AMIRZA786

As I've mentioned in previous posts, I've been helping one of my brother in laws find and purchase a Hyundai Ioniq 5. It's been quite a journey. At the same time, he has been separately talking to a Toyota dealership looking at the 2022 Sienna Hybrid in case he is not able to get an Ioniq 5. This evening he called me to give me an update.

First on the Ioniq 5:

He told me the sales guy he has been working with for the last few months called him the other day and told him they would have one in next week. $6K over MSRP. He was fine with that, but he found out that the newly signed tax credit is longer applicable to the Ioniq. So he tried to negotiate the ADM down, no go.

The 2022 Toyota Sienna Hybrid:

Today the Toyota sales guy called him and said they had one available that just came in, the color and trim he wanted. He had been negotiating back and forth for a couple of weeks, he got them down to $5K (from $8K) over MSRP. The sales guy told him to come down and get it quickly, and then casually added "my manager said $10k over MSRP". My brother in law said he gasped, then told him that they had negotiated already and didn't understand the sudden price increase, but the sales guy kept telling him that's it's his managers decision and the price was final. So my brother in law told him to let him think about it.

I asked my brother in law what he was going to do, and he told me he already did it. I asked him if he bought the Sienna (which would be very unlike my brother in law), and he said no. He told me he pulled out his laptop, went to Tesla's website and ordered a Model 3 AWD, which the estimated delivery date to his house in October. The whole order process took about 10 minutes, most it fighting over the color with his wife.

The lesson here? Two manufacturers just lost another customer to Tesla because of the very antiquated inefficient dealership model that needs to disappear into history

swajames

Absolutely right, at some point all those poor dealership behaviors are going to come home to roost. Customers won’t forget. Tesla does stupid stuff too, but it’s all up front and you generally know what you’re getting. Hard to feel sympathy for a dealer promising one particular deal and reneging on it when the time to get the deal done comes along

Motorola

Dealerships can be scumbags, but I don't see this as a dealership problem, this is 100% a supply problem. Tesla can guarantee your car at its price because they're able to make lots of them as they've established a robust supply chain for batteries. Can't really say the same about any other mainstream OEM vehicle on the market now.

Prior to the supply issue, Tesla's fixed price policy was actually seen as a detriment because dealerships back then would lay cash on the hood or sweeten lease deals just to get people into their cars.

Margate330

Yeah, no honor in that.
If you give a man your word it has to be solid.

I couldn't agree more.
And another thing, we are comparing buying a car from in stock inventory that is scarce and high demand vs waiting.
There's another side to this and I am afraid many struggling dealerships will close the doors and not because their ripping off customer days are done but because they have no cars to sell and have to make ever penny they can on the few cars they have.
The VW dealer I drove by the other day had a grand total of 5 new cars to sell, all in the showroom and parking lot up front was empty.

In the back they had rows and rows to the end of the block of lease vehicles 2-3 years old/
I dont know how they can keep the doors open.

PS- I am happy for your brother's success on the new tesla tho, just dropping some ideas.

patgilm

I would hate to have to buy a car right now. Stories like that get my blood boiling and I just refuse to play that game. People will remember how they are treated when they need a car in the future.

AMIRZA786

He is in that absolutely needs a car camp. His 2010 Honda Odyssey is at 220k and is giving him problems. It's at that point where fixing it no longer makes financial sense. Tesla was the only manufacturer with no hassle buying and delivery. Sorry guys, dealerships have always sucked. Blaming it on shortages just doesn't pass the smell test

Blaze876

iTrader: (1)

AFAIK there are many dealerships that will allow you to order at MSRP and you wait a month or 2 for your order to come in. Did he try that with Hyundai or Toyota?

mbarron37

Agreed. The dealers that add market adjustments are taking advantage of the situation. Selling at sticker is no problem, but tacking on many thousands of dollars above MSRP is screwing the customer.

We are in a bad spot now, with very low inventory. I hope that changes soon. Dealers are generally scummy, I applaud those selling at sticker. Those are the dealers to remember.

AMIRZA786

Way ahead of you. I called several Hyundai dealership in both NorCal and SoCal, and my brother in law spoke to several different Toyota dealerships, the one I referred to in this post had the lowest ADM ($5K vs $8K everyone else). I have over 30 years of buying experience and I would consider myself somewhat of an expert in dealership haggling, my brother in law has even more experience than me being 10 years my senior. All in all between the two of us we wasted 2 months and many hours on the phone, emailing and texting. I can say that as of today I am officially done with buying from a dealership. Just like my last purchase, my next purchase will be 100 percent online

AMIRZA786

As you read in the very first post, my brother in law was willing to pay above MSRP. Scummy doesn't even begin to describe dealerships. And we talked to many dealerships, we just happened to narrow down to the ones with lower ADM. Lots of time wasted "haggling". For now on I'll just leave haggling to others, I was converted to online sales from my last car purchase, now so is my brother in law who literally was able to order a Model 3 and finance it in 10 minutes.

I would file a complaint with Hyundai and Toyota corporate for all the time we wasted, but all I'll get is crickets

Striker223

I'm just eagerly awaiting the coming crash so I can move up a few tiers with my cars lol! Can't wait for the repos and general price reductions

AMIRZA786

Unfortunately (or fortunately for me ), there's not going to be a big crash, at least for now. We are in the worst of the recession. For the economy to take the dip you are referring to unemployment would need to be high and the housing market would need to be underwater. I will predict one thing though, the price of ICE vehicles will definitely crash, that might benefit you

LeX2K

Massive drop in sales is being blamed on supply chain because of course.

The only thing keeping prices up on ICE cars is lack of EV volume.

AMIRZA786

Definitely. My brother in law didn't have to wait long for a Sienna, that was available pretty quickly. What took so long was him looking for the lowest ADM and trying to negotiate it down. As far as the Hyundai Ioniq 5, that is in such huge demand that in two months we only came across two, which were gone before he could react. The only reason he didn't buy it this time was because it lost the EV credit and the dealer wouldn't budge on ADM. Anyway, Hyundai and Toyotas loss was Tesla's gain. My brother in law is one of those extremely loyal customers that both Hyundai and Toyota lost

1111GS

yeah some are crazy for a quick gain. I ordered my mb and at the last minute when the car was coming, they switched and dropped a few things and added adjustment. Screw them. They wouldn’t honor what they agreed in emails. I guess they had someone willing to take it for more profit.