bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

does anyone else find the huge number of price and product line up changes in the last couple of months bizarre? (and alarming)

they add and then cancel products. they provide free services then charge for them, then free again for some, maybe, for some period of time, maybe, etc. they're raising product prices, then lowering, then raising again...

they're taking deposits on a vehicle that's likely 2 years+ away from being available... seems like a grab for cash flow now.

it's enough to make your head spin.

i WANT tesla to succeed. they've done something amazing and EXTREMELY difficult, not only technically, but with all the competition, lobbyists, oil industry, etc. gunning to crush them.

but their recent behavior looks a lot like panic. i get that they're trying to squeeze all the sales and deliveries they can into Q1 (few more days) with incentives just like other auto makers, but at some point all the thrashing probably isn't helping.

rumor has it tariffs in china (don't know if enacted already) are/will hurt tesla a lot. rumor has it demand has slowed a lot in the u.s. (maybe after a lot of the 3 backlog was fliled). rumor has it the X is all but dead with products announced from mercedes, audi, and bmw, and already out from jaguar, even if they're not as good.

there was a lot of disappointment over the Y being 'just' a tall 3 with a hatch, but i get totally that that's the quickest way for tesla to get it on the market, and manage costs, plus why not, if the 3 is successful then a cuv version should be very successful.

what do you think?

Allen K

iTrader: (4)

On one hand, I appreciate the transparency in pricing (even if it's a moving target). On the other hand, they need to calm things down. China is a short term problem until GF3 is up and running in Shanghai. X and S definitely need a revamp, but I don't think they have the manpower to handle that with their current expansion. I'm also waiting for shares to hit $250 again to pick some up

Toys4RJill

LeX2K

Should just make a single Tesla doom and gloom thread.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

LeX2K

I've never seen an auto company relentlessly attacked at this level, and people opening cheering for the company to fail. And before you say, that's not happening well yes it is I've lost track of how many times people said other auto makers are going to magically march in and put Tesla out of business because reasons.

Tesla had a magnifying glass on them not exactly sure why on some level I think it stems from people fearing change, and their favourite car makers status quo is threatened.

-J-P-L-

I've noticed this too. I also want Tesla to succeed but they need to become stable and predictable with pricing, production, and availability. Elon is too smart to be making these basic business mistakes, let alone his team of people responsible for such things.

I still think Tesla is doing electric right while established brands haven't done the work necessary to be a better ELECTRIC vehicle. Such as platform arcitecture, battery efficiency and longevity, as well as the immense tech inside a Tesla.They're just as much a software company as a car company.

Tesla's are built on a skateboard like power train platform, the proper way to do electric. It seems most other makers are still putting motors under the front hood. Tesla has a front trunk as a result and lower load floor out back.

LeX2K

This is the type of hysterical wording that I take issue with. So Tesla trying to increase cash flow is a "grab for cash" are you purposely trying to make it sound nefarious? If people are willing to put down deposits that is a business angle you pursue it is not some evil "cash grab".

You could have said Tesla is so popular people are willing to put down deposits on cars they won't be able to own for 2+ years, but nope gotta make is seem awful.

coolsaber

Tesla is just smarter then anyone else on the block with the whole deposit thing. Lets be honest here, where have we seen this whole taking deposits for vehicles that havent really been made or is just a concept....Think high end exotic hypercars. With that context, people who pay ridiculous deposits on million dollar vehicles that have not been made are victims of nefarious car companies... Take the concept, dilute it into a economical yet niche product and voila, same idea.

Thankfully most of those in both groups of customers usually end up with their product they put a deposit for...

Tesla maybe making rapid changes day to day, but I cannot figure out in response to what. Most normal companies havent really launched something that would target their bread and butter in great volume. My personal theory is that their loosing their wow factor that people fawned over with their initial launches, and its basically become a normal car company that deals with normal business operations.

Stormwind

it does sound like a cash grab to me, also do you even know how many people actually put down deposits for this 2 year+ away model y? people put down deposits for model 3 because they fell for the cash grab without being told it's years away before they'll get the car. will those people fall for the same cash grab this time around?

LeX2K

Cash grab the term means your only intention is to make money as fast as possible no other purpose in mind. If you think that of Tesla that's fine.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

not sure why you're so upset about this? is it environmental reasons? you have stock? you or people you know work or were laid off from there? my thread was merely to talk about the FACTS of the recent turmoil. i've never seen any company make so many changes of direction in such a short period of time. it is NOT a coherent strategy and does not represent great leadership when you're changing things so often. and musk and his team are no doubt very smart. so what is going on? i believe they're trying like mad to make q1 as good as it can be when it's not looking good. i hope i'm wrong, but the recent big stock slide seems to indicate that. i owned stock until recently and would have held onto it had i not become concerned about the thrashing.

here's why... there's an old saying... pioneers usually end up with arrows in their back. doing some really NEW is HARD and there will always be naysayers. when henry ford got going with the model T i'm sure there were many nay (neigh? lol) sayers, especially in the massive horse and buggies and related businesses. imaging how many blacksmiths were put out of work by henry ford!?

never said it's evil and wasn't being hysterical. and as pointed out, companies like ferrari and others do take deposits long before delivering vehicles too, but i was surprised that tesla's taking deposits on its forthcoming mainstream cuv that won't be available for a couple of years, yes, and yes, it seems to me they want the money now to cover cash flow. already though they've changed the price on the Y since announcing it! not really surprising that the price might change between announcement and launch, but changing what a week or two after announcement seems odd.

not awful, i just think tesla is cash-strapped.

that's exactly what i'd like to illuminate in this thread. my theory is all the rapid changes are to:
- streamline production
- increase revenue
- lower costs
- prioritize availability to easiest sales opportunities

these are all good things but so much change has a whiff of desperation to it.

maybe so, but it's got to be financially viable to keep going and it has massive debt and while q4 was decent (great actually), we'll see what q1 brings in a few days.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

couple of reasons i'm not so sure as many will are:

- people might be willing to wait to see what other models come out in the mean time. the hyundai kona, for example, is shipping or about to ship, for less money. less range too, but at least it's available.
- the Y is more money than the 3
- the 3 was promised at $35K from the beginning... that has basically never materialized and so maybe there's doubt that there's any chance of a Y under say $50k.
- tax rebates have been cut for tesla

Toys4RJill

Omg. The original title was perfect. You also forgot to add in that Tesla stores are going to be closing. So that needs to be added to the title.

coolsaber

Desperation not so much, its got the market cornered. Desperation is a MoviePass like situation. I see it as a strategy to play on their demo. Their also preparing themselves for eventual status quo launches as well.