AZGS400

My GS4 is getting the radio replaced because of the display problem. The dealer gave me a loaner 02 ES300 .

I am not impressed. No comparison as far as handling, ride quality, power to the GS400.

Does the ES300 weight more than the GS4? I felt like I was driving a big underpowered boat. It does have that big car feeling.

The steering feels tighter than the GS. Almost like it is low on fluid.

I still have the stock suspension on my car. I thought the handling could use improvment on the GS4 . But the ES300 suspension is pretty bad. Makes my GS4 handle like a BMW . I could hear road noise, and it rocks like a boat. Not the carpet ride feeling like the GS4.

As far has power, well it definately is not as responsive as the V8 in the GS4. The transmission is not silky smooth especially when down shifting.

The only think I liked better than the GS400 is the interiour design and the seats are tad more comfortable. The GS400 interiour dash looks pretty plain.

Couldn't believe this was Lexus I was driving. It's ugly as far as appearance. But that is subjective call. I wanted to get an LS400/LS430 but they didn't have any left for loaners. I wonder how the LS400 drives?

EGainer

ls is not usually offered as a loaner car. usually it's an es300 or an rx300. i don't know what kind of es you were driving, but there must be something wrong with it. all those things that you described were not at all like the one i drove....

the power wouldn't be the same since the engine is different, but the suspension on the es is very nice i think. and it is very quiet...

zexen

hey azgs400... there's quite a difference between a 3.0L V6 adn a 4.0L V8... you have a lot more power than the ES300. the suspension on the ES's are really nice... i don't know what was with that one if you could hear the road... unless the road was cracking all over the place. the ES is a real quiet car... the weight should be less, since the engine is smaller. the trans was probably still not broken in all the way since it was an '02. just my $.02.

Dema

You are trying to compare different cars. All your feelings are absolutely right. I have the same impresion when switch from E430 to ES300. However, I love my ES300 to much. Simple ES300 isn't your class car and nothing is wrong with that.

Nabeel

I like apples better than oranges....

DesertRat

I don't think you can really compare an ES to a GS with much validity. Having said that, I have driven a 2002 ES and it felt like a boat! It reminded me of the old-fashioned, bloated American luxury cars. Also, I don't see what is so great about the interior. I find it very gimmicky, lacking the simple elegance of my '96 ES and later model GS cars.

I think Lexus took a look at their lineup, decided they needed a car for "bluehairs", then decided that car would be the ES.

XenonES3

yo...you sure you were drivin' an ES?

Sure the ES 'may not be as great' as your GS400 but it has a fantastic ride. I pushed the helloutta an 02 ES loaner, taking 90 degree turns at 60 mph, squealing the crap outta the tires, doing everything I wouldn't do to my own car..heheh...and it left me very impressed.

I nailed some horrible railroad tracks at 45 mph which normally causes a huge shudder in cars I've taken over it (which include: 95 ES300, 02 maxima, 01 BMW M5, 96 Caravan, 01 Sienna, 02 altima v6, 01 jaguar s-type 4.0, 00 jaguar x-type 2.5, 99 Civic si, 02 rsx type-s, 01 honda s2000, just to name a few. ) but the ES just glided over it!!!!!!...therefore, I don't agree with you on the comment about the poor ride

WILB3

Interesting comparisons- though its crazy to compare the two.

fog80

2002 es really didnt impress me either...not for 30,000 dollars.

i really think the es went down after '96.

lexusk8

I just came back from my first CL meet in NYC-Brooklyn, and being an ES owner for 6 yrs so far, I was mesmerized by the GS's at the meet, both the stock and spiffed up kind. On my way to the meet, I followed a fellow GS'er who's responsible for the meet, and even though his ride is modded to the max, there's no way I could keep up with it (I was generally 4-5 car lengths away on a straightaway, but it was raining all day). I owe it to the GS model for its sporty handling and responsivenss, and I definitely owe it to the ES for its comfort level and ease of control. In any case, I don't mind if I see someone on the road taking it easy on an ES, but I feel delighted when I see someone greatly utilizes the power of a GS.

kreativ

Outside of subjective assessments of body design, care to explain how a '96 tops an '02 for luxury car value in the $30K range?

meZoom!

well i also agree with that quote, i cant speak for fog80, but the 92-96 ES to me was a great car for its time, and it still is. i've never driven an 02 ES, but judging from what AZGS400 said, my 95 is nothing like the 02. its very responsive, feels extremely light, relatively quick (more like 'zippy') and steers extremely well. road noise doesnt really bother me, as i dont really hear much. i can admit that the term luxury doesnt really come to mind when describing the earlier version ES, but it sure is an easy to drive and sorta fun to drive car. the funny thing is, AZGS400 liked the ES interior, while i thought the 02 es interior is just an updated version of my 95...simple, clean, and so very "normal" for a luxury car.

