LexBob2

jhp, good luck with your decision. The IS and ES are two completely different cars in terms of size, performance, handling etc. IMO you can't go wrong with either one, but they definitely are different.

I haven't seen or heard anything further on the braking issue, other than it's probably due to the improperly installed all-weather floor mat issue, which has been addressed. With over 100,000 ES350's on the road, if it was a widespread problem you'd be hearing more about it. What you've read might just be a case of driver error.

NGG

Had an 07 ES350....no end of disappointments. Dealer exchanged it for an 07 IS350...very happy. Would not touch an ES350 again...this confirmed as I had one as a loaner when the IS was in for service....same impression. Good luck on your decision.

sfuad

Without exageration, My ES flared 5 times in first 10 min of drive yesterday afternoon. From 1800 rpm to 2100 and on two occassions even touching 2400. Flare would be the nice way to say it, to me its slipping of Transmission. Its a mechanical or software issue and I certainly believe that transmissions are same in all vehicles. Its a design issue, not a manufacturing issue. Not acceptable for any vehicle what to speak of $40,000 Lexus. All TSB's have done nothing to improve it. I always drive with light foot and probably thats why I experience flare most. I am not going to change my driving habits just for sake of Lexus. You consider yourself lucky that you are not experiencing it. for me I am already pursuing a buy back or lemon and would not buy an ES again until Lexus comes up with a redesigned transmission.

ES350Bob

jhp...,

Though you stated brakes, I think you mean uncontrolled acceleration. It is not the brakes per se in that situation it is the momentum of the car plus the addition of accel you did not ask for.

I'm in no way buying it's the floormats causing this. I think it is a software problem. There may be some situations where a floormat has caused a racing engine but not all of the reports of this can be that, esp. from my own experience with my first ES350...I had no all weather mats in the car and it raced on it's own and regular mat was no where near pushing the accelerator pedal, fortunately while I was in park or had just shifted into park I should say, and randomly and also very infrequently at other times.

I complained several times in the months of July of 06, August, September, October to both dealers and Lexus corporate about the "auto throttle" with a mind of it's own being dangerous but was not taken seriously on the subject. I posted on this here in one of my first threads when first joining August 06.

Since then I have seen quite a few reports of this and the FEDS getting involved.

Macklin

Bob, still ES bashing I see. Give it a rest dude.

BTW, how's that Honda treating you?

Cowbert

I too WAS in the market for a 08 ES. Until I saw the complaints on 07 ES on the NHTSA web.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/complai...aintsearch.cfm

There are 63 complaints with the 07 ES. A siginificant number of them are on the auto acceleration problem. I don't buy that it is a "floor mat" issue. It seems more like a software problem or a stuck paddle. Even worse, in a seperate complaint, the side air bag was not deployed when the ES was hit from the side. And the driver is now sueing Lexus. These are VERY serious safety problems, and caused me to change my mind.

My second choice is the Acura TL, which only has 2 complaints for the 07 TL model. Even on a complaint per car sold basis, it is hard to believe Lexus sold 30 times more ES than Acura did with the TL.

Until I see some data that the 08 ES model has significantly improved its quality. The ES is out. Which is unfortunate, cause I REALLY like it more than the TL.

CRB

When a Lexus is down near the "industry average" on a Consumer Reports survey, that is telling you something. The V6 Camry, a close cousin, is off the recommended list. I'll let you connect the dots, or should I say black marks, yourself. A positive note is that buy or lease the overall resale value of a Lexus should be quite good vis a vis other cars in the marketplace.

LexBob2

I don't know why the ES escaped CR's downgrade, like the Camry V6. However, in the recently issued 2008 CR Buying Guide, the ES350 is "recommended" and has the 2nd highest Upscale Sedan rating (90 points) next to the new Infiniti G35 (91 points). Predicted Reliability and Owner Satisfaction are high too.

CRB

It is because the ES350 scored highly in tests and is above (albeit ever so slightly, if you see the model by model breakdown) average in reliability. The GS350 AWD did drop off the recommended list because of reliablility issues. The fact that the "predicted reliability" stays high is an interesting contradiction but it is based on the model history (including prior iterations, which were stellar) and the marque's overall record ( Lexus' is great). Unless the ES 350's (and V6 Camry's) problems are chronic, which I doubt, I would expect to see them both above average and recommended very soon. Somebody posted this over on the IS board it is shows just how far the once vaunted reliability of the ES model line has fallen with this current generation...

LexBob2

The overall scores in the '08 CR Buying Guide on the top rated Upscale Sedans is:
92 G35
91 ES350
90 TL
87 G35 AWD
85 Maxima

A little different than the attached chart. The Predicted Reliability for all of these models is different too. Not sure what the difference in the two reports is.

llamaboiz

and lexus are just high end toyotas ...

Cowbert

Is there any anecdotal evidence that 08 model is better or is about the same quality-wise as the 07 model? Or it is still too early to tell.

twister

I think we need to wait for the next year survey results. Take GS350 AWD for instance. GS350 is a replacement of GS300 which was introduced in 2005 as '06 model and had a TON of rattles. It took almost 2 years for the feedback to finally kick in, and now they are "downgraded". Do the search on GS forum and you will find its no longer an issue with '07 (and I can confirm this from my own experience - the car is solid!!!).

So don't be surprised that in a year or two, even so Lexus might get around fixing all the ES problems, what we see right now will backfire and affect the future ratings.

But IMHO, I think all those CR surveys starting to have very little influence anyway since majority turns to internet and popular forums. And even than, you still see lots of people driving Mercedes and BMW even so they are plagued with electrical problems described in most of the forums… Go figure…

gatorcb

You have to remember though the 2007 ES had a much longer run (not Sept to Sept), so you would think that an 08 would have some of the issues corrected.