build related differences - those that would not show up on a features list. Things like the glass and insulation that I mentioned. I suspect only a mechanic or body-man who works on both would be privy to those differences.
Instead of signficant structural, mechanical and build related differences that affect ride comfort, interior noise levels, seat comfort and vehicle weight as compared to the Avalon, the ES offers some more subtle types of refinements that don't affect weight; like front and rear door mechanisms that open and close noticably more effortlessly. And a little less hard plastic in the interior as compared to the Avalon.
If you strip down the interior of an ES to add dynamat or other insulation you will find alot of bare metal under the carpets and inside the doors just as you would on an Avalon or Camry. And also notice the door panels are made out of hard plastic instead of sound absorbing fiberboard like in older generations of ES's and Avalons.
#21
Rather than everyone sharing assumptions, guesses and subjective analysis, does anybody know the actual differences? A body-man friend of mine mentions that there are significant differences in bracing, brackets, etc which contribute to the solid feel of the ES over the Camry. I hear about sound deadening glass. Folks also mention sound insulation materials being different. What else is there. I would be interested to see an actual, factual list of the differences.
My limited time riding in a rental Camry, I can confidently say that the ride is actually a little softer than my ES (with 18" Michelins), however wind noise was not as hushed. Over bumps and potholes the Camry exhibited more noise and rattling, however minor, than the ES which is still to date completely silent when going through bumps. Over rough roads, both were on par as far as noise.
If you strip down the interior of an ES to add dynamat or other insulation you will find alot of bare metal under the carpets and inside the doors just as you would on an Avalon or Camry. And also notice the door panels are made out of hard plastic instead of sound absorbing fiberboard like in older generations of ES's and Avalons.
#22
Lead Lap
The ES has come standard with an acoustic glass windshield (laminated) since a refresh of the prior generation. This is a feature that was only present in Camry hybrid. Door and window seals are larger and more robust on ES, you can see this by visually comparing the two open doors.
My limited time riding in a rental Camry, I can confidently say that the ride is actually a little softer than my ES (with 18" Michelins), however wind noise was not as hushed. Over bumps and potholes the Camry exhibited more noise and rattling, however minor, than the ES which is still to date completely silent when going through bumps. Over rough roads, both were on par as far as noise.
Source? Do you actually strip 2013+ ESs down yourself or is this anecdotal?
My limited time riding in a rental Camry, I can confidently say that the ride is actually a little softer than my ES (with 18" Michelins), however wind noise was not as hushed. Over bumps and potholes the Camry exhibited more noise and rattling, however minor, than the ES which is still to date completely silent when going through bumps. Over rough roads, both were on par as far as noise.
Source? Do you actually strip 2013+ ESs down yourself or is this anecdotal?
I have no idea what might be different "under the skin" of the Toyotas compared to what the Lexus has, but something must be different. Also note that, a couple of weeks ago, someone posted a link to a Lexus document that talked about the interior "plastic" on the ES. It is, in reality, not plastic. Instead it is some sort of product made from plant material that is supposed to be, not only more environmentally friendly, but also effective in reducing noise in the cabin.
The Camry and the Avalon are both superb vehicles, and I would never think of saying otherwise, but the level of refinement and attention paid to detail in the Lexus is a few notches higher. Similarly, I've owned both a Toyota 4Runner and a Lexus GX, which share many components. The 4Runner was, without a doubt, an outstanding vehicle, but the GX is quieter, more refined, and, again, built with a higher level of attention paid to detail.
Last edited by lesz; 12-28-13 at 10:01 AM.
#25
If you value a high level of quality, choose the ES. Lexus has a slower build time in Japan, and you will find that the overall build quality and specifications are superior for any Lexus model.
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ES - 5th Gen (2007-2012)
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03-24-07 05:26 PM