es 300 2002 sluggish acceleration
06-24-13, 11:21 AM
#1
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es 300 2002 sluggish acceleration
I am new to this forum. I have a 2002 es 300. The transmission doesn't appear to have any problems. Shifts ok, not rough. However, whenever I accelerate - either at slow speeds or highway speeds - the car is sluggish. It almost feels like their is something pushing back against the car and then it will accelerate a couple seconds and then push back again. I've only had the car for 18 months and it went from 96,000 miles to 121,000 miles. I replaced the starter in the car about 9 months ago and am comfortable with minor repairs, but nothing major. Any ideas as to the cause? If there is a similar thread already, please let me know.
Thanks!
Thanks!
06-24-13, 01:08 PM
#2
well. its not a sports car.
define sluggish. whats your time 0-60mph? measure and look up factory specs.
on a side note are you familiar with learning feature of transmission on your car? if no look it up, might explain some of the behavior.
define sluggish. whats your time 0-60mph? measure and look up factory specs.
on a side note are you familiar with learning feature of transmission on your car? if no look it up, might explain some of the behavior.
I am new to this forum. I have a 2002 es 300. The transmission doesn't appear to have any problems. Shifts ok, not rough. However, whenever I accelerate - either at slow speeds or highway speeds - the car is sluggish. It almost feels like their is something pushing back against the car and then it will accelerate a couple seconds and then push back again. I've only had the car for 18 months and it went from 96,000 miles to 121,000 miles. I replaced the starter in the car about 9 months ago and am comfortable with minor repairs, but nothing major. Any ideas as to the cause? If there is a similar thread already, please let me know.
Thanks!
Thanks!
06-24-13, 01:19 PM
#3
Disconnect the battery terminals for about 60 seconds, and reconnect.
Start it up and it will accelerate like a beauty --the ECU will adjust to your driving style
Also I like to put it in "4" insteads of D --Drive for quicker acceleration, higher RPM's, etc. For when getting on highways, etc. (Then I go back to D of course)
If mechanical, has the Tranny fluid been flushed and changed yet? It is need at 100k miles. Have that inspected and performed if neccessary. Also oil changes need to be performed regulary obviously.
Start it up and it will accelerate like a beauty --the ECU will adjust to your driving style
Also I like to put it in "4" insteads of D --Drive for quicker acceleration, higher RPM's, etc. For when getting on highways, etc. (Then I go back to D of course)
If mechanical, has the Tranny fluid been flushed and changed yet? It is need at 100k miles. Have that inspected and performed if neccessary. Also oil changes need to be performed regulary obviously.
06-25-13, 09:27 AM
#4
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Thanks so much for the replies! I'll try disconnecting the battery and see if that helps. I think it had the transmission flush right before I got the car, but I'll re-check.
I'll also check what the 0-60 time is and see if its far off.
I'll also check what the 0-60 time is and see if its far off.
06-26-13, 07:08 PM
#6
Driver School Candidate
the car is sluggish. It almost feels like their is something pushing back against the car and then it will accelerate a couple seconds and then push back again.
06-26-13, 08:06 PM
#7
Driver School Candidate
on a side note are you familiar with learning feature of transmission on your car?.
Trending Topics
06-27-13, 08:04 PM
#8
Driver School Candidate
02 - 05 Transmission Problems
Wow. I just found out the bad history of the 2002 - 2006 Lexus ES 300 transmission
So many owners have issues with it's hesitation during acceleration.
The LA Times writes the following . . . " . . .The 2002-2006 ES models would become the target of lawsuits, federal safety investigations and hundreds of consumer complaints, including claims of 49 injuries.
The article says that Toyota knew about the problems before they released the car for sale.
I also see a lot of complaints concerning the rough shifting of the transmisison.
But many owners indicate the the pros of the car out weigh the cons.
So many owners have issues with it's hesitation during acceleration.
The LA Times writes the following . . . " . . .The 2002-2006 ES models would become the target of lawsuits, federal safety investigations and hundreds of consumer complaints, including claims of 49 injuries.
The article says that Toyota knew about the problems before they released the car for sale.
I also see a lot of complaints concerning the rough shifting of the transmisison.
But many owners indicate the the pros of the car out weigh the cons.
The following users liked this post:
Jenebieve (09-21-23)
06-28-13, 07:05 AM
#10
Lexus Test Driver
Wow. I just found out the bad history of the 2002 - 2006 Lexus ES 300 transmission
So many owners have issues with it's hesitation during acceleration.
