gnm313

I went in to buy a GS today based upon what I read out here. I test drove both the GS and ES and frankly did not like the GS. Very small cabin and I don't think it accellerated or handled as well. The ES with less hp had a quieter ride and for some reason accellerated better. The GS felt heavy off the line. If you are going for looks, the GS is nicer, but the ES with the ultra luxury package gives you nicer wheels, better leather and looks almost as nice as the GS. What's more, the ES has the aux port for your iPOD. If that doesn't convice you, the ES is $15K cheaper even with the ultra package. My .02 I am picking mine up next week.

twister

OK, from someone who owned ES350 for 4 month, and happily got out into GS350... my opinion is that you have to test drive both. Those are two absolutely different cars. You mentioned BMW and your dissatisfaction with dealership experience. I didn't hear you complaining about being not happy with sporty ride, better handling, or car power. If those are important to you AND you want the luxury and the reliability of the Lexus, you will realize right away that GS is for you if you want to take a turn without slowing down below 30mph or gonna get stuck in a sand and need AWD, or if you want powerful 274 ft/lb torque at 3600rpm from flawless 303hp V6 engine. But, if you want a total luxury of a soft and quiet drive, roominess, don’t mind a numb steering, and enjoy panoramic sunroof - ES350 is your choice. But than, if money is not an object for you, why not step up to LS460? You can even wait a couple of month and get GS460 (a total beast!!!).

Do your homework, test drive both, read forums of both ES350 and GS350, decide what is your priority. Everybody got their bias opinion based on their present or previous experience with these cars. The final decision is up to you!!!

twister

Did you drive GS300 or GS350?!? If you are saying that ES350 is faster and has a better acceleration, than you definitely didn't drive GS350. The latest test of GS350 AWD was reported to be 0-60 in 5.3 seconds, while ES350 is 6.8 second. That is a big difference!!! Yes, it has less room and leather is not as soft. But, it doesn't cost $15k less. I paid for my GS350 AWD with premium package (spoiler, cooled seats, winter mats, etc.) without NAV/ML only $41,500. ES350 UL will be more expensive.

PDG810810

I have also owned both cars and they are unique in many ways. The problem for me was the ES quality, it is fundamentally put together with less care it seems and the materals (interior dash for example) is just not up to par. I also had a 03 ES 300 and it was built MUCH better. Power and handling lacked in the older models however. The 07 ES has good acceleration, good interior room, the ML is great, nice ride, although I felt if you pushed the car hard the feeling for me was the car could not handle the speed developed.
The GS is way better built, nicer inside, better handling and the power is deceptive. Due to the weight (& AWD) the car seems slow off the line but seems to gather more power with some RPM's. Punch it at 80 and you are gone! ( & so is your licence)
The GS is a good looking car and can be made to look great with the addition of some decent wheels (stock suck IMHO) and tint. All of a sudden ES cars are everywhere but the GS 350 is still rare. Even when I do see one go by 90% of the time its a GS 300.
Both cars are not perfect and if money were no option I would probably be in a MB. However, from a value perspective Lexus is hard to beat.

twister

^PDG, good un-biased summary!!! After my frustration with ES350, I can't keep a cool head when talking about this car I do have to agree about acceleration comment. If you disect 0-60mph 5.3 sec acceleration, its probably 0-45 in 4.3 sec and than one second blast into 60. Oh, and if you throw in ECP PWR switch, you gonna feel some nice G-forceses pushing you into a car seat! In no way this car handles like BMW, you probably will have to go into GS450h with its adjustable suspension. But its takes the best from luxury and performance and handles in snow even better than our Highlander.

Regarding MB, those are great looking cars, but the reliability records from last couple of years is terrible (I'm not even going to mention them being at dead last #36 in CR cause we don't care about that magazine, right? )

aldousmh

For the BMW in Kuwait i went to the dealer and checked series 5 and 3 and X5 their prices is crazy and the option is not acceptable for adding entertainment it cost 8000 $ i felt they are steeling me so i hated BMW and the dealer too not only that i had a friend that owned BMW and when he had small leak in his X5 he took the car for rapier and the dealer told him he need to replace 9 pieces of the engine and it will cost 1500 $ for small leak then he complaint to the BMW in Germany than the dealer called him at home and toled him they will repair his car for free and give him gifts too

for the LS460 it is way too costly for me

Does any one know when the ES 350 2008 will come and what is new coming with it .

LexBob2

The '08 ES350 will be out probably in September or so, at least in the U.S. I doubt if there will be any major changes, since the new model has been on the market for only 1 year.

2007es350

I agree about the smaller cabin of the GS compared to the ES. The handling in the GS was much better to me...but the noisier and rougher ride along with the cramped cabin (both in front and back) prevented me from buying the GS to replace my ES.

twister

Since we are on a topic, 2007es350/ls460 can you let me know how does the handling of LS compares to GS and ES? How about the steering, is it more responsive than ES?

PhilipMSPT

iTrader: (5)

I own an IS350 and LS460L. Sister has a 2GS300, parents have an ES350, and I've rented the 3GS300 before.

The LS handles like a boat. It's not as responsive as you'd like it to be, but it is the smoothest and most plush. You can "feel" how heavy the car is, and definately needs the near 400hp to tug it around. You can also tell that both the steering and brakes are electronically controlled (more than what I'd wish for).

The 3GS is not as responsive as the 2GS (which I can thrash around with more ease). However, it is much much more responsive than the LS. It feels a whole lot lighter too. I have not tried the GS350 yet, but would hypothesize it will be similar to the IS350, as it shares the same platform and engine now. The IS350 is spunky, but the GS350 may not be as much because of the heavier weight and softer suspension.

The ES350 is much nearer to the LS460. It can be pushed around, but it will not be as responsive as the GS. It is as smooth as the LS, just not as plush and luxurious. Don't expect enthusiastic handling response from the ES350. Rear passenger room is better compared to the 3GS and IS. It will appeal to the most amount of people (read non-enthusiasts) that would like the comfort and reliability of a Lexus without the hefty price tag of the LS (and GS), nor the harsher ride and (sometimes unnecessary) performance/handling of the IS.

So, to summarize, from best to worst handling, I would rank it as such:

IS350 better than 2GS300/3GS350 better than 3GS300 better than ES350 better than LS460(L).

2007es350

Coming from the ES350, the LS460 (short wheel base) handles better than the ES. The steering on the LS is heavier and more connected than the ES. The LS handles cloverleaf off-ramps with better confidence and at a faster speed than the ES. I had a chance to drive an ES350 loaner after having my LS for about a month... I was able to confirm that handling-wise, the ES is softer than the LS in turns. Overall, I find that the LS drives more confidently than the ES while also providing a quieter more comfortable ride than the ES. The smoothness, power, and torque of the V8 in the LS is also intoxicating.

Of course, the LS comes at a price that is roughly $20K on top of the ES.

gnm313

When I punched both, I still felt better with the ES as being a smoother accelleration. There is no doubt that the GS has a bigger engine and would beat the ES off the line, but it is a different feel. Definitely nicer. YMMV