Toyota promises a next-generation Land Cruiser is on its way
04-22-19, 10:57 PM
#1
Toyota promises a next-generation Land Cruiser is on its way
New body-on-frame SUV expected to go all V6 in the U.S.
On sale since the 2008 model year and facelifted twice in the interim, the Toyota Land Cruiser has lately begun rolling out the special editions. Last year we got the 2019 Lexus LX Inspiration, this year we got the 2020 Land Cruiser Heritage Edition. This likely means a changing of the model guard is close, the 300-Series Land Cruiser on the horizon to replace the current 200-Series. When Motor Authority asked Toyota SVP Bill Fay about the U.S. getting the next generation, Fay replied, "We are fully committed to the Land Cruiser for the foreseeable future."
The reason for the question could have been Land Cruiser sales figures for the past 14 years, when the model never cleared 5,000 units. The swankier Lexus LX sibling sells in greater numbers, but even lumping the two trucks, they've crested 10,000 sales just twice since 2005. On top of that, two of the largest regional markets for the Land Cruiser are Australia and the Middle East, which have different regulatory regimes, and the 2019 Highlander has a three-row option.
Why carry on with the Land Cruiser here? Fay told MA the body-on-frame bruiser is a "heritage vehicle," a staple in the U.S. lineup since 1958.
But the Cruiser that comes next is expected to LS-ify its powertrain formula, which means getting rid of V8s for V6s. The 5.7-liter V8 with 381 horsepower, 401 pound-feet of torque, and an EPA rating of 15 miles per gallon combined should go away. The 3.5-liter twin-turbo V6 in the Lexus LS 500 gets the nod to take its place, as the Land Cruiser make concessions to fuel economy and emissions standards. A poster on a forum said it's possible that a Dynamic Force version of that engine might appear. As is, that engine makes 416 hp and 442 lb-ft in the luxury sedan and is mated to a 10-speed automatic, the same transmission said to replace the current eight-speed in the Land Cruiser. Automotive mediums predict a hybridCruiser, too, potentially with the same 3.5-liter naturally aspirated V6 and 10-speed auto in the LS hybrid, putting out 354 combined horsepower in the sedan.
Because there are so many Land Cruiser versions around the world, it's impossible to say whether V8 options will die globally. Land Cruiser fans, either through desperation or good intel, say that isn't the case. For instance, another forum poster said the 3.5-liter TT V6 and NA V6 would replace two V8s and a V6 we don't get here, but that the "Top V8 will get a new V8 not replaced with 3.5 V6." Diesel's certain to live on overseas as well, and with a Toyota engineer once stating that the Land Cruiser was designed to survive 25 years of of service in a Third World country, simple and robust options must remain on the menu. An Australian report said the "more agricultural 70 Series ... Land Cruiser ute, wagon and TroopCarrier derivatives are likely to solider on unchanged for the foreseeable future."
A Japanese report laid out dimensions for the 300 Series, which barely deviate from the current truck. The new ladder-frame chassis is said to underpin an SUV that's 194.8 inches long, 77.9 inches wide, and 75.6 inches high, on a 112.2-inch wheelbase. That means a vehicle just 1.6 inches taller and 0.1 inches shorter in length than the one we have now.
Sleeker lines, LED headlights, a lot more technology, and more differentiation between the Land Cruiser and the LX are said to be coming. Toyota Safety Sense and a new infotainment system seem a given, perhaps with the 12.3-inch screen. We could get a preview of the model at this year's Tokyo Motor Show. Production is said to commence for the Land Cruiser in mid-2020 as a 2021 model year, the LX following a year later in 2022.
The reason for the question could have been Land Cruiser sales figures for the past 14 years, when the model never cleared 5,000 units. The swankier Lexus LX sibling sells in greater numbers, but even lumping the two trucks, they've crested 10,000 sales just twice since 2005. On top of that, two of the largest regional markets for the Land Cruiser are Australia and the Middle East, which have different regulatory regimes, and the 2019 Highlander has a three-row option.