The LA Times writes the following . . . " . . .The 2002-2006 ES models would become the target of lawsuits, federal safety investigations and hundreds of consumer complaints, including claims of 49 injuries.
The article says that Toyota knew about the problems before they released the car for sale.
I also see a lot of complaints concerning the rough shifting of the transmisison.
But many owners indicate the the pros of the car out weigh the cons.
So many owners have issues with it's hesitation during acceleration.
The LA Times writes the following . . . " . . .The 2002-2006 ES models would become the target of lawsuits, federal safety investigations and hundreds of consumer complaints, including claims of 49 injuries.
The article says that Toyota knew about the problems before they released the car for sale.
I also see a lot of complaints concerning the rough shifting of the transmisison.
But many owners indicate the the pros of the car out weigh the cons.
You have to think about the number of ES' Lexus sold during those years, and then look at how many people complained.
This is only internet amplification. There are hundreds of thousands of people completely satisfied with the way it shifts.
The following users liked this post:
Jenebieve (09-21-23)
06-28-13, 07:17 AM
#11
Lexus Test Driver
Today, hardly any cars have DBW lag and you are right they are likely as fast as a regular cable. But they can only react as fast as your leg can press down on the pedal.
There are many advantages to DBW, the only downside that I can think of which really isn't a concern nowadays is lag.
06-28-13, 07:59 AM
#12
from GOOGLE:
Computer Transmission Shift Adaptive Relearning
Many transmissions produced today are adaptive, or programmable. On these transmissions, the timing of the release and application of elements (clutch packs and bands) is controlled by the transmission control module (a microprocessor). As the transmission shifts gears, one element is released as another is applied. If too much time occurs between the release of one element and the application of the next, a ‘rev up’ of the engine will occur during the shift. If too little time occurs between the release of one element and the application of the next, a ‘bind up’ of the transmission will occur.
The processor adjusts the timing values as the vehicle is driven, seeking to achieve the ideal shift parameters. This adjustment of timing values, known as ‘learning’ or ‘adapting’ occurs over a period of time while driving. The transmission controller never reaches a perfect adaptation value, because changes trigger constant adaptation. These changes include the driving habits of the operator, changes in driving conditions, and wear within the transmission.
Adaptives and Fail Safe on Mercedes Benz
Mercedes Benz transmissions have a totally unique method of controlling the shift valves and solenoids, and specialized equipment is required to relearn the shift adaptives. If a fault code is set the computer may put the transmission into fail safe, which means that the signal that energises the solenoids is usually cut. When a vehicle goes into fail safe, it usually puts the vehicle into either 2nd or 3rd gear, and prevents it from shifting. It will still go forward and reverse. On a Mercedes, however, when the solenoid power is cut off, the transmission stays in its current gear, regardless of which gear that is. It will remain in that gear even if the engine is shut off and restarted. This can be of benefit if the transmission goes into fail safe while on a highway many miles from a service facility, as it will be easier to maintain highway speeds in your current gear.
Lexus and Toyota Transmission Shift Learning Process
In some cases, the learning process of the transmission controller is slow to compensate for a more drastic change in the shift characteristics. This can occur during a fluid change if characteristics of the new fluid such as viscosity and lubricity vary greatly from the old fluid. We have seen this occur in the newer Toyota transmissions that come in the Camry, Highlander and Solara. The Lexus models include the ES300 RX300 and RX330. These transmissions are very sensitive and may operate undesirably after a transmission fluid change. The failure of the controller to properly adapt may cause gear slipping or binding during a shift. If the transmission fluid needs replacement, it should only be replaced using genuine Toyota fluid and only 3 quarts at a time, allowing a couple days of driving between changes. If major work is done on these transmissions, it may be necessary to reprogram the transmission controller using specialized scanning tools and software.
Transmission Adaptive Parameter Fault Codes
Over time, some transmissions may reach the limit of their adaptive parameters. While usually unobserved by the driver, the transmission control module may determine that an error has occurred, and produce an error code. This is quite common on the Buick Lesabre and Regal, the Chevy Impala, Lumina, and Monte Carlo, and the Pontiac Bonneville and Grand Prix models. The BMW series vehicles with the ZF5HP24 and ZF5HP30 transmissions are also susceptible to these fault codes, because the controller can no longer compensate for wear within hydraulic circuits or clutch packs.
On these vehicles and many others, this problem is caused by the calibration springs within the transmission. Springs under constant tension fatigue over time and lose a portion of their value, just like a worn out mattress. Replacing the springs can be done without removing the transmission, and usually restores proper function. The spring kit for BMW transmissions is made by ZF of Germany, and is called ‘Life 2’. Other vehicles can be upgraded using spring kits such as the one for the GM 4T65-E transmission made by TransGo.
Many transmissions produced today are adaptive, or programmable. On these transmissions, the timing of the release and application of elements (clutch packs and bands) is controlled by the transmission control module (a microprocessor). As the transmission shifts gears, one element is released as another is applied. If too much time occurs between the release of one element and the application of the next, a ‘rev up’ of the engine will occur during the shift. If too little time occurs between the release of one element and the application of the next, a ‘bind up’ of the transmission will occur.
The processor adjusts the timing values as the vehicle is driven, seeking to achieve the ideal shift parameters. This adjustment of timing values, known as ‘learning’ or ‘adapting’ occurs over a period of time while driving. The transmission controller never reaches a perfect adaptation value, because changes trigger constant adaptation. These changes include the driving habits of the operator, changes in driving conditions, and wear within the transmission.
Adaptives and Fail Safe on Mercedes Benz
Mercedes Benz transmissions have a totally unique method of controlling the shift valves and solenoids, and specialized equipment is required to relearn the shift adaptives. If a fault code is set the computer may put the transmission into fail safe, which means that the signal that energises the solenoids is usually cut. When a vehicle goes into fail safe, it usually puts the vehicle into either 2nd or 3rd gear, and prevents it from shifting. It will still go forward and reverse. On a Mercedes, however, when the solenoid power is cut off, the transmission stays in its current gear, regardless of which gear that is. It will remain in that gear even if the engine is shut off and restarted. This can be of benefit if the transmission goes into fail safe while on a highway many miles from a service facility, as it will be easier to maintain highway speeds in your current gear.
Lexus and Toyota Transmission Shift Learning Process
In some cases, the learning process of the transmission controller is slow to compensate for a more drastic change in the shift characteristics. This can occur during a fluid change if characteristics of the new fluid such as viscosity and lubricity vary greatly from the old fluid. We have seen this occur in the newer Toyota transmissions that come in the Camry, Highlander and Solara. The Lexus models include the ES300 RX300 and RX330. These transmissions are very sensitive and may operate undesirably after a transmission fluid change. The failure of the controller to properly adapt may cause gear slipping or binding during a shift. If the transmission fluid needs replacement, it should only be replaced using genuine Toyota fluid and only 3 quarts at a time, allowing a couple days of driving between changes. If major work is done on these transmissions, it may be necessary to reprogram the transmission controller using specialized scanning tools and software.
Transmission Adaptive Parameter Fault Codes
Over time, some transmissions may reach the limit of their adaptive parameters. While usually unobserved by the driver, the transmission control module may determine that an error has occurred, and produce an error code. This is quite common on the Buick Lesabre and Regal, the Chevy Impala, Lumina, and Monte Carlo, and the Pontiac Bonneville and Grand Prix models. The BMW series vehicles with the ZF5HP24 and ZF5HP30 transmissions are also susceptible to these fault codes, because the controller can no longer compensate for wear within hydraulic circuits or clutch packs.
On these vehicles and many others, this problem is caused by the calibration springs within the transmission. Springs under constant tension fatigue over time and lose a portion of their value, just like a worn out mattress. Replacing the springs can be done without removing the transmission, and usually restores proper function. The spring kit for BMW transmissions is made by ZF of Germany, and is called ‘Life 2’. Other vehicles can be upgraded using spring kits such as the one for the GM 4T65-E transmission made by TransGo.
06-29-13, 06:31 AM
#14
Driver School Candidate
You have to think about the number of ES' Lexus sold during those years, and then look at how many people complained.
The US governement came extremely close to grouping these cars in with the Toyota recall for the "sudden acceleration" . . . but backed off.
I can understand why people would be dissatisfied with rough shifting.
I have a 96 Camry that shifts more smoothly than my 04 Lexus.
It doesn't bother me because I understand that this is the way the car operates.
I might have a different attitude if I bought a brand new 04 Lexus and it shifted roughly.
Last edited by coffee4000; 06-29-13 at 07:48 AM.