wa3cuj

I am generally over on the RX boards but am coming here for some input from 2013 ES owners.

We are selling our 2007 Audi A6 and replacing it with a new 2013 vehicle. We have test driven several candidate cars and only have the new Avalon to drive yet. The ES went right to the top of my wife's list after driving both the 350 and the 300h. (I have a 2010 RX450h now). We would not be getting the Ultra Luxury package, but just about everything else.

The only thing that I am a little concerned about is the reduction in trunk space with the 300h. Additionally, we have had AWD vehicles for the last 15-20 years (mostly Audis). For those of you in "snow" country (I am in south central PA) how is the FWD in the snow. I am hoping with all of the technology that has come to the traction and driving systems in today's cars that having AWD is not as big a benefit as it was in the past.

Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?

txes

Most folks buy a hybrid for the gas mileage and understand other things, like trunk space, suffer.

FWD won't measure up if you're use to AWD.

Be sure to check out the heated steering wheel contact area. Wouldn't want you disappointed in that area.

John

chewbach

The challenges of FWD in the snow can be significantly minimized by switching to snow tires in the winter. Gas mileage will suffer slightly (since snow tires won't be low rolling resistance), but the traction benefits are HUGE. (Many will say that FWD w/Snow Tires > AWD w/All Seasons).

An easy way to do snow tires is buy them mounted on their own wheels via a place like Tirerack.com. The cost, including wheels + tires + TPMS sensors, will likely be ~$1,250. However, that cost is somewhat offset given the fact that you're saving wear on your all seasons.

Mike728

I haven't driven in the snow yet, by choice, but I'll have to next year. The best tires I've found for all around driving are the Continental DWS's



I went from having almost no traction in my FWD Sonata with its horrible stock Hancocks, to having great traction. I hope I can get at least a year out of my 18" Bridgestones. I'm not too confident, though.

wasjr

Our 300h is my wife's daily driver. The only downside to us in the 300h was the loss of trunk space. That was more than offset by the increased gas mileage and the reasonable price premium for the hybrid. We determined that we would not need the additional trunk space that often, and if we did we would use my MDX.

Music4ever

If you like music with lots of base, the premium stereo system (Mark Levinson) is no where close to a Audi, you may want to see the thread on Mark Levinson. After owning this 300h, and owning two Audi's the feel is totally different.

Ronman15

I'm driving a 300h, my wife complains about the trunk space she wanted the RX, I was driving a Toyota 4Runner, so it's a big difference,. I love not pulling out all of those $20's every time I fill up. Both vehicles run on regular gas so that is a plus. Test drive the ES on a long drive, put the vehicle onto all the driving modes (Eco,normal,sport) some people don't like the CVT, it's not a problem for me. I just posted a attachment on the a ES mileage forum of me getting 44.7 MPG, I'll take that v. 3 cubic feet of trunk space. For my ear I really couldn't tell the difference between the 8 speaker stereo and the ML, check the ML forum, there having a problem with amp or subwoofer. All being said I'm very happy with my ES.

wa3cuj

Thanks for the comments. We drove the Avalon Limited Hybrid and really liked it. We need a trunk that will hold my mother in law's companion chair. It fit in the Avalon and we will be taking it to the Lexus dealer tomorrow because the 300h trunk is 2 cubic feet smaller than the Avalon hybrid.

After that, the two vehicles are very much the same with subtle differences. I think it is strange that Toyota would build two vehicles that would compete against each other at just about every point.

This will be my wife's car so she will get to make the choice. She has had three Audi's but she has decided it is time for a change.

Arty101

The Toyota Avalon and Lexus 300ESh is built on the same platform, but there's enough difference between the two that Toyota Corporation isn't concerned. As you figured out, the Avalon is a bit longer - I guess the trunk is also bigger. The Lexus has more luxury appointments, and may handle and feel differently than the Avalon.

Ultimately, it's whatever works for the wife and her mother. Good luck on that.

wa3cuj

Yes, after 33 years of marriage, I have learned that it is all about whatever works for the wife!!

Arty101

A wise, but learned man.

RajaG

I agonized for months about whether to get a hybrid or not, and narrowed it down to Avalon vs. 350 ES.
I also test drove the Avalon Hybrid, and liked it, but we purchased the ES 350. After 2 weeks, no regrets. So I'll go an extra once or twice a month to gas up, that's OK. Trunk space was important to us. Also, as a magazine review said, on acceleration, the 4 cylinder Avalon hybrid noise was more compared to a quiet V6. Also, the nav screen on the Avalon was only 6" and you have to get a Limited to get a 7" screen. I like the 8" screen on the Lexus 350.

Tuanle

Personally, I didn't like the acceleration of the 300h or the braking. Acceleration is too slow and noisier and braking is too rough and recharge noise. Smoothness is number 1 priority for me, so I went for the ES350 even though I do like the gas mileage of the ES300h

SW17LS

One other consideration is the hybrid and snow driving performance. I have not owned a Hybrid since our 2004 Prius, but there were some issues with snow traction due to the traction control system overreacting to avoid wheelspin because its not good for the hybrid system. It was pretty bad, to the point where it was pretty hard to get the Prius going, where the FWD ES300 I had at the time was fine.

Just food for thought.