Why carry on with the Land Cruiser here? Fay told MA the body-on-frame bruiser is a "heritage vehicle," a staple in the U.S. lineup since 1958.
But the Cruiser that comes next is expected to LS-ify its powertrain formula, which means getting rid of V8s for V6s. The 5.7-liter V8 with 381 horsepower, 401 pound-feet of torque, and an EPA rating of 15 miles per gallon combined should go away. The 3.5-liter twin-turbo V6 in the Lexus LS 500 gets the nod to take its place, as the Land Cruiser make concessions to fuel economy and emissions standards. A poster on a forum said it's possible that a Dynamic Force version of that engine might appear. As is, that engine makes 416 hp and 442 lb-ft in the luxury sedan and is mated to a 10-speed automatic, the same transmission said to replace the current eight-speed in the Land Cruiser. Automotive mediums predict a hybridCruiser, too, potentially with the same 3.5-liter naturally aspirated V6 and 10-speed auto in the LS hybrid, putting out 354 combined horsepower in the sedan.
Because there are so many Land Cruiser versions around the world, it's impossible to say whether V8 options will die globally. Land Cruiser fans, either through desperation or good intel, say that isn't the case. For instance, another forum poster said the 3.5-liter TT V6 and NA V6 would replace two V8s and a V6 we don't get here, but that the "Top V8 will get a new V8 not replaced with 3.5 V6." Diesel's certain to live on overseas as well, and with a Toyota engineer once stating that the Land Cruiser was designed to survive 25 years of of service in a Third World country, simple and robust options must remain on the menu. An Australian report said the "more agricultural 70 Series ... Land Cruiser ute, wagon and TroopCarrier derivatives are likely to solider on unchanged for the foreseeable future."
A Japanese report laid out dimensions for the 300 Series, which barely deviate from the current truck. The new ladder-frame chassis is said to underpin an SUV that's 194.8 inches long, 77.9 inches wide, and 75.6 inches high, on a 112.2-inch wheelbase. That means a vehicle just 1.6 inches taller and 0.1 inches shorter in length than the one we have now.
Sleeker lines, LED headlights, a lot more technology, and more differentiation between the Land Cruiser and the LX are said to be coming. Toyota Safety Sense and a new infotainment system seem a given, perhaps with the 12.3-inch screen. We could get a preview of the model at this year's Tokyo Motor Show. Production is said to commence for the Land Cruiser in mid-2020 as a 2021 model year, the LX following a year later in 2022.
04-23-19, 07:38 AM
#3
Lexus Fanatic
Ruh roh, V6.....imho that's risky because Land Cruiser is a gold standard throughout the world. Toyota could go out of business and someone would pay hundreds of millions of dollars for the name. I suspect it's a bit of exaggeration but we've all heard the stories of when BMWs and Mercedes and Range Rovers are all DOA from the heat, Land Cruisers dance merrily through the 140F Dubai desert chasing unicorns and glass camels...
04-23-19, 08:42 AM
#5
That's the thing, I don't think it wants to compete with the GLS. Which I'm sure Lexus dealers are upset about. MB dealers have enjoyed GL/GLS for 10+ years now, Audi Q7 (I know it's a little smaller), and now BMW dealers are getting X7. Lexus still doesn't have a road-focused unibody 3-row to directly compete with this segment.
04-23-19, 08:52 AM
#6
Lexus Fanatic
I saw the new X7 and is it Q8? Yesterday and today. These are vehicles you want to take to Whistler and Killington, They'd be ok driving from LA to Vegas, but in the desert of Dubai, I'll take the 8 cyl Toyota.
04-23-19, 09:24 AM
#7
No doubt the Land Cruiser has its place in the world. Just more and more, it's not in the consumer driveways of America. Reliability and durability are great assets to have in a vehicle, especially in those conditions, but for the 99.9% of use cases for the U.S. consumer, especially in the lease heavy luxury price point, I don't see how the Land Cruiser/LX fit in that equation. You're giving up quite a bit in interior packaging, driving dynamics and fuel economy to be in that space.