SW03ES

I can relate trust me.

My father has a 98 LS400, it has a fantastic ride and is so quiet you could hear a pin drop. It has smazing silent power. Originally when I decided that I wanted to do the whole Lexus thing, I decided thats what I wanted, a 99 or 00 LS400. Looking into them though, the leases just weren't going to work out on the used model, and since I had to lease for the tax writeoff for my business, I decided I needed to keep my sights on new cars. It came down to a mirage of vehicles, here they are and my thoughts on each:

Lexus GS300- Very nice, but the price climbed close to $50k when I added the options I really wanted like the Mark Levinson stereo and the nav system, also the design while great looking is aging and is ripe for redesign. Plus the ride seemed firmer and the car less removed from the road than other Lexuses I had driven. Not surprising or bad seeing the car is supposed to compete with BMW, but again I wasn't looking for sport. Plus the indigloish gauges bothered me, as did the lack of a trip computer which should be availiable in a car of this price.

Lexus GS300 Sport Design- Same issues as the normal GS3 plus a somewhat stiffer ride (not what I was looking for)

BMW 330i- Way too sporty for me, engine note loud, way too small

BMW 530i- Again, same as the GS3 its a great car but the price gets up there way too fast, plus I was concerned about some of the reliablility issues, and again its ripe for redesign.

Mercedes Benz C320- Didn't even drive it, as soon as I sat in it I knew it wasn't for me.

Jaguar X Type- Again, didn't even drive it once I sat in it.

Jaguar S Type- Again, didnt even drive it once I sat in it. Low interior quality for the price, and the interior is CRAMPED for the size car it is.

Acura TL- What a fantastic car for the price, I could of leased one of these for $400 a month and it was awful tempting, not nearly as well built or as luxurious as the ES but again, it was $10k cheaper.

Acura RL- Ripe for redesign, otherwise competent.

Infiniti I35- Not much of a car, odd looking and smallish on the outside, ugly and misshapen on the inside with horrible fake wood, rode poorly with lots of road noise.

Infiniti G35- Really a cool car, but like the 3 series too sporty for me, but I would definately reccomend anyone looking at an IS300 or a 3 series, drive this baby first.

The car I was trying to get closest to was the LS, so after driving each of these cars, I drove dad's LS. The one that came the closest was no question the ES300. Its just as quiet (in fact, it has less wind noise) and almost as smooth (I'm hoping once I replace the horrible Potenzas it'll be closer) plus the interior was nicer than the interior of anything else I'd driven. The exterior styling took some getting used to for sure, but now I like it. It really does grow on you.

What it came down to for me was a three car lineup, the ES300, the GS300 and the Acura TL. So I went and borrowed each one for a day. The TL is really a nice car, and the price is fantastic but it lacks things like automatic headlights and a trip computer that would really bother me day in and day out. Plus, the dashboard is low which is something I'm not used to. Plus, again it was ripe for redesign. It was hard, but I struck the TL from my list. Mext I had the GS300 and I really did like it. It has a little more of an edge than the other cars, which can be a good thing, but I found the wind noise a little undesirable, and again there was a price issue. Then I drove the ES300 and it really did fit the bill. It has nowhere near the pickup of the V8 cars, but again I'm coming from an Explorer so it'll be just fine. I found the interior better than the GS also. It came down to a decision based on lease payments.

The TL was going to cost me about $450, the ES $550 and the GS $650. I had definately decided that it was worth the extra $100 to have the ES over the TL, and was wondering why I was having trouble making the same decision about the GS. It turns out that it was because the ES had a lot of features I wanted the TL didnt have, and it was worth it to me to spend the extra 100 bucks. With the GS, there were no such features. The GS3 has nothing the ES doesn't have, in fact the ES has some features the GS doesnt have, including more space etc. All the GS really had going for it was that it was RWD (which I prefer), it was a little quicker, and it was higher up the totem pole. So I decided happily that the ES was the car no doubt, and I would see what the new GS and LS has for me when my lease is up in 3 years.

One thing you have to remember is your ES was a loaner, and it probably had those horrible Potenza tires. It undoubtedly had some miles on it, and you can bet they were hard miles. Test drive a new one with the Toyos or the Michelins and see what you think.