jwong77

Agreed, the overall design of the new LS seems to lack a "premium-ness" that the S Class has in spades and the 7 Series kind of has (I think its boring myself), and that the previous generations of LS all had in some way or form. Individual details when looked at alone look really nice, but for whatever reason, the whole seems to be less than the sum of its parts.

With that said, it doesn't mean that Toyota/Lexus cannot make a premium looking vehicle, one only has to look over at the gorgeous LC500 to see what a high end vehicle should look like.

Fizzboy7

I think electric is the future for premium sedans. If they can't win the prize based on style and luxury, make it Tesla-like and I think people will immediately come back. The brand has a huge advantage over others just with the name "Lexus" and their short history.

oldcajun

I can't help but think what the LS sales might have been had they built something similar to the Genesis G90. Smooth, quiet, luxurious, conservative style, and Lexus reputation for quality and reliability. The original "relentless pursuit of perfection" was more than a slogan. It meant a car where everything fit, worked, and was durable. If the $75,000 base for the LS500 was for a fully loaded car, things might be different. Match the interior and performance of the S450 for $75,000 with Lexus reliability and you have a viable competitor.

peteharvey

I could tell from 12 months ago on debut that the 5LS is the worst iteration of the past five generations of LS's.
If the 5LS runs on the usual 7-year model cycle, I believe 5LS sales will quickly fall into two digit figures with less than 100 units per month sold in the US.

It's not the sedan [vs SUV body] that is the problem, but the ordinary styling of the 5LS.
Constructively, the 5LS needs an early & major facelift, and an unusally short model cycle - for its own sake.

Benoit

The Daimler "Mercedes" isn't made anymore. The Ford T isn't made anymore. And so on... you get my point. Brand evolve.

Maybe they will produce the UX under the LS name, or maybe calling it the LSX. Many things are possible. But if this car doesn't sell, Lexus will have to stop making it.

I already wrote to Lexus and offered them the idea to rethink the "all brand same face" philosophy. It was to plan, that the predator face would not convince the typical public of the LS range. Especially for this car, they should part from the brand design, and go a specific route. Maybe inspire themselves from the Toyota Century.

Chocolate

I agree that those are underwhelming sales. Overall, though, it's not a big deal to Lexus, as it has a wide range of production models in every major segment. I expect purchase/lease incentives will be increased. Typically, Lexus is close behind the Germans in annual U.S. sales around 300,000 units, with U.S. Toyota sales close to 2.5 million a year.

Johnhav430

I don't know which is right, 97 cu ft or 99 cu ft., but its interior size puts it in competition with a 5 series, not a 7 series. E class, not S class. So now the price is way too high and the powerplant way too underwhelming. Not sure how they missed it so badly on the flagship. And the steering has zero feel. To say it's impossible to have any, try driving a Chevy Malibu or Impala. And apparently the new 3 series has steering feel back after being absent for almost 8 years.

coolsaber

RCF GSF...(fwiw some dealers are sitting on 17s) ;Lexus didnt cancel those name plates and even upped the ante on the RCF with a Track edition. Lexus honestly doesnt have to do much, just cut back production and they should be set.

If this happened on the bread and butter RX/ES/NX lines ring da alarm. Low volume high MSRP top trim models meh

BTW as I stated before, Lexus has alot of inventory on the ground of the 18 LS, buyers market for sureeeee!!

spwolf

Lexus was growing 4.4% last month in the USA, while all the Germans dropped sales, up to 12% drop at Audi.

​​​Future is bright.

Johnhav430

What's the context behind this number, sales, profits, revenue, units, etc Are you telling us to buy low, sell high?

jwong77

Given the poster, the context is anything to make Toyota look better than the German competition. Even if made up, thats how the internet works, no?

peteharvey

Correct.
Mr Spwolf absolutely loves Toyota Motor Corporation products, so take that with a grain of salt.
Toyota Motor Corporation is doing well, but the 5LS model is not - though this thread is about the 5LS sales, and not Toyota sales.

There are many opinions as to why, including: styling, body type, interior space, engine power & refinement, and ride etc.

Keep in mind that after 6 years, the S Class is still selling in 4 digit figures, and there is only 1 year to go before an all new next generation S Class on the all new MRA platform is released - so that puts the nail in the coffin on the SUV sales argument.

The previous four generations of Lexus LS's on debut have always OUTSOLD the pants off the S Class! That puts another nail in the coffin to a number of other silly argument that only the S Class can sell well in the full size luxury sedan class.

The German's entry level engines are just 4 cylinders, yet they still sell so well - hence I don't believe it is Lexus' 3.5 V6 twin turbo engine.

I don't believe that President Akio's move to give Toyota products more inspired styling and more inspired dynamics have faltered the sales too much either - provided the products are not "excessively" sporty; we might have to think again about the 5LS's front mid-engine and its new low center of gravity stance, and the consequences to interior space?

IMO, the current 4RX SUV is beautifully styled, and just as well since the RX is now America's biggest selling luxury motor vehicle!
Hence I don't believe it's the new Lexus signature spindle grille.

I believe it's just the 5LS's one off poor styling on its own.
The two hottest selling generations of 4LS's debuted with an S Class thumping 41,000+ and 35,000+ units in its first full year in 1990 and 2007 respectively, but in both cases, the styling was neat, graceful and smooth - the same can't be said for what a number posters have described as the Infiniti-like lines of the all new 5LS, especially the rear quarter view.

Surely Toyota Motor Corp is smart enough to have a liaison officer continually monitor feedback from ClubLexus Forum...

situman

Do you just randomly show up and make stuff up?

March 1, 2019… Sales of BMW brand vehicles increased 0.2 percent in February 2019 for a total of 23,558

UDel

Exactly, it is just not a very good looking car, it does not look like a Luxury car, does not have the stately appearance of a luxury car. The LS460, while no absolute beauty with its 2013 update at least has a understated stately appearance, I just don't see it in the LS500. It is a shame because Lexus had a home run with the LC500 styling, you would figure some of that would have filtered to the LS500 inside and out yet they went a odd different direction with the LS500. It is like they wanted something more dramatic like a Jag XJ but could not get it to work so it ended up looking more like a stretched Nissan Altima. The interior design is a let down too. Making it 6 cylinder only is just the topper, I just don't see much of a reason for LS460 owners to want to upgrade to the LS500, I think many would see it as a downgrade in some aspects which is never a good thing. S class is a clear upgrade in every way over the last one which is why it sells so well.

Johnhav430

I just was wondering if there was a curious spin. What if say there were a "BBQ eating challenge" at Toyota USA HQ last month, and employees gained on average 4.4% in weight?

I hear you I guess when you say internet, think about all the free products and services YouTubers are getting, based on likes and subscribes? There's even a kid that made what 8 or 12 mil. and he's maybe 8 (I might have this all wrong his name is Ryan and his parents even quit their jobs as a result).

edit ok he is 7, made 22 mil. in revenue (I don't know what income would be) last year, and was the highest paid YouTuber in 2018. He made 11 mil. the year before. Bryce Harper, look out, he's only 7 and making almost your money!