Trending Topics
04-23-19, 09:46 AM
#8
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
lol, the new GLS is the 's-class SUV' - more QX80, X7, Escalade - a land cruiser is not in the same market, neither is the lx. land cruiser is a very practical and highly reliable and durable vehicle for someone who drives mainly on rough roads / terrain. that is not much of america which is why it sells in tiny numbers. so in the u.s. it's a rare consumer that actually needs one and/or is willing to pay the high price tag. makes sense that toyota would make a new landcruiser essentially a very updated version of the current ancient product.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
04-23-19, 09:49 AM
#9
Lexus Fanatic
No doubt the Land Cruiser has its place in the world. Just more and more, it's not in the consumer driveways of America. Reliability and durability are great assets to have in a vehicle, especially in those conditions, but for the 99.9% of use cases for the U.S. consumer, especially in the lease heavy luxury price point, I don't see how the Land Cruiser/LX fit in that equation. You're giving up quite a bit in interior packaging, driving dynamics and fuel economy to be in that space.
04-23-19, 09:56 AM
#10
Lead Lap
For a customer who wants a GLS or X7, I doubt lexus LX is the first thing on their mind. The Customize ability, and lease targets alone remove the LX from the running. That being said, I think Lexus might bring that appeal under the crossover design concept they introduced at an autoshow. Its refined, and with the proper powertrain and appointments what they want, but even then that will probably go after the coupe crossover high end market.
The LX is not a bad vehicle at all, its just targeted to a specific demographic, and if your not that demo, its a tough sell.
The LX is not a bad vehicle at all, its just targeted to a specific demographic, and if your not that demo, its a tough sell.
04-23-19, 09:57 AM
#11
Lead Lap
lol, the new GLS is the 's-class SUV' - more QX80, X7, Escalade - a land cruiser is not in the same market, neither is the lx. land cruiser is a very practical and highly reliable and durable vehicle for someone who drives mainly on rough roads / terrain. that is not much of america which is why it sells in tiny numbers. so in the u.s. it's a rare consumer that actually needs one and/or is willing to pay the high price tag. makes sense that toyota would make a new landcruiser essentially a very updated version of the current ancient product.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
04-23-19, 10:17 AM
#12
Pole Position
lol, the new GLS is the 's-class SUV' - more QX80, X7, Escalade - a land cruiser is not in the same market, neither is the lx. land cruiser is a very practical and highly reliable and durable vehicle for someone who drives mainly on rough roads / terrain. that is not much of america which is why it sells in tiny numbers. so in the u.s. it's a rare consumer that actually needs one and/or is willing to pay the high price tag. makes sense that toyota would make a new landcruiser essentially a very updated version of the current ancient product.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
i disagree it 'needs an optional turbo v8'.
04-23-19, 02:02 PM
#13
Pole Position
04-24-19, 05:46 AM
#15
Lexus Fanatic
This got me thinking. Say with a Navigator L, yes, the V6 is a compromise, probably one that makes sense. Does anyone like it? Probably the majority don't care, especially if there's tons of torque and the fuel economy is good.
So the Land Cruiser is at a crossroads. Does it become a Navigator L type of vehicle, luxury, powerful, etc., or does it remain a serious off-road type of vehicle. Or, maybe V6 does not indicate that it's not a serious off-road vehicle. It would just seem that less complexity is needed to survive off-road conditions. Isn't the Ford Raptor going back to a V8?
So the Land Cruiser is at a crossroads. Does it become a Navigator L type of vehicle, luxury, powerful, etc., or does it remain a serious off-road type of vehicle. Or, maybe V6 does not indicate that it's not a serious off-road vehicle. It would just seem that less complexity is needed to survive off-road conditions. Isn't the Ford Raptor going back to a V